Is God real post your thoughts!

[Zierro]

The point is, regardless of how much you want to argue semantics, you're equating the possiblity of God's existence with that of the dinosaurs. Some would venture to call that dumb. Most of them have scientific minds. I'm going with them on this.

 

 

 

Well, if we're allowed to compare god's existence to that of an orbiting teapot, the tooth fairy, the flying spaghetti monster, etc. then I'd reckon anything is fair game.

[Rebdragon]

Those are hypothetical logical comparisons. Dinosaurs kind of ain't that.

[Zierro]

If it's not a logical comparison, what would that make it then? I agree with your point Reb, I think it's silly to compare god's existence to anything but it is already a widely acceptable view held by most on this thread to compare freely at will. What makes comparing dinosaurs (something obviously true) so different than comparing the tooth fairy (something obviously false)?

[Rebdragon]

I personally am not a fan of the tooth fairy comparison. As I said, I prefer the hypotheticals, like the FSM or the orbiting teacup. They're not striving to make a probability comparison (as that is futile), but rather a logical point (FSM: Anyone can make up a supernatural being, teacup: cannot disprove it's existence, yet that is still not evidence for).

 

 

 

So, to answer your question, I don't like either of those comparisons, the tooth fairy and the dinosaurs. Those are worthless comparisons, ones that merely end with the point "God exists" or "God does not". These are worthless statements, making any such comparison based solely on probabilities moot.

[Perakp]

Would God still exist, if everyone stopped believing in Him?

 

 

 

hypothetical but still #-o

 

 

 

 

 

Also, do only sapiens get into heaven, what about religious neanderthals? (were there any?)

[dpattle]

Would God still exist, if everyone stopped believing in Him?

 

 

 

hypothetical but still #-o

 

 

 

 

 

Also, do only sapiens get into heaven, what about religious neanderthals? (were there any?)

 

 

 

If everyone stopped believing in gravity, would that still exist? and neanderthals? really? If there were, then they'd prolly get into heaven if they believed in God, seeing as we know that religion was the main aspect of life in the past....and still is imo

[D Jay99]

Would God still exist, if everyone stopped believing in Him?

 

 

 

hypothetical but still #-o

 

 

 

 

 

Also, do only sapiens get into heaven, what about religious neanderthals? (were there any?)

 

 

 

If everyone stopped believing in gravity, would that still exist? and neanderthals? really? If there were, then they'd prolly get into heaven if they believed in God, seeing as we know that religion was the main aspect of life in the past....and still is imo

 

Is there proof for gravity?

 

 

 

It all comes down to proof in my opinion, and I haven't seen any sufficient proof for a god yet.

[Perakp]

If everyone stopped believing in gravity, would that still exist?

 

That is a very good question! ;) :P

 

I think you guys could debate it for 10 pages

[halo2_rocks7]

Disclaimer: WHAT I AM SAYING IS MY OWN OPINION AND NOT THAT OF TIP.IT!!

 

 

 

You can't compare God to anything. He doesn't exist. Believing in God is having a faith. A faith that there is something else out there. Something that goes beyond anything me or you can ever understand. Personally, I believe that the world was created 13+ billion years ago. I believe that there were dinosaurs, and that life started out in the ocean. If you don't like my opinion, too bad; that's your problem. Do I say that people who believe in God, or Allah, or Buddha, are idiots because they believe in (their own respective) God? No, it's their own belief. People are entitled to their own opinion, and should leave it at that. What I don't like, however, is other people who try to impose their belief on others. I don't give a crap if you're "trying to make people see the light". If you want to make people believe in something, make them look at all the different religions/beliefs and then see what they think. Now some of you might argue "aww but halo god doesnt exist cant u see that?" What you don't see is that everything we believe in tries to answer the same questions: Why are we here? What is our purpose? Is there something beyond our own puny life? We all try and answer it with our own beliefs. Whether it be with God, or Buddha, or from microorganisms from the ocean billions of years ago. They all try and answer the same thing.

 

 

 

So please stop crying over eachother trying to disprove eachother. Really, it's sad.

 

 

 

Disclaimer: WHAT I AM SAYING IS MY OWN OPINION AND NOT THAT OF TIP.IT!!

[magekillr]

I wasn't trying to be funny? #-o maybe I should've expanded more?

