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Inb4removed because it's too constructive. The situation 2 days ago really showed some weaknesses in the current system- instead of working on removing the obviously bogus ban, the moderation decided to ban users talking about the situation, therefor escalating it to a whole nother level, not to mention, they also failed us in trying to remove the guide. Instead of being open about it and discuss their position, they tried to play hide and seek which obviously didn't go too well either. This really calls for more openness in the system, something of which we don't see at all.

With maxed pace and 99 thieving, pyramid plunder is around 230-250k xp an hour, and it isn't too monotonous. The goal is to open some urns in 3rd best room and all urns in the best two rooms. Opening sarcophagi in higher rooms is also helpful. For money, they are both bad in terms of profit but i think the monkeys give a bit more loot.

It's a big ask when you've been wrongfully banned and part of the community will still kick when you are down. There are obviously alot of issues that need solving and i don't see anything improving until some hard decisions are made.

Thanks for all the support. It meant alot to us in those dire times and i'm not sure if we could have done it without the communities heartwarming response. :thumbsup:

Anyone who says cls is a better overall weapon that rapier deserves to be called an idiot. I think we find these disagreements because the guy only has the level for a single chaotic, and he obviously picked the wrong one. What cls is better at is bandos with div/ely or saradomin, and that's about it(some smaller wrinkles, but maul can be even better then). If you are going to argue this point you need quantifiable evidence(not gibberish about you feeling something), because from every angle, the numbers say rapier is far superior. As for dungeoneering, DGS is not meant to help people achieve chaotics or frosts- they don't specifically serve to those goals, so it's highly understandable why a low level dungeoneers would have a tough time there. The goal is to teach and produce skillful dungeoneers, and that requires players to go well beyond 90 and to learn discipline. And before you get mad at me for saying they don't serve low levels, anything under 105 is an autoban from 3bo(and under 100 for udg), so be happy with what you have. As for the question at hand, you'll likely want sw cape for dk's, but otherwise it's quite useless(fire cape is better for most things, or atleast an equal alternative). Get rapier ASAP. You'll likely be sorry for not getting it much, much sooner(it's around 15% better than a whip at most places by pure dps).

Can you name something that isn't fun? For a select amount of time, anything can be fun, so the advice for fun would be: do anything. Doesn't sound helpful to me.

Maybe he just has stubbornness vs levers. Just because he doesn't know how to effectively do one puzzle (which is more of a grammatical problem, to be honest) doesn't mean he is unwilling to learn. Also levers aren't a very common puzzle. Proposing that everyone should do a puzzle the way he says just because of stagnation sounds extremely unwilling to learn to me. In dgs, it's extremely offensive if a rank tells you to do something and you ignore it, let alone disagree. This guy here wants everyone to do what he thins is logical because people used to do that, siting that it makes you pro at dungeoneering. That is unacceptable in pro dungeoneering these days. The rarity of the puzzle really doesn't matter, and i don't think around 0.7 per large floor is too rare.

Never read this thread before but it's really funny as hell... I have no idea why jimi would invite this guy to dgs as his willingness to learn is -123.

It's not a personal attack, it's the way i feel about him. I formulate my opinion on what i see and hear, and i'm free to post that. I know that even people higher up admit that having moderators who play the game is important, and i don't think him being retired does him any favors moderating largely game related subjects in GD and H&A. His sig and the attitude formulates the second part of what i believe about him, though yeah, this thread really isn't a place to discuss that. We are discussing a very sensitive subject on this thread, and him instigating with really very strange ideas about how H&A should work(how it doesn't and wouldn't) frankly baffles me.

I have absolutely no problem with people making fun of me based on that. You also assume that everything that isn't efficient is inefficient, which really isn't true. It's common for people to laugh at stupidity in real life, but it's a serious offense to do so in rs? please... And ofcource, grimy, i agree. As a mod danq should know better than to instigate heated debates on this soft subject, particularly as he can't take any sides(he is retired, likely looks down on people who do play based on some of what he does/says).

I agree with you on subjectivity until you say that advice cannot be given on fun due to its subjectivity. It is harder to give advice concerning fun, but not impossible. Advice may be the wrong word, suggestion probably fits better. I see no harm in somebody suggesting a method they find fun if it has some relevance to the OP's request as it is still giving them advice. Yes those who flame efficient posts are in the wrong, but also are those who flame inefficient posts. both sides need to calm down, either ignore the others or learn how to reply with respect and subtlety. If the H&A was setup the way you suggest it should the answer to a simple question of how to train strength would be: A) push trough wheat on puro-puro B) fish sharks without a harpoon C) use a lava titan familiar All of them correct, all of them fun in some sense(as it's so hard to gauge fun), but also all of them absolutely catastrophically useless for anyone with a brain. Do you see a problem here? Advice should be given by experts who know of the proper way of doing things. Efficiency is that expertise. As for the latter, i see nothing wrong with giggling at a 138 with ROL and bunyip at frost dragons claiming 80 KPH. We aren't hurting him in any way, just having fun. There comes a time and place where it's no longer sensible to explain every single detail that you'd expect everyone to already know. If you aren't as knowledgeable and don't thrive for the knowledge, then you just need to accept that and not try to chip in with your sub-par knowledge, which i believe should rightly be(or is) a reportable offense. The knowledge these few people have accumulated hasn't come overnight and certainly not by pissing off those more knowledgeable than we are. Learning is a virtue.

Rune cbow+ runite bolts(the best bolts to use) are better than karils crossbow, mostly because of the longer range.

