An Alternative to Banning

[yuriqiu]

This is sick, cruel, sadistic, evil, and by all means just plain mean.

 

I love it.

[Johannas]

This is sick, cruel, sadistic, evil, and by all means just plain mean.I love it.

 

I don't think it's harsh enough.

 

What about a repeat offender to has only been able to obtain 100k since their last ban? What will happen to their precious gpeees?

 

I really like idea of having to pay real life fines though, then Jagex are still making money, meaning they will not be as hesistant to ban paying members' accounts as i mentioned in my previous post.

[Squisher_33]

the only flaw is that it punishes people for buying tons of an item for max, not actualy manipulating

 

it should only work if the person has shown proof of manipulation throughout several offers

 

for example: i buy 800k raw summer pies in the ge some time, to speed thigns up i buy max, my account is then locked and im forced to give away 800k pies for free and loose my bank

 

did i do anything wrong? nope i bought 200m cooking xp.....was i cruelly punished? yes

 

there has to be strong evidence and someone whos been doing this for a month or more, such as chessy or smokin mils or someone

[Grimy_Bunyip]

As per the OT of banning,

Instead of making them pay a GP/Item fee to have their bank why not introduce a real life fee instead. Currently the payment for most members is 5$ a month. Why not make it so that every botted offense you have been proven to commit, your subscription for that account also goes up 5$ in addition to your botting punishment. Bot once, its 10$ a month and a 14 day probation period. Bot twice, a 30 day probation and 15$ a month, ect.. This increase in money would at least give Jagex some more cash from members who break the rules. That is more cash Jagex can spend on extra workers going out and catching these bots.

 

If the fee was introduced nobody would continue to bot on an account if it got caught. Also who in their right mind is going to buy an account from a botting company that requires 15 or 20$ a month to play on it. Not only would the fee cut down on botting, but RWT'ed accounts which botted too.

If I were Jagex I'd be afraid from all the bad PR that might create.

it's kinda like Jagex is ripping money out of players' hands.

 

I believe the only reason Jagex hasn't done this is to rinse as much money out of membership as they can.

Remember a year or so back when they did a mass ban? Well i bet they had the names of every single person they were going to ban months in advance. But why ban them instantaneously? 10,000 people (estimate) paying another 6 months membership is a hell of a lot of money for a company just to throw away which is why they prolonged it as much as possible. I also believe this is what they're doing for the next mass ban.

*shrug* that's a good point.

 

I would like your suggestion alot better if items in the destruction box were actually destroyed as opposed to recycled back into the G/E. The only way rare items leave the game is through banned accounts. (I remember reading a blog post my Duke Freedom talking

about the the rares he had and the effects on the economy)

eh, but the point is to not have negative economic impacts.

You can easily rectify items lost through bannings, if the only item lost is GP.

If the items lost are a broad range of items, that can cause issues that are much harder to rectify.

 

Moreover, this destruction box could just be used a junk box. An easy way to dump unstrung bows etc.

I said that the items have to *sell* on ge b4 they could be used towards the fine.

junk items would not be useable on the destruction box.

 

 

Manipulation isn't a bannable/mutable offense. I like banning/suspension more anyways because it actually teaches a player not to break the rules again.

I don't think banning actually teaches a lesson.

Because the person can actually just go do something else.

it takes more time to dump stuff into a destruction box.

And if you make a new account, you start anew and don't really think about your past account.

 

Remember alot of jagex's customers are kids.

It has a greater impact on them if you make them take some time, and grasp what exactly their punishment is.

[Bows]

I like this idea. It wouldn't make party hats even rarer.

 

I like the idea too, good job. :thumbup:

[Wingless]

This is sick, cruel, sadistic, evil, and by all means just plain mean.

 

I love it.

[Viv]

i always thought it was harsh to perm ban someone with many many days played was harsh especcially if it was bug abusing for money

 

having them destryoe all the money they earned from the glich would be more reasonable.......