 

 

 

If he's trying to point out that he believes in Dinosaurs, he's never actually seen them, but he believes in them.

 

People believe in God, we haven't actually seen one, but we have things such as the bible and the Qur'an that talk about them.

 

The expansion wasn't necessary; all that was required was your statement that you were not making a joke.

 

 

 

The point is, regardless of how much you want to argue semantics, you're equating the possiblity of God's existence with that of the dinosaurs. Some would venture to call that dumb. Most of them have scientific minds. I'm going with them on this.

 

 

 

Note: If you're merely arguing semantics, stop, it's annoying. If you're actually trying to go somewhere with this argument, uh, please stop.

 

 

 

Awesome, so awesome. I lol'd, thanks, Reb. :lol: .

[Obtaurian]

I get your point, but this raises more points... The theory that I believe is that there is only one super natural being, beyond human comprehension. Every path will eventually lead you to the top of the mountain, with paths being different religions and the top of the mountain a God. With so many references to this "God" all over the world and them being incredibly old, how can you argue that any source of reference to God, written in that time is not considered a primary resource?

 

 

 

There are also seven Harry Potter books. SEVEN. Hogwarts MUST exist.

 

 

 

Harry Potter is not considered a primary resource. Do you even know what a primary resource is? Go google it, and find out how you've already failed to disprove my point.

 

 

 

Oh man, I'm lol'ing again. I think Reb summed up my thoughts quite well.

[Perakp]

Believing in God is having a faith. A faith that there is something else out there. Something that goes beyond anything me or you can ever understand.

 

I personally can't understand how one can believe in something that can't be understood.

 

 

 

What you don't see is that everything we believe in tries to answer the same questions: Why are we here? What is our purpose? Is there something beyond our own puny life? We all try and answer it with our own beliefs. Whether it be with God, or Buddha, or from microorganisms from the ocean billions of years ago. They all try and answer the same thing.

 

How do religions answer those questions?

 

So far I've only gathered from them, that our purpose here is to wait for the armageddon to begin. #-o

 

 

 

Atheism's asnwer is simple (or if it isn't atheism's answer, it is my own): There is no purpose. And it is ok that way.

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with the rest I think :(

[i_love_burritos]

It's funny because, I believe Promise was being serious, and when Rebdragon cut the point short, Promise suddenly went off on a defensive tanget, arguing that it was improper phrasing.

 

 

 

Rebdragon, you icy bastard.

 

 

 

How can you command such respect ?

[mmmcannibalism]

Believing in God is having a faith. A faith that there is something else out there. Something that goes beyond anything me or you can ever understand.

 

I personally can't understand how one can believe in something that can't be understood.

 

 

 

What you don't see is that everything we believe in tries to answer the same questions: Why are we here? What is our purpose? Is there something beyond our own puny life? We all try and answer it with our own beliefs. Whether it be with God, or Buddha, or from microorganisms from the ocean billions of years ago. They all try and answer the same thing.

 

How do religions answer those questions?

 

So far I've only gathered from them, that our purpose here is to wait for the armageddon to begin. #-o

 

 

 

Atheism's asnwer is simple (or if it isn't atheism's answer, it is my own): There is no purpose. And it is ok that way.

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with the rest I think :(

 

 

 

Faith is faith, its just a longing for their to be some greater purpose taking on some form. If you dont understand it you dont understand it

 

 

 

religions tell some story as to why we are here, and guide people through their lives. If there isnt any higher power then nihilism is entirely accurate, and a lot of people dont like to just throw in the towel and say everything is meaningless.

[warri0r45]

religions tell some story as to why we are here, and guide people through their lives. If there isnt any higher power then nihilism is entirely accurate, and a lot of people dont like to just throw in the towel and say everything is meaningless.

 

How does god existing make life any more meaningful? Because you believe you'll get a reward in an afterlife? Because you need some cosmic father figure to feel significant? If god doesn't exist then we still have something to live for, and that's life in the here and now. Life should be reward enough, especially so if it's the only one we have.

 

 

 

We all have hopes and dreams to make something of ourselves, to be surrounded with good people and to enjoy all that life has to offer. We all have things that are meaningful to us and dreams that drive us. Life is not meaningless without god.

[magekillr]

religions tell some story as to why we are here, and guide people through their lives. If there isnt any higher power then nihilism is entirