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Runescape Dying? [Discussion/Observation]


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#41
Ginger_Warrior
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There's no difference between 2 players spending £5 each on membership or 1 player spending £5 on membership and another £5 in the store. Player numbers aren't the be-all and end-all. Even if they are going down.

This would have been true when RuneScape was released, but because of the explosion in social networking and social media, exposure on websites like Twitter, Facebook etc. is capital in its own right. The more players you have, the more social capital you have as a company to use. Unless you're purposefully attempting to give a product some kind of niche market, or some kind of social prestige that only few can enjoy (comparatively expensive "limited edition" offers, for example) it's no longer the case that five people paying £1 each = one person paying £5.

The difference is four more people talking about said product to their friends. That's why declining player numbers are a worry, and microtransactions doesn't necessarily compensate for that.

NB: By saying that, I'm not arguing RuneScape is necessarily dying. That's far too simplistic an argument. The genre on a more general basis, however, has been in a fairly consistent decline for a good few years now.

#42
Sy_Accursed
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There's no difference between 2 players spending £5 each on membership or 1 player spending £5 on membership and another £5 in the store. Player numbers aren't the be-all and end-all. Even if they are going down.

This would have been true when RuneScape was released, but because of the explosion in social networking and social media, exposure on websites like Twitter, Facebook etc. is capital in its own right. The more players you have, the more social capital you have as a company to use. Unless you're purposefully attempting to give a product some kind of niche market, or some kind of social prestige that only few can enjoy (comparatively expensive "limited edition" offers, for example) it's no longer the case that five people paying £1 each = one person paying £5.

The difference is four more people talking about said product to their friends. That's why declining player numbers are a worry, and microtransactions doesn't necessarily compensate for that.

NB: By saying that, I'm not arguing RuneScape is necessarily dying. That's far too simplistic an argument. The genre on a more general basis, however, has been in a fairly consistent decline for a good few years now.


But social capital isn't all about numbers its about what kinda they are.
2 Players just paying the £5 fee are more likely to be casual sorts and not social involved so they don't offer any social capital where as one player paying the £5 and investing £5 in the other stuff are more likely to be involved and give better social capital.

An over generalisation perhaps but the point stands numbers aren't everything in the social capital game, it is the social involvement they have and that is more likely to come through players dedicated enough to spend a little more than just the base price. The old saying applies for social capital these days: quality over quantity. 1 social media savvy user with a few hundred followers means a hell of a lot more than 10 social media noobs who have like 2 followers because in social capital terms that 1 player talking reaches 100+ others instantly with the net only growing wider at each level of dissemination; those 10 with 2 followers however only hit 20 others giving them much less power.

Jagex has no trouble cashing in social capital between the jagex runescape and jmod personal twitter feeds, twitch, podcasts, 2 youtube channels etc they are cashing in plenty on the social capital they do have

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#43
Ring_World
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I think in terms of player numbers and satisfaction its pretty clear that RS is in decline. I can only play 07 myself because of EoC. I might have enjoyed the new skill but EoC makes it literally impossible for me to enjoy the game any further. I know too many people who also feel the same way. RS was definitely in decline before that, but a lot of players I knew that played refuse to join up again because they feel pretty jaded over the microtransactions and refuse to learn combat over again.

Imo the EoC gambit failed. Changing your combat system is the riskiest thing a company can do in a game, and I feel it drove away more old players permanently then it brought it new ones.

#44
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I still don't get the fuzz about the EOC, sure, it has it flaws, and sure, I like the old system more. But is it really that bad? I adapted to the situation, just as I learned to work with the NIS. I'm a very stubborn oldschooler with enormous pink nostalgia glasses, but I really enjoy the game now, and I guess that without these updates, RuneScape's life would end very soon.

#45
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I still don't get the fuzz about the EOC, sure, it has it flaws, and sure, I like the old system more. But is it really that bad? I adapted to the situation, just as I learned to work with the NIS. I'm a very stubborn oldschooler with enormous pink nostalgia glasses, but I really enjoy the game now, and I guess that without these updates, RuneScape's life would end very soon.


To me with EoC only PVM aint "that bad" but most aspects of PVP are. Theres little variety left.

