Obsidian (Zerker) Necklace: What Happened to it?

If you took a look back into the old guide about training melee, you'll find quite a few of them recommend a tidy little combination: Beserker Necklace, or enchanted Onyx necklace, and the Toktz-xil-ak, or Obby Sword. For those of you unfamiliar with the combination, the sword is about the accuracy and power of a rune scimitar (if used on stab). However, if combined with the Beserker Necklace, you get a +20% bonus to your strength, for as long as you use an obsidian weapon, in our case the Toktz-xil-ak.

Looks around on guides nowadays, there is barely mention of this useful combination. The GEDB shows how what used to be a great training combination has fallen: The Berserker Necklace is priced at barely over 500k, and falling. The Toktz-xil-ak is price at about 168k, and falling. Now consider that a fury, made also of an onyx gem, a gold bar, a ball of wool, and an onyx enchant spell, is well over 3m. Also consider that the dragon scimitar, a stronger weapon than the Toktz-xil-ak, is priced at a mere 100k in the GE, and can be easily bought at Ape Atoll, while the Toktz-xil-ak both costs more, or takes a lot of work to get in Tokkul.

Now my question for discussion is simple: what happened? What made such a strongly recommended weapon and necklace become so weak now?

NOTE: It has come to my attention while reading the replies, that the Obsidian Mace, Tzhaar-ket-em, gives better attack bonuses. It's crush attack is 62, and is a crush weapon. The sword's stab attack is 47, and slash in the 30s. It is a stab and slash weapon. The mace's strength bonus is also higher, making it's stats preferable over the sword's. What about speed?

The obby mace is a notch slower than the obby sword, 5 vs 6. Might not appear as much, but it's a difference that's adds up. The delay between each attack for the sword is 2.43 seconds, and for 3.04 for the mace. So for instance, in 1 hour of combat itself, the sword will hit 1481 times, and the mace will hit 1184 times. Which means the extra power of the mace must be able to make up for about 300 hits/hour in order to be the best, which is a bit difficult to calculate, but we can deduce.

 

 

 

Obby sword

 

Stab 47

 

Slash 38

 

Crush -2

 

Strength 49

 

 

 

Obby mace

 

Stab -4

 

Slash -4

 

Crush 62

 

Strength 56

 

 

 

Now if we look at how the berserker necklace works by itself: it increases final damage by 20%, NOT strength by 20%. That's why a weak weapon like this can rivalize with the whip. Your combat stats do most of the work, and of the outcome the necklace adds a nice bonus to it. We can't conclude for sure without field calculations but if you deduce, the obby sword's speed most likely makes it the best. Because your stats and the bonus do most of the work, not the weapon, and as such extra speed is preferable. As a side note, the necklace drops all defence by 20, so for instance if you have ~250 defence everywhere, it gets dropped to 230, which is no big deal for high level players. Other side note, because low level players lack good combat stats, the obby mace is probably best for them.

Note the mace is also 50k more expensive, but it's not too big a deal.

Below I will take a look at a few ideas:

[hide=1]To anwser one possible theory: "Perhaps new weapons outperformed the combination?" Whip, I can understand. But what if you're training strength? Surely it can beat the dragon scimitar? Look at this guide: viewtopic.php?t=588556

A quote:

Summary of Weapons (exp/hour, greatest to least)

 

 

 

Toktz-xil-ak - 64,008

 

Dragon Scimitar - 59,712

 

Dragon Longsword - 54,720

 

Dragon Dagger - 51,896

 

Barrelchest Anchor - 49,184

 

Dragon 2h Sword - 40,464

Just look! 4k more xp/hour than a dragon scimitar! Yet...