Super antifires over normal antifires are basically free herblore xp, so i'd say it's always worth using them if you can make them. And no, they don't have any advantage over normal for ranging/maging.

Though posting wrong information/bad ideas isn't considered trolling, a superior of yours has said they both go under the same rules as flaming/trolling and are reportable offenses(atlest in H&A, sometimes in more serious GD topics). And yeah, i agree with green in this post being a horrible example of the TIF intellectual community- a retired player, still a moderator looking at logic the way it never should be looked at. Efficiency is objective. If you take enough parameters into account the efficient method will always be the best method of doing things. The usual suspects are cost and xp rates, but afkness and clicking intensity can also be considered to make it more objective, thus many methods can be efficient for the same skill at the same income. Fun is subjective. What one considers fun may very well be extremely boring for another person. It is also really hard to judge what people do consider fun- for most everything, doing anything for 18 hours straight is not fun, thus it's extremely hard to judge how fun a method is, judge how it stacks up against other methods or how it may seem to another person. Taking this knowledge into account, H&A, in the mind of this moderator, should be an endless stream of spam of anything anyone can every think of. Everything can be fun for a short amount of time, thus anything that even remotely fits under the bill of training could be advised(training strength pushing trough wheat, for example). What i see as help and advice is more knowledgeable and experienced players giving their best and most efficient knowledge(as efficiency is objective, remember) to train select skills, and for the majority of occasions, this works very well. The times it doesn't work is when the OP has misunderstandings about efficiency or when less knowledgeable people try to chip in with bad advice, in which case it can get ugly. Then again, i've only seen a guidelines list of H&A improvements from the efficiency clowns, not those who call us that, so that is something you all should consider. H&A IS about efficiency, whether you like it or not.

I'm sorry, but counting your own H&A thread (http://forum.tip.it/topic/291467-25-dks/), there are atleast 7 efficiency clowns there helping you get better, plus one of them has written a whole guide about the very subject...

This very subject is under intense discussions to see what the leadership of TIF feel about the community going forward. Hopefully there will be space for those of us who want to discuss serious mechanics of this game. Also, what i've been told by an administrator, ignorance and blatant stupidity go under the same rule aswell, so if someone does say a godsword is better than a whip you can report them for flaming/trolling. I think this is a discussion where one would be best served in actively playing the game to formulate a well balanced opinion. Not having anthing to do with either camp and just watching discussions from afar don't seem enough in my opinion.

This is actually something very interesting which i've also wandered about. In the old days noone used to have hoods and it really wasn't a massive problem with abandoned floors, which leads to some interesting discussions. But first 2 interesting notes about the hood: The more people have a hood in a team the more necessary one becomes. We are used to lower levels without one getting raped, but that's mostly because the damage isn't shared between the team, which it would be assuming the others also didn't have hoods. The more binds you can have, the less useful a hood becomes. Most of the usefulness comes from having 2-3 binds, but with 4-5 binds(assuming we are getting a new one) i believe all 120 teams would be well served without them. One problem that i do see with the proposed binds is that you favor a blood necklace, which i don't think offers much for a hex user. If you are going to not have a hood, plate and body armor is almost 100% necessary, and the sag chaps would add more for a hex user. With either sag body, chaps or prim plate, legs, your mage/range def would be high enough to allow you to tank those styles and be basically protected from all combat styles very well, aswell as have useful binds against bosses. I believe no matter what a hood bind would always be a must for keyers as it can prevent a large portion of damage, but for DPS, a hood bind doesn't have such significance and being unhooded, assuming all your team are aswell, could share all the damage equally, be better than if they did have hoods(and have someone always tank a monster) with more turmoil flashing. The problem with all this that although it might be better(one drawback is mime rooms, but they would take around 20 seconds to clear usually), i doubt many would actually go out and test this as it requires many high level dungeoneers to destroy their hoods without knowing if it will actually be better. As for hex, as already discussed, sniper>desperado(but for bosses) and leech ranged/def> rigour(but for bosses).

I'd say to get all ingredients(assuming you buy from shop and fill vials), then teleport to gd and immediately after the gd go do your door. If it takes farming you first plant seed, then do gd, then buy ingredients/vials and then open your door. I would suggest all higher level herblorist buy claw, moss and whiskey from the shop as soon as they can and fill 2-3 vials with water. As getting herbs from drops and chests is quite easy, this can save you alot of time farming or teleporting to base to get ingredients/water. The goal is to waste as little time on the pot as possible and to not miss out on any gd's.

So the best completed floor i've seen is 19 minutes(rounded up), and the best we have had thus far is also 19 minutes, admittedly warped vs. abandoned, though they are nearly the same. Yeah, you guys are head and shoulders better than DGS.

Cheaper? relative to bxw, yes, but if you looked at grimys sheets(oh, you can't...) you'd see that the gp/xp figures are still nearly the same so no, they haven't and i doubt they will- most of the cheapness comes from gp being easier to accumulate.

I this would be a fair question to ask from Michael Vick.... Other than that, your max hit on wild dogs with no weapon should be around 640, so they don't even have enough LP to test that. As far as i know, you do get xp from the extra hit, but that still makes them in no way a good training spot(only top tiear players can manage to get the gloves and the possible ~100k xp an hour would be low at that point).

with what method? at best, i'd say over 4m

*with rune bolts. Rune bolts are more efficient for monsters with valuable drops.

It's not really about opening to the general public as it is about not having enough support from the administration to keep going under the tif banner.

You should mass; your stats are terrible for a good team(only melee is good and you have att/str of a level ~100). Defense basically doesn't matter.