Also, I was never mad about the combat. I was just mad how these "developers" were blind enough to make a system that kills alot of the games content. It was not worth it and it never will be.

#46
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But social capital isn't all about numbers its about what kinda they are.
2 Players just paying the £5 fee are more likely to be casual sorts and not social involved so they don't offer any social capital where as one player paying the £5 and investing £5 in the other stuff are more likely to be involved and give better social capital.

That's a very silly and baseless assumption, to be honest. In fact, I'll reply with one of my own just to prove how silly it is: People who spend more time playing RuneScape are more likely to be no lifer nerds who don't have friends to talk about how wonderful RuneScape is. So, actually, the more money per player spent on RuneScape, the less social capital Jagex have!! (Or not, because this is just as stupid a statement as yours was)

We could just stick with common sense statements: The more customers a product has, the more exposure it has. Thus, the less players RuneScape has, the less exposure it has.

The only exception to that rule would be prestige products, like luxury brands, for example. The exposure comes from wanting to have a connection to the brand rather than necessarily owning it. You're going to be very hard pushed to argue that RuneScape falls in that category.

#47
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It isn't, because micro-transactions aren't RWT.



Yes they are. Real world trading is the exchange of real money for virtual goods, as much as Jagex used to deny it and then amended their rules to admit.
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#48
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The start of runescape was the moment it started dying.


I feel like I've said this before.


It isn't, because micro-transactions aren't RWT.



Yes they are. Real world trading is the exchange of real money for virtual goods, as much as Jagex used to deny it and then amended their rules to admit.


Membership = RWT
 

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#49
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Just going to give the reason why I quit, I know a lot of people feel the same way, but a lot of people don't and can respect that.

EOC completely killed all forms of pures, or alternative ways of playing 'competitively'. One of the greatest things in runescape was that you didn't have to focus on just max skill total, you could work on making an account designed just for pvp. When starting a new account to pvp/play with the day before EOC's release you could have chosen:

Turmoil Berserker, Turmoil hybrid, 43 /52 pray berserker, 52 pray hybrid, 40 defense hybrid, 33 defense turmoil pure, chaotic/godsword/whip/dragon of the previous, barrows pure/hybrid, cannon pure, range 1 def pure, hybrid 1 def pure, melee 1 def pure at all different levels, 1 pray pure, 1 pray main, obby pure, cvls pure, 20 defense pvp equip pure, rune gloves pure, range tank, arma storm tank, summoning tank, summoning pure, obby tank, low str high att/def veracer, iban pure, 10 hp dbow pure, dfs pure, sara sword pure, 11 pray mage pure, d claw rush pure, korasis pure, 99hp summ pure, poly staff pure,gmaul pure, black mask slayer pure and so many many many more unique accounts and challenges to work and play with.



After EOC's release you have:

Range/Mage/Melee.
Not that it really matters as people will only ever fight if you are using the same style. Your levels don't matter and your equipment does nothing unique.

I kept with EOC for a good 3 months after its release, and hated it.




Also as for Solomon's store, that was exactly how it should have been done, the SOF should never have existed.
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#50
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On the micro transaction part. I wouldnt mind it if it was only SGS. And at the same time It would be nice if we could turn off all public cosmetics due to the fact people like to know what others are wearing.

And I agree with all of what 999134. They killed alot of players just by killing their accs also.

#51
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I still don't get the fuzz about the EOC, sure, it has it flaws, and sure, I like the old system more. But is it really that bad? I adapted to the situation, just as I learned to work with the NIS. I'm a very stubborn oldschooler with enormous pink nostalgia glasses, but I really enjoy the game now, and I guess that without these updates, RuneScape's life would end very soon.


Problem is that we had to adapt to the updates that most? players didn't even want neither the game needed those. But since they wasted so many hours on the update they had to release it even with the negative feedback from the community. Pretty sure that rs would have more interest with preeoc style gameplay. Only p2p people left are those who have been here for a long time and even they will eventually quit.

I would like to know how many new legit players actually subscribe to rs, couple months back I tried to make a new user and the tutorial/low level game is a total mess. And I wouldnt be surprised if they quit a few hours later. Would be interesting to see the game from a players perspective who is on here for the first time. In 2005/6 or whenever, I made my first account and did the tutorial, everything was explained well and had no problem going from the tutorial to the actual game with basic knowledge of skilling.

