important news regarding my RuneScape character

[Bobbington]

 

But having said that..... was it an incorrect banning? odd question I know.... but with the amount evidence that Jagex would have had that incriminated you (falsely albeit) I would have been more worried if they did not take action.

 

 

Huh?

 

 

 

What do they really have here? From what I can see -- nothing but circumstantial evidence. Do they have any proof that he actually did what he was accused of? Almost certainly not.

 

 

 

It's like convicting a guy of murder because both he and the murderer were seen in the same location.

 

 

 

Well they would have evidence (proof as far as I am concerned is a very strong word, and very uncommon in every aspect of life) that a player logged onto an account that the ICU will have discovered was stolen. The chances are it had logged in from a totally different country, and then it would appear the items transfered to his account via Laundering at the duel arena.... their would be allot of incriminating evidence.

 

 

 

 

 

I think you have been hugely unfortunate to find your self in an extremely rare situation, and really hope you are able to get back on your account.

 

 

It is not "extremely rare" at all -- in fact, it is quite common.

 

 

 

The major difference here is that this time they did it to someone who is high profile on a major fan site, and so has an audience to tell lots of people about it. The many thousands of other wrongfully banned people just sink into the silence.

 

 

 

~q

 

 

 

I disagree.... I honestly believe that this scenario's is something that will only happen very rarely. Admittedly I can't accurately back up that point to any definite level, but I am very sure that I would have heard about this many times before if it was not rare..... I read quite allot of "unfair banning" statements.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[hide]

Tip.it is based in the US. Jagex can't sue, as this is breaking the First Amendment, which says:

 

 

 

The First Amendment to the United States' Constitution wrote:

 

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex can not sue. We have the rights. Freedom of Speech, and Freedom of the Press. I suggest putting that article right back up on the Tip.It Times, and then see what Jagex does.

I am sorry...... but America has allot more censorship than most countries in the world... I can't accept a freedom of speech argument, also the artical contained alot of unfounded statements, freedom of speech is one thing lies (unfounded tructh) is another[/hide]

[#Free]

if 0phathead0 gets unbanned with last chance appeal, anybody can.

[ixfd64]

Don't forget that Muskee (a now maxed-out player) once got banned because she gave a noob free potions.

 

 

 

http://forum.tip.it/viewtopic.php?t=554029

 

 

 

:roll: :wall:

[llamster]

This is totalitarianism at its finest. Jagex bans one of its most loyal players, whom THEY awarded modship, based on a false premise. God, this makes my blood boil... :x

 

 

 

Like ixfd64 said, Jagex does not show favoritism. They believed that he was cheating, so they banned him (gender?). The only problem is that they sent an automated message. I think that Jagex should place higher priority on ban appeals, for they are the most important of queries.

[qeltar]

 

Well they would have evidence (proof as far as I am concerned is a very strong word, and very uncommon in every aspect of life) that a player logged onto an account that the ICU will have discovered was stolen. The chances are it had logged in from a totally different country, and then it would appear the items transfered to his account via Laundering at the duel arena.... their would be allot of incriminating evidence.

 

 

What you are saying basically boils down to saying "I have absolutely no clue about what evidence Jagex does or does not have, but I'm sure Jagex wouldn't have banned him without good reason".

 

 

 

Your incredible faith in Jagex's infallability -- despite the many thousands of people who have banned without cause -- wouldn't have anything to do with you being a RSOF mod, now would it?

 

 

I disagree.... I honestly believe that this scenario's is something that will only happen very rarely. Admittedly I can't accurately back up that point to any definite level, but I am very sure that I would have heard about this many times before if it was not rare..... I read quite allot of "unfair banning" statements.

 

 

I really don't care if this particular scenario is rare or not. The unfair banning is what is not rare.

 

 

 

Jagex employees are human, and humans make mistakes. Banning someone unfairly is understandable, as mistakes happen. Sending a devote, loyal player an idiotic form letter and basically telling him to shove off is NOT reasonable nor acceptable.