And is it better than the whip? This might be controversial. I myself would believe it's not, but looking at the above results, it seems possible that it can be. The above test was taken at bloodvelds (not during slayer). Now let's take a look at one of the best slayer guides out there, Zarfot's guide on RSOF (http://forum.[Please Use QuickFind Code].ws?22,23,733,55654062,goto,7). He says 53k slayer xp and hour cannoning mutated bloodvelds. First off, let's assume 2/3 of that was the cannon's work. That accounts for ABOUT 32k of the experience. That was also while using the prayer, superhuman strength. Zarfot states that the prayer makes you 1/12 faster, or 7.5%. Take that away remaining amount. That means it was ABOUT 19k slayer xp/hour without using a cannon or prayer. Multiply that by 4, and you get 76k xp and hour in strength/attack/defence. Ok, that beats the sword, doesn't it? Perhaps not. Remember six things:

1) Zarfot was able to use modern armor, what I mean is bandos armor, dragon boots, etc.

2) That was during a slayer task. Remember the Black Mask's 15% bonus?

3) Zarfot used super sets, while the above guide did not

4) The above guide did not use a rune defender or warrior ring, while Zarfot suggests (and therefore probably used) a warrior or beserker ring and rune defender (or dragonfire shield, or something similar. It still makes an impact).

5) Zarfot used a healing familiar, while the above guide only used food.

6) The cannon fraction is estimated.

So then the question, after reading that wall of text, is, "Are those 6 factors able to make the modern whip 10k xp/hour better than our little combination?" Well I'd place most of my bet on numbers 2, 3, and 6. It's up to you.[/hide]

[hide=2]First, let's assume that we are at bloodvelds, like above. With their just about pathetic attack, and the endless food supplied by Bones to Peachs (or healing familiar if used in conjugation) we can ignore the defence loss.

What about attack? It's only -10, something the rune defender can easily compensate for. Then you could also swap out the sword for the mace, giving almost 20 extra to the weapon's best attack. The mace's better strength also helps compensate.

Lastly, bring some attack or super attack potions.

Overall, the -10 the necklace gives to attack is negligable. It really won't impact your experience.[/hide]

[hide=3]

Berserker/Obsidian Necklace (590K)+Obsidian Sword (154K)/Obsidian Mace (206K)

 

+20% Damage

 

Cost= 744K-796K

 

 

 

 

 

Dragon Scimitar(99K)+Salve Amulet/Salve Amulet (e) (Should cost around 20-50K of supplies to get it)

 

Salve Amulet: 15% Strength and Attack

 

Salve Amulet (e): +20% Strength and Attack

 

Cost=149K

So there you go. If you are fighting the UNDEAD and UNDEAD ONLY, there is a better amulet to wear. It is also cheaper. But how often do you really face the undead for practical purposes? Slayer? DT Skeletons? Only two I can think of. But if you do, drop the obsidian gear and bring the salve ammy (e).[/hide]

I will try to use logic to evaulate any other ideas that come up. But you probably got confused after reading the above, so I will state the discussion question again: "What happened to the Obby Sword and Zerker Necklace"?

Feel free to comment on my above calculations, but if you do, I still prefer if you commented on the main idea.

Thank you for reading.

The abyssal whip on a slayer assignment definitely outkicks the berserker necklace and sword, and the saradomin sword is the new standard of strength training.

Both outkick the berserker necklace and obby sword combination.

Not to mention the price and resale value just aren't worth it when there are better options.

actually, to my best knowledge, your wrong.

obsidian necklace gives +20% to str, but decreases accuracy and defense by 15%, if i remember correctly

actually, to my best knowledge, your wrong.

 

 

 

obsidian necklace gives +20% to str, but decreases accuracy and defense by 15%, if i remember correctly

You're right and wrong.

Strength raised by 7

 

Stab Attack, Slash Attack and Crush Attack reduced by 10

 

Stab Defence, Slash Defence, Crush Defence, Magic Defence and Ranged Defence reduced by 20

 

Increases the amount of damage wearer does when wielding an obsidian melee weapon by 20%

Surely, though, +7 strength makes up for -10 stab attack? The Zerker ring gives what? +2 strength? The warrior ring gives +4 slash. The zerker ring is 2m more expensive.

To the first two posts: Yes, it is true the Saradomin Sword creates a new age in strength training. But it costs roughly 9-10m. This combination costs less than 700-800k. Plus it can be just as effective, done right.

Of course, I do not know if the Beserker Necklace's bonus stacks with that of the black mask. It probably DOESN'T. So your point that whip > obby sword + zerker necklace in slayer is totally valid. That doesn't explain the disappearence though. Plus this combination is half the price. For lower levels, they know how hard it is to come up with 1.5m or so for a whip.