All in all the game is imo pretty much done. I see the updates atm as trying to keep whatever playerbase is left, playing a little longer. Only time will tell what will actually happen. Gl J@gex

#52
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I still don't get the fuzz about the EOC, sure, it has it flaws, and sure, I like the old system more. But is it really that bad? I adapted to the situation, just as I learned to work with the NIS. I'm a very stubborn oldschooler with enormous pink nostalgia glasses, but I really enjoy the game now, and I guess that without these updates, RuneScape's life would end very soon.


No one wants to relearn combat. You need combat for most aspects of the game. I have many friends who have quit in the past because of controversial updates and always eventually come back. But EoC is different, they do come back and try runescape out and find it unplayable. Where as old controversial updates like restricted trade didn't have that affect on them.

#53
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Just going to give the reason why I quit, I know a lot of people feel the same way, but a lot of people don't and can respect that.

EOC completely killed all forms of pures, or alternative ways of playing 'competitively'. One of the greatest things in runescape was that you didn't have to focus on just max skill total, you could work on making an account designed just for pvp. When starting a new account to pvp/play with the day before EOC's release you could have chosen:

Turmoil Berserker, Turmoil hybrid, 43 /52 pray berserker, 52 pray hybrid, 40 defense hybrid, 33 defense turmoil pure, chaotic/godsword/whip/dragon of the previous, barrows pure/hybrid, cannon pure, range 1 def pure, hybrid 1 def pure, melee 1 def pure at all different levels, 1 pray pure, 1 pray main, obby pure, cvls pure, 20 defense pvp equip pure, rune gloves pure, range tank, arma storm tank, summoning tank, summoning pure, obby tank, low str high att/def veracer, iban pure, 10 hp dbow pure, dfs pure, sara sword pure, 11 pray mage pure, d claw rush pure, korasis pure, 99hp summ pure, poly staff pure,gmaul pure, black mask slayer pure and so many many many more unique accounts and challenges to work and play with.



After EOC's release you have:

Range/Mage/Melee.
Not that it really matters as people will only ever fight if you are using the same style. Your levels don't matter and your equipment does nothing unique.

I kept with EOC for a good 3 months after its release, and hated it.




Also as for Solomon's store, that was exactly how it should have been done, the SOF should never have existed.


Why don't PvP lovers realize there is a hell of a lot more to this game than strictly PvP. I hated PvP, I'm glad that for the most part it is dead. Sure there were nice, skilled PvPers but the majority were kids who acted like jackasses, with their rushing and "0mfg tr0l0l0l0l safer 1 spec s0n". As long as those players are out of the game, I am fine with whatever Jagex wants to do with this game, not to mention they OWN the game and whining about shit that happened in the past won't change the future. Plus you have OSRS for old style PvP, owait no you don't because that game is dying off too.


OT: I agree with what Bxp said, the moment this game was created it was dying. Just like everything else in life, it will always slowly die off.

#54
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In my opinion, the player base is surely declining. What can they do to get some new players into the game (because to me it seems like there aren't any new players joining :s/a lot of people have multiple accounts or have had multiple accounts and they know what they're doing)?

They should buy some advertisement banners on top gaming sites, for instance IGN.

I hated EoC but I adapted and honestly it's alright but I can understand why a lot of people, including my real life friends, don't like it.

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#55
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You need combat for most aspects of the game.


I'd have to dispute that point with you. If that's all there was to RS, then I'd have given up on it years ago as just another combat-centric MMO ('cause lord knows we don't have enough of those /sarcasm). I hardly ever do combat, and have enjoyed many, many hours in this game.

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#56
999134
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Just going to give the reason why I quit, I know a lot of people feel the same way, but a lot of people don't and can respect that.