 

 

 

And if Jagex doesn't take into account loyalty, length of service and being a P mod, then they are complete idiots. Not because those who cheat or break rules should get a free pass based on how long they've played, but because it has direct relevance on the chances that they've made a mistake.

 

 

 

Exactly the same as how the police will be more likely to think twice about accusing the pastor of the town's church of being a shoplifter -- why would he? Same here.

 

 

 

~q

[ixfd64]

I've come to the conclusion that incorrect bannings are only one of the problems; the other problem is the customer support, or lack thereof. Of course, we are humans, and we make mistakes. An incorrect banning shouldn't be a problem, as long as customer support actually pays attention to it; in this case, the customer support does not offer the "support" it should.

 

 

 

Andrew promised us "good customer support" when he announced the development of members in 2001.

 

 

 

Due to much demand we are planning on launching a new premium RuneScape service soon. This will bring a whole load of great benefits such as: frequent updates, NO-adverts, good customer support, no scammers/cheaters (we'll kick 'em out), and much more! We're hoping to make it available for just $5 a month, and this tiny amount of money will pay for many great RuneScape updates to come, and will ensure we can keep running RuneScape for YOU.

 

 

 

Whoa, I just saw a pig fly past my window! Did anyone else see that?

 

 

 

wouldn't have anything to do with you being a RSOF mod, now would it?

 

 

 

Well, RSOF forum mods do tend to kiss up to Jagex, but that's not really the point.

[Zeus_s_Soul]

That's horrilbe. I hope you get unbanned..

[Th3_Crusader]

I understand what your talking about. Thats horrible, I', Sorry that happend.

 

 

 

Th3 Crusader

[Myweponsg00d]

I have full confidence in Jagex's banning system. Too many of these "OMG I just HAPPENED to be doing this and this and my FRIEND stole the account" stories come up. I'm betting he's guilty.

[Screechingmu]

Welcome to the club, don't you just love Jagex.

[Lime_Mercury]

After some investigation on my own, I think I know why Jagex detected me as a rule breaker. Last Thursday, someone came over and wanted to show me a level 91 account, which he claimed was his. I let him use my computer, and he then went onto his laptop and asked me to duel him. Normally, I don't like dueling, but since he was several levels lower than I was, I accepted. After several close duels, I won various items, and we complimented each other with "good fight."

 

 

 

It turns out that the character that dueled me was actually stolen. He didn't admit to it until I got banned, probably because he knew that I was a player moderator. I don't know whether he stole a friend's character or just phished it. (I asked him why he stole the account, and he told me that the account was inactive, so it didn't matter. I doubt that his words are 100% truthful, any in any case, he shouldn't be stealing accounts in the first place.) Since both characters had logged in using the same computer, Jagex likely detected me as a rule breaker.

 

 

 

 

Well, I clipped your post a little because I wanted to quote it, and I'm still scratching my own head. A lot of goodbyes and history and I'm not too sure what else, but this seemed like the meat and potatoes of the whole thing.

 

 

 

If I've quoted and read this correctly, you let someone you didn't know very well log onto runescape on your computer, even though he had his laptop right there... You said you're a senior at UC Berkley, so I'm wondering if you have been hanging around with an 18-22 year old (college age) cracker of accounts or if something else is the case.

 

 

 

I'm really not satisfied that I'm hearing the whole truth.

 

 

 

Now aside from that huge lapse in judgment (which is either A. letting a stranger play runescape on your pc or B. letting someone you know to be an account stealer - which you said was not the case, i.e. you didn't know) you decided to push your luck a little further, and put yourself in a position to take money from that account.

 

 

 

While that seems a bit to me like a set-up, maybe in retrospect it does to you too.

 

 

 

I'm just really wondering about this mysterious "person that came over to show you a lvl 91 account".

 

 

 

I reiterate that there has got to be more to the story than we're hearing.

 

 

 

Good luck getting your account back if you're not guilty of being anything more than clueless in a dangerous situation, yadda yadda yadda, though I do wonder if we'll see another Duke Freedom type thing where he eventually owns up to whatever he really did.