As for resale value, that is part of my point. Why it is so cheap now?

The answer is possibly as simple as lack of knowledge. Before the necklace, obsidian weapons weren't generally viable training options. When the necklace came around, most people never gave it a second glance... I know I didn't.

Does the necklace and black mask stack? Thats my only question, but everyone seems to train strength in different ways, its all about what you can afford at the time.

Does the necklace and black mask stack? Thats my only question, but everyone seems to train strength in different ways, its all about what you can afford at the time.

Why wouldn't it?

Necklace is not head ware.

Does the necklace and black mask stack? Thats my only question, but everyone seems to train strength in different ways, its all about what you can afford at the time.

 

 

 

Why wouldn't it?

 

 

 

Necklace is not head ware.

Does the necklace and black mask stack? Thats my only question, but everyone seems to train strength in different ways, its all about what you can afford at the time.

 

 

 

Why wouldn't it?

 

 

 

Necklace is not head ware.

Neither is a Salve Amulet (e), but that and the Black Mask don't stack.

Its because RS players are too freakin attached to there abbysal whips.I was a big advocate of this new way of training strength when necklace reworking and bracelets were introduced and now whatever chance this method had of becoming widely popular was drained away.

What I find strange is the uncharged necklace is a lot more (3M or so I believe) than the charged necklace, why is that?

the berserker necklace stacks with the black mask. that answers that question.

and if you're buying 1 make sure you get the berserker necklace and not the onyx necklace.

Berserker necklace 655.2k (this is the enchanted version of the onyx necklace)

Onyx necklace 3.5m (unenchanted).

the onyx necklace is only good when enchanted! so dont pay more. :)

and about the combination with the TokTz-Xil-Ak sword, it's a good combination for slayer no doubt about that. is the whip better? they're competitive that's for sure. but certain monsters are better to kill with the stab attack then a slash attack; so getting to know which 1's is helpful. dagannoths are weak to stab for example and all dragons, besides metals, are weak to stab, and others; my suggestion is get this combination and experiment with it.

my experience is it's worth it and better than other weapons in some circumstances. it will surprise you, it surprised me. definately use the stab option. you can get some surprisingly high hits with this weapon with ease.

Since I don't have a gs, or money to waste on the ss, I use obby sword + obby neck. On slayer tasks, it hits almost just as good as the whip/fury/blk mask, that means it probably stacks with the black mask. If it doesn't stack with the black mask(meaning just necklace/sword), having almost as much power as blk mask/fury/whip, then that means it'd be even better than whip outside of slayer, but that's doubtful, so we can conclude it probably stacks.

On some monsters like black dragons and abberant specters, it has trouble hitting well for some reason, I assume it's because they have high stab defence. So I use the whip for those.

I find it a very strange time for a topic like this to pop up, considering obby necklaces are being price manipulated as we speak. Trying to pump up the price even more?

What I find strange is the uncharged necklace is a lot more (3M or so I believe) than the charged necklace, why is that?

It's a GE frozen price

8-) I can confirm that the black mask and obby necklace stack.

Oh btw, you never thought of using the mace+necklace at waterfiends? I hit quite alot of 44s there.

Hey there....that's an old guide of mine haha. Sadly too much stuff comes out all the time for me to have wanted to keep it up.

Anyway, that combo of necklace and sword was useful ONLY for str training and ONLY where defense wasn't a large concern. Now that we have familiars, however, it opens a lot more doors for potential use. We also have the DFS.

The thing is, once you're maxed or if you're not str training, it's really better to just use the whip.

Also, another reason this method's sort of forgotten is that people have gotten used to three major options: godswords, SS, scimitar. It used to be only the scimitar and people were rather bored of it, so they searched around for other ideas.

8-) I can confirm that the black mask and obby necklace stack.

 

 

 

Oh btw, you never thought of using the mace+necklace at waterfiends? I hit quite alot of 44s there.

The only catch is that defense is very important at waterfiends, something which the obby necklace really isn't good at providing since the maul is a 2H weapon. Actually...if the TzHaar-Ket-Em is a one handed weapon (it has crush) then I suppose it's possible that using it would be practical. I'd have to know if it were 1H or 2H though.

Anyway, that combo of necklace and sword was useful ONLY for str training and ONLY where defense wasn't a large concern. Now that we have familiars, however, it opens a lot more doors for potential use. We also have the DFS.

 

 

 

The thing is, once you're maxed or if you're not str training, it's really better to just use the whip.

 

 

 

Also, another reason this method's sort of forgotten is that people have gotten used to three major options: godswords, SS, scimitar. It used to be only the scimitar and people were rather bored of it, so they searched around for other ideas.

Pretty much exactly what I was gonna say.

Hey there....that's an old guide of mine haha. Sadly too much stuff comes out all the time for me to have wanted to keep it up.

 

 

 

Anyway, that combo of necklace and sword was useful ONLY for str training and ONLY where defense wasn't a large concern. Now that we have familiars, however, it opens a lot more doors for potential use. We also have the DFS.

 

 

 

The thing is, once you're maxed or if you're not str training, it's really better to just use the whip.

 

 

 

Also, another reason this method's sort of forgotten is that people have gotten used to three major options: godswords, SS, scimitar. It used to be only the scimitar and people were rather bored of it, so they searched around for other ideas.

 

 

 

 

 

8-) I can confirm that the black mask and obby necklace stack.

 

 

 

Oh btw, you never thought of using the mace+necklace at waterfiends? I hit quite alot of 44s there.

 

 

 

The only catch is that defense is very important at waterfiends, something which the obby necklace really isn't good at providing since the maul is a 2H weapon. Actually...if the TzHaar-Ket-Em is a one handed weapon (it has crush) then I suppose it's possible that using it would be practical. I'd have to know if it were 1H or 2H though.

the mace is 1h obviously. And i use it there and the bunyip+scrolls heal me enough.

Maul fails there big time btw.

I was considering using this for my Str training. But i couldn't stand the attack and defense reductions. I already have trouble hitting Abby Demons with a D Scimitar and this would be even worse at that. Not to mention the defense. I take pride in being able to do every slayer task with just my bunyip and no other food. This necklace you make that a bit harder. This necklace just isn't good for slayers.

Hey there....that's an old guide of mine haha. Sadly too much stuff comes out all the time for me to have wanted to keep it up.

 

 

 

I know how you feel. That's how both of mine guides died too. I hope you don't mind me using it, or Zarfot if you're reading this. I gave you credit and linked to your guides.

Thanks for all the replies guys.

One topic that interested me reading through this is the combination at Waterfiends. I gotta try that if I get assigned waterfiends as a task.

Keep the posts coming!

It's pretty simple why the necklace dropped so much. When the wildy was taken away almost all obby maulers went with it. Obby maul pures have a very hard time bhing so most quit. They probably contributted to over 95% of zerker necklace market, hence the huge drop.

I remember when zerker necklaces uses to be around 4m and worth more than fury's.

In the practical sense of our day-to-day training, we find much less exotic/expensive methods of training, save for the Saradomin Sword. Whips are about as common as Rune now, and so are scimitars, so players will opt to use those a LOT more often than an Obsidian Weapon + Berserker Necklace combo.

Players also don't use an Obsidian weapon on a daily basis, so the Necklace becomes moot. Oh, not to forget the Obsidian pures that used this; they're long gone now.

It's pretty simple why the necklace dropped so much. When the wildy was taken away almost all obby maulers went with it. Obby maul pures have a very hard time bhing so most quit. They probably contributted to over 95% of zerker necklace market, hence the huge drop.

 

I remember when zerker necklaces uses to be around 4m and worth more than fury's.

We should set up a riot about the Dec 10th changes because of this. You're SO right!

I've tested this at prayer places ( where you dont need defence, like gorilla guards) and found I hit about the same with a whip when im on task. I hit pretty high with sword + neck combo, its just I like whips more for some reason ( yea Im comformist, deal nub).

well the max of a obby dagger with necklace and whip are the same, i looked into the whole calculator thing