EOC completely killed all forms of pures, or alternative ways of playing 'competitively'. One of the greatest things in runescape was that you didn't have to focus on just max skill total, you could work on making an account designed just for pvp. When starting a new account to pvp/play with the day before EOC's release you could have chosen:

Turmoil Berserker, Turmoil hybrid, 43 /52 pray berserker, 52 pray hybrid, 40 defense hybrid, 33 defense turmoil pure, chaotic/godsword/whip/dragon of the previous, barrows pure/hybrid, cannon pure, range 1 def pure, hybrid 1 def pure, melee 1 def pure at all different levels, 1 pray pure, 1 pray main, obby pure, cvls pure, 20 defense pvp equip pure, rune gloves pure, range tank, arma storm tank, summoning tank, summoning pure, obby tank, low str high att/def veracer, iban pure, 10 hp dbow pure, dfs pure, sara sword pure, 11 pray mage pure, d claw rush pure, korasis pure, 99hp summ pure, poly staff pure,gmaul pure, black mask slayer pure and so many many many more unique accounts and challenges to work and play with.



After EOC's release you have:

Range/Mage/Melee.
Not that it really matters as people will only ever fight if you are using the same style. Your levels don't matter and your equipment does nothing unique.

I kept with EOC for a good 3 months after its release, and hated it.




Also as for Solomon's store, that was exactly how it should have been done, the SOF should never have existed.


Why don't PvP lovers realize there is a hell of a lot more to this game than strictly PvP. I hated PvP, I'm glad that for the most part it is dead. Sure there were nice, skilled PvPers but the majority were kids who acted like jackasses, with their rushing and "0mfg tr0l0l0l0l safer 1 spec s0n". As long as those players are out of the game, I am fine with whatever Jagex wants to do with this game, not to mention they OWN the game and whining about shit that happened in the past won't change the future. Plus you have OSRS for old style PvP, owait no you don't because that game is dying off too.


OT: I agree with what Bxp said, the moment this game was created it was dying. Just like everything else in life, it will always slowly die off.

And your way of playing is the only correct one right? Everyone who had fun pvping was just a jerk who didn't understand the game, not wanting to grind 1000s of hours at an agility course means that person is not a real runescape player.
OSRS is better, but still a complete mess. It has no content which is the main problem, the variety of the game is severely lacking compared to 2012scape, and there is no high level stuff at all . Jagex ignored the players and made rares worthless (no options had over 75% because they had so many different ones, they had loads of different options that where almost the same, like drops from clues and be rare vs dropped randomly and be rare)and the IP pid system is seriously messed up.
Check it out, huge amount of effort has gone into this massive mod!
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#57
Ring_World
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You need combat for most aspects of the game.


I'd have to dispute that point with you. If that's all there was to RS, then I'd have given up on it years ago as just another combat-centric MMO ('cause lord knows we don't have enough of those /sarcasm). I hardly ever do combat, and have enjoyed many, many hours in this game.


Make a new account and tell me how much of the game you can access without combat.

Quests/summoning in non combat situations/etc.

Lets say that you don't like the new combat system it affects the whole game for you since a lot of the game DOES revolve around combat somewhere along the line

#58
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You need combat for most aspects of the game.


I'd have to dispute that point with you. If that's all there was to RS, then I'd have given up on it years ago as just another combat-centric MMO ('cause lord knows we don't have enough of those /sarcasm). I hardly ever do combat, and have enjoyed many, many hours in this game.


Make a new account and tell me how much of the game you can access without combat.

Quests/summoning in non combat situations/etc.

Lets say that you don't like the new combat system it affects the whole game for you since a lot of the game DOES revolve around combat somewhere along the line

Even things you can do without combat basically require combat in some way. You can personally avoid it due to being able to trade, but someone along the line has to do combat to make things possible.

#59
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I hope Kaida meant that at some point in the game, his abilities in combat, or combat in general is not needed. Pure skillers still exist in Runescape; however inefficient thay are at the game, they have found a way to play without combat. Considering what Kaida does in game I doubt he needs to kill something. Yes he has combat levels but if he really didn't want them he could have played this game as a level 3 now level 4. Is he missing out on content? Yes. But combat isn't required to enjoy this game, which is what it comes down to. I think Kaida is saying for what he enjoys, he doesn't need a combat level.

Also, Kaida is F2P. Even with max combat stats minus Summoning, there is a lot of this game he can't access without become P2P. :\
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#60
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A perfect example of people not knowing what they want and then not being happy when they do get what they think they want.

OSRS is exactly what the EoC haters wanted. Both Jagex and OSRS supporters knew exactly what was going to happen. You don't like it? Tough.

The amount of baseless conjecture and opinion construed as fact in this thread is laughable at best.

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