[enjoi8882]

join the club

 

 

 

my char: enjoi888 banned for real world trading when i didnt do it...

 

 

 

i have 6 years of rs under my belt so im close enuff to u

 

 

 

although i think my char is better and prolly the highest lvl banned account(look at sig for info) total lvl was 2044 wen i was banned with 8 99s

 

 

 

o yea and dont say a virtual char isnt worth anything in the real world when it is if its the most popular internet game in the world... on a certain site, not going to say name, an account like ours would sell for round 150mil rs cash then go and sell it to a mill merchant for $3 usd per!

 

 

 

if my math is right thats around $450 cash in your pocket... so jagexx jus basicallyt robbed me and u for money and wasted our hard work time and effort. Jagex=evil

[qeltar]

 

Good luck getting your account back if you're not guilty of being anything more than clueless in a dangerous situation, yadda yadda yadda, though I do wonder if we'll see another Duke Freedom type thing where he eventually owns up to whatever he really did.

 

 

 

This is a fair point. (Made by others as well.)

 

 

 

It is true that some people DO cheat/hack/whatever.. and they also maintain innocence. And we are left to really wonder, because in the end, we don't know.

 

 

 

My problem is that I think the presumption of innocence is important, and that the appeals process should be respected. It seems here like this person was not even given a fair chance.

[Dragonlordjl]

 

Good luck getting your account back if you're not guilty of being anything more than clueless in a dangerous situation, yadda yadda yadda, though I do wonder if we'll see another Duke Freedom type thing where he eventually owns up to whatever he really did.

 

 

 

This is a fair point. (Made by others as well.)

 

 

 

It is true that some people DO cheat/hack/whatever.. and they also maintain innocence. And we are left to really wonder, because in the end, we don't know.

 

 

 

My problem is that I think the presumption of innocence is important, and that the appeals process should be respected. It seems here like this person was not even given a fair chance.

 

 

 

Indeed, with Jagex, you are guilty until proven innocent. Although, I've heard that is how the English legal system operates. I don't live in England, so I wouldn't know the validity of that claim.

[casthewiz]

Great job Jagex, ban a loyal player mod when you could have banned an autoer or a real scammer. :notalk:

 

 

 

 

 

I feel for you, and customer service is absolute bullship (you know, the ship that takes bulls to the market). I've been banned on my pure accounts before and I know how you feel...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sometimes I just want to do this...

 

 

 

 

 

 

To all those mindless ban automation responses....

[AThousandLies]

join the club

 

 

 

my char: enjoi888 banned for real world trading when i didnt do it...

 

 

 

i have 6 years of rs under my belt so im close enuff to u

 

 

 

although i think my char is better and prolly the highest lvl banned account(look at sig for info) total lvl was 2044 wen i was banned with 8 99s

 

 

 

o yea and dont say a virtual char isnt worth anything in the real world when it is if its the most popular internet game in the world... on a certain site, not going to say name, an account like ours would sell for round 150mil rs cash then go and sell it to a mill merchant for $3 usd per!

 

 

 

if my math is right thats around $450 cash in your pocket... so jagexx jus basicallyt robbed me and u for money and wasted our hard work time and effort. Jagex=evil

 

 

 

The point isn't saying that the amount from an account is insignificant. What it's saying is that if you spent as much time working a job as you had on that account, you'd be a LOT better off. $450 for hundreds of hours? Take into account the months of membership and that might go down to $400. Not really worth it, eh?

[ixfd64]

The person in question wasn't really a "stranger," as you might say. It was more of a friend of a friend, so I thought I could trust him. On the positive side, I didn't get any keyloggers.

 

 

 

I guess I should re-consider my personal policies on who is allowed to use my computer.

[oropher]

Have you tried sending in a few complaints? I always notice that ban appeals are answered by those bot messages, but when you send a complaint you may actually get an answer from a human being.

[G_P_Kid]

I was banned on my main in January 07 for the exact same reason, false ban as well. HOLD the last chance appeal! Until the appeal system is proven that it was improved, I'd reccommend holding on to it. Also, send in a lot of queries to learn as much as you can about the ban before appealing, a few mistakes I made that you shouldn't. :-s

[Dragonlordjl]

I was banned on my main in January 07 for the exact same reason, false ban as well. HOLD the last chance appeal! Until the appeal system is proven that it was improved, I'd reccommend holding on to it. Also, send in a lot of queries to learn as much as you can about the ban before appealing, a few mistakes I made that you shouldn't. :-s

 

 

 

It will never improve.

[The Observer]

At least back then they weren't so strict. Back then, their punishments were actually justified.

[Bufoman]

The problem I see here is one of proving innocence in the face of such evidence of guilt. Really the only evidence you have to give jagex that you didnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t do this is your word, something that has a different value from every person. Seeing as your anonymous they can't very well substantiate that you do attend that university and are a person of such strong character. What they probably have is your IP accessing a stolen account, and you trading between your account and it.

 

 

 

That said you still are not getting a fair trail if they don't even hear your side of the argument. 400 characters... I see no way making an appeal that short unless you use newspeak from 1984.

[The Observer]

They should at least give you the benefit of the doubt as you were a Player Moderator before this. That proved your loyalty to JAGeX and RuneScape...

[Duke_Freedom]

though I do wonder if we'll see another Duke Freedom type thing where he eventually owns up to whatever he really did.

 

 

 

I don't know why you are suggesting that I made it look like I did nothing nor do I know why you also suggest that I "eventually" twisted my words around to admit. That is completely untrue and everyone who was around at the time knows it is.

 

 

 

It would be appreciated that when people refer to something, they actually have their facts straight or better even: not refer to it at all if it is not of any relevance. Now if everyone could leave it at that - thanks.

 

 

 

~Duke Freedom

[das]

After some investigation on my own, I think I know why Jagex detected me as a rule breaker. Last Thursday, someone came over and wanted to show me a level 91 account, which he claimed was his. I let him use my computer, and he then went onto his laptop and asked me to duel him. Normally, I don't like dueling, but since he was several levels lower than I was, I accepted. After several close duels, I won various items, and we complimented each other with "good fight."

 

 

 

It turns out that the character that dueled me was actually stolen. He didn't admit to it until I got banned, probably because he knew that I was a player moderator. I don't know whether he stole a friend's character or just phished it. (I asked him why he stole the account, and he told me that the account was inactive, so it didn't matter. I doubt that his words are 100% truthful, any in any case, he shouldn't be stealing accounts in the first place.) Since both characters had logged in using the same computer, Jagex likely detected me as a rule breaker.

 

 

 

 

Well, I clipped your post a little because I wanted to quote it, and I'm still scratching my own head. A lot of goodbyes and history and I'm not too sure what else, but this seemed like the meat and potatoes of the whole thing.

 

 

 

If I've quoted and read this correctly, you let someone you didn't know very well log onto runescape on your computer, even though he had his laptop right there... You said you're a senior at UC Berkley, so I'm wondering if you have been hanging around with an 18-22 year old (college age) cracker of accounts or if something else is the case.

 

 

 

I'm really not satisfied that I'm hearing the whole truth.

 

 

 

Now aside from that huge lapse in judgment (which is either A. letting a stranger play runescape on your pc or B. letting someone you know to be an account stealer - which you said was not the case, i.e. you didn't know) you decided to push your luck a little further, and put yourself in a position to take money from that account.

 

 

 

While that seems a bit to me like a set-up, maybe in retrospect it does to you too.

 

 

 

I'm just really wondering about this mysterious "person that came over to show you a lvl 91 account".

 

 

 

I reiterate that there has got to be more to the story than we're hearing.

 

 

 

Good luck getting your account back if you're not guilty of being anything more than clueless in a dangerous situation, yadda yadda yadda

 

 

 

Your oldschool . and as a poster I know I respect you, I have been around since july 2001, and Can say offhand I cant remember you doing anything bad and being a player of a good reputation but going to agree with lime, something just doesn't add up