 

statwise maybe if they have ability to maybe remove 3m expirience from every stat....:o

[Dexek]

One lash across the palm of said player's hand for every xp or gp gained against the rules. :thumbup:

 

I do like your ideas, Grimy. However, what I am scared of is Jagex wrongfully banning people. Actually, I guess this doesn't pertain to mutes which are about the only rule the average honest player could break.... so bring it on! :thumbsup:

[Normalize]

We should do this to Chessy018, she is a well known black market administrator who sells mils as no one has done before. It would to us good to have her pay everything she has to compensate for the evil she has done against Jagex. (RWT)

[oceana]

Lockdown their account until the gamer pays an in game fine equal to their total bank value.

I said that the items have to *sell* on ge b4 they could be used towards the fine.

junk items would not be useable on the destruction box.

Might have missed me, but I'll ask again, since to me this seems like a flaw.

 

Many items just don't sell on the grand exchange. How can a person pay a fine if the fine is equal to their entire bank account if the destruction box is unable to sell many items to get the required amount for the fine? Because if the items have to sell on the grand exchange, then someone might be stuck in lockdown for a long amount of time simply because the grand exchange won't sell the items.

[Dexek]

Lockdown their account until the gamer pays an in game fine equal to their total bank value.

I said that the items have to *sell* on ge b4 they could be used towards the fine.

junk items would not be useable on the destruction box.

Might have missed me, but I'll ask again, since to me this seems like a flaw.

 

Many items just don't sell on the grand exchange. How can a person pay a fine if the fine is equal to their entire bank account if the destruction box is unable to sell many items to get the required amount for the fine? Because if the items have to sell on the grand exchange, then someone might be stuck in lockdown for a long amount of time simply because the grand exchange won't sell the items.

 

I believe that is the point. They're going to either have to abandon the account, or work hard to gain items that can be put into the destruction box. Wasting tens to hundreds of hours for your own mistake is one way to learn.

[Star_Fox]

I like this idea. It wouldn't make party hats even rarer.

 

I like the idea too, good job. :thumbup:

 

Assuming you guys don't have any of them, it's easier said than done. <_<

[oceana]

I believe that is the point. They're going to either have to abandon the account, or work hard to gain items that can be put into the destruction box. Wasting tens to hundreds of hours for your own mistake is one way to learn.

Might as well just ban them then. It wouldn't be any different.

[Nash]

Hey man i got a few books for you to check out:

 

-Communist Manifesto

-Utopia

 

 

 

These suggestions are rediculous, did you not realize there was tuns of manipulation before the ge was introduced? The ge manipulation is childs play compared to what was going on before it. Not to mention your punishments dont exactly fit what a game is all about. If this was directed towards Botters or i dont know... somebody who actually did something worth punishment then sure. But come on.

[Grimy_Bunyip]

I believe that is the point. They're going to either have to abandon the account, or work hard to gain items that can be put into the destruction box. Wasting tens to hundreds of hours for your own mistake is one way to learn.

Might as well just ban them then. It wouldn't be any different.

The point is that practically, it isn't different.

But psychologically it's different, which is the entire point.

 

Hey man i got a few books for you to check out:

 

-Communist Manifesto

-Utopia

 

 

 

These suggestions are rediculous, did you not realize there was tuns of manipulation before the ge was introduced? The ge manipulation is childs play compared to what was going on before it. Not to mention your punishments dont exactly fit what a game is all about. If this was directed towards Botters or i dont know... somebody who actually did something worth punishment then sure. But come on.

I'm not quite sure what you're on about.

Why do you think this punishment isn't fitting? You didn't really give a reason why not.

And why does manipulation have anything to do with this?

I'm proposing a general punishment, it just so happens to work better if the punished player happens to be hoarding something.

[xpx]

We should do this to Chessy018, she is a well known black market administrator who sells mils as no one has done before. It would to us good to have her pay everything she has to compensate for the evil she has done against Jagex. (RWT)

Wait, are you talking about darth vader or...? Oh, that's the jealousy talking. Don't suck, be better than others, manipulate your way to greatness = WIN. [bleep]ing about it = LOSE.

 

Seriously, price manipulation didn't exist before the trade limit. Now, who imposed the trade limit? yes, that's who you should all be mad at. Everybody else you are mad at is just coping better than you are.

[Jehosaphat]

My idea: As soon as Jagex detects a bot, they start making the bot LOSE xp instead of gaining it until they log out. Then, next time they log in, their account is "locked down" as Morionic put it; except during lockdown, the xp loss remains the same - if you have to do stuff to earn money to pay off the account, you suffer for it. Makes them less likely to just go back and bot during lockdown.

[Grimy_Bunyip]

My idea: As soon as Jagex detects a bot, they start making the bot LOSE xp instead of gaining it until they log out. Then, next time they log in, their account is "locked down" as Morionic put it; except during lockdown, the xp loss remains the same - if you have to do stuff to earn money to pay off the account, you suffer for it. Makes them less likely to just go back and bot during lockdown.

I dislike the idea of removing XP because it can cause weird anomalies (lvl 3's with quest capes for example)

anyways back onto your comment.

I'm not confident in Jagex's abilities to detect a bot.

But Jagex could increase monitoring of botting on an account that is in lockdown I guess.

 

Anyways, it's not like it would be TOO hard to make it impossible for players to bot out of a punishment.

 

So here's a hypothetical thing that Jagex could implement, as a punishment for botting, that would 100% be unbottable.

 

-Introduce a map editor/quest maker to the community that would allow players to create mini-RS worlds and mini quests.

-Allow players to upload these quests.

-Players can play instanced versions of these player made quests for fun.

-Offer an incentive for the player to make these quests (like, good quests get made into real quests or something)

-Force players punished for banning to complete X number of these quests.

 

In theory, there should be such an obnoxiously large number, and varied combination of quests that the community could make.

That writing a botting program to circumvent the punishment would be more or less impossible.

 

Brute Force Solutions can be > Botting tbh :)

[SixFootOne]

We should do this to Chessy018, she is a well known black market administrator who sells mils as no one has done before. It would to us good to have her pay everything she has to compensate for the evil she has done against Jagex. (RWT)

Wait, are you talking about darth vader or...? Oh, that's the jealousy talking. Don't suck, be better than others, manipulate your way to greatness = WIN. [bleep]ing about it = LOSE.

 

Seriously, price manipulation didn't exist before the trade limit. Now, who imposed the trade limit? yes, that's who you should all be mad at. Everybody else you are mad at is just coping better than you are.

 

Well according to this, yes it did.

 

http://forum.tip.it/topic/91804-my-story/#p4305115

 

 

This is a quote from R2pleasent, a pretty famous merchant and rwter.

 

[hide]

Well, many people might have noticed I was banned awhile ago from Runescape. At the time I was quite apathetic towards the decision, as I rarely played Runescape anymore. Recently, however, I've started up again, and I decided I might as well tell my story of Runescape. Some of you may not remember me, but I was one of the bigger Party Hat merchants in Runescape 2.

 

I began playing in July 2004, and within about 2 weeks I realized how I could make money by buying and selling coal at Falador East bank. It was much easier to world swap back then without the timer, so it was quite profitable. I very quickly made enough money to buy the new Treasure Trail items (such as Cavaliers and Pirate Hats), as well as lower level Rares, like Santa Hats and Masks. I merchanted these items until I had 3.5 Mil, and then purchased a Purple Party Hat.

 

 

I fell in love with Party Hat merchanting, and could not seem to get myself off Runescape. I would scan the forums all day long, refreshing them virtually every 5 seconds, to make sure I'd be the first to get any good deals available. It did not take me long to work my way up, and before long I had a set. Around this time, many things were happening in Fally. Firstly, Party Hat sellers moved into the Park, which at the time only consisted of Party Hat merchants. Fally Park was by far my favourite place to merchant of all time, before it became overrun by the lower merchants. It allowed for a real community amongst Phat Merchants, one which will likely never be replicated. I made some of my greatest friends on Runescape around this time, notably Shadoken, Stevenxu, Duke (despite our differences), Papz2004, Apoc24, and many others.

 

 

 

After a small break in December 2004 to around February 2005, I came back disappointed to see that Falador Park had become the trading grounds for nearly every item in the game. Phat merchants were pushed to the top, and the community atmosphere had dwindled down. This was also the first time that I had really become the top dog, as Duke had semi-retired, Ego Scorpion was long gone, and Unleash1 lost his money staking. I began taking advantage of my richness by forcing Rares prices in certain directions. Many players labelled this "manipulation", or deception, but it was executed perfectly legitimately.

 

 

 

I began by buying up a large amount of a particular colour Party Hat. Let's take for example, Whites, which I purchased at around 16M apiece. I would buy about 5 Whites for good prices, somewhat privately, then I would begin paying more publicly. Of course, the merchants with Whites had already sold me theirs that day, so there wasn't much action on my posts. I would also use different language if I didn't actually want people to sell me the Hats. A post that I didn't want any sellers I would act desperate, for example:

 

"Buying White Party Hat - Title

 

Paying 16.8M! Someone PLEASE, contact me in game, I really need a few more Whites"

 

 

My desperation, combined with my reputation as a very profittable merchant made it quite easy to post threads without actually getting any offers. If the odd person would post, saying he'd sell for my price, I'd make sure to do the trade, but to also do the trade in front of all the merchants in Fally, to show that I was for real. I would continue to pay more for another day or so, pushing them slowly up to around 18M. At this point, I would have around 11 White Party Hats, purchased at an average of maybe 16.4M. I would then search privately for a player that was buying 2-3 hats at once, and sell him the Whites at a 200K or so discount apiece. After this, I would sell as many as I could at the top price. Then, the prices would begin to fall, as more and more re-entered the market. I would then have around 5-6 Whites remaining, and would use them to push the prices extremely low, by using the reverse techniques (acting desperate to sell, etc.)

 

This could all be done in about 3 days, and would not only increase my total worth, but also my buying power, because Party Hats would not be permanently going up in value. However, I took this tactic to another level in June 2005, when I orchestrated one of the most outrageous price rise in history: Half Wines.

 

 

The Half Wine price boost was by far the largest impact I have ever made on Runescape. In mid-May of 2005, I realized that Half Wines had become very hard to find on the market, and that there were virtually no sellers of these items. They were also priced extremely low at the time, costing around 9 Mil apiece -- while Purples costed approximately 10M apiece. I realized this was a prime oppurtunity to execute some serious price hikes, as there would be no competition on the Wines market. I had also realized in the past that players are easily swayed by price rises, and it was very easy to create bubbles in Runescape.

 

I began buying Wines up at around 9M apiece, but they very quickly rose up to around 30M, which was actually a natural rise at the time. The supply was very low at the time, due to several inactive players holding large amounts of them. I not only purchased every single Wine I could possibly buy at the time, but also gathered the Half Wine sellers who refused to sell to me. All of them knew who I was, and when I had them promise not to sell, or even advertise their Wines on the market, they all agreed. We called it the Half-Wine Owners' Club, or HWOC, and I swore to them I would have the prices up within a week.

 

 

Well, it turned out that Wines were the perfect item to push up in price. This was all done during a massive rise in Phat prices, and players had tons of money to spend on the next big thing. Prices shot up on Half Wines, going from 30M to 50M within the first few days. And as the prices rose, so did the demand, as players all wanted a piece of the increase. It was somewhat fortunate that at the time there were virtually no sellers. I had purchased 12 Wines at an average price of 30 Mil apiece, and the profits at the time were insane. But, instead of selling at 50 Mil, which would have allowed me to make a huge amount of profit, I got greedy. I kept pushing them up, and up. Half Wines, for the first time in Runescape history, had become the most expensive items in the game! They had hit 75M apiece, when Blues weren't even 60M. It seemed like they would go on forever.

 

 

 

However, there was another bubble forming at the time of the Half Wine rise. Party Hats had hit ridiculously high values, and suddenly, on June 15 of 2006, the prices went up another 25% in one day. This is when the bubble burst, and suddenly all Rares prices began to plummet. I had managed to sell 3 of my Wines for an average of 70M apiece, but I was still holding 9 of them through the crash. Prices of Half Wines went down 30M (rougly 40%), in a matter of ONE day. I ended up selling the rest of the Wines off for around 35-40M over the next little while, but I realized it wasn't really about the profit. It was about being able to do something that hadn't be done before. At least I used that justification in my head to offset the pain ;)

 

 

Resized to 83% (was 972 x 514) - Click image to enlargePosted Image

 

 

- A chart by Duke Freedom demonstrating Half Wine prices

 

 

 

After this, I continued to merchant in Fally. Duke Freedom ended up returning in the fall of 2005, and I began to talk to him on much more friendly terms. I was, as many of you know, banned in June of 2006 for Real-World Trading. This post is not intended to discuss my banning, however, and I'd like to keep it at that.

 

 

 

Anyways, today I am playing p2p on my pure now and then, chatting with old friends. I've found the old passion I have for this game, which has inspired me to share my experiences with you guys. Thanks for hearing me out, I always enjoyed Tip.it's community

[/hide]

[Jehosaphat]

My idea: As soon as Jagex detects a bot, they start making the bot LOSE xp instead of gaining it until they log out. Then, next time they log in, their account is "locked down" as Morionic put it; except during lockdown, the xp loss remains the same - if you have to do stuff to earn money to pay off the account, you suffer for it. Makes them less likely to just go back and bot during lockdown.

I dislike the idea of removing XP because it can cause weird anomalies (lvl 3's with quest capes for example)

anyways back onto your comment.

I'm not confident in Jagex's abilities to detect a bot.

But Jagex could increase monitoring of botting on an account that is in lockdown I guess.

 

Anyways, it's not like it would be TOO hard to make it impossible for players to bot out of a punishment.

 

So here's a hypothetical thing that Jagex could implement, as a punishment for botting, that would 100% be unbottable.

 

-Introduce a map editor/quest maker to the community that would allow players to create mini-RS worlds and mini quests.

-Allow players to upload these quests.

-Players can play instanced versions of these player made quests for fun.

-Offer an incentive for the player to make these quests (like, good quests get made into real quests or something)

-Force players punished for banning to complete X number of these quests.

 

In theory, there should be such an obnoxiously large number, and varied combination of quests that the community could make.

That writing a botting program to circumvent the punishment would be more or less impossible.

 

Brute Force Solutions can be > Botting tbh :)

 

As though we don't have enough "weird anomalies" as it is. *cough Bruno the glitcher cough*

 

But I like the quest idea. Or we could force them to drain Dungeoneering resource dungeons of EVERY RESOURCE before they can continue (with no xp for it, ofc). After ~100 floors, they'd be free to throw their bank in the destruction box to try to un-lockdown their account. :twisted:

[blakdragon39]

It seems like an alright idea... but I really don't see it getting implemented.

[Adam007]

I say they just bring back Thordur's black hole.

[Star_Fox]

I say they just bring back Thordur's black hole.

 

Without the glitch ofc. :thumbup: I always wanted to see the black hole.

[Riemis]

I say they just bring back Thordur's black hole.

 

Without the glitch ofc. :thumbup: I always wanted to see the black hole.

 

It kind of looks like this:

[Star_Fox]

I say they just bring back Thordur's black hole.

 

Without the glitch ofc. :thumbup: I always wanted to see the black hole.

 

It kind of looks like this:

 

i kind of knew that. But I wanted to see what it would be like running around in a big black area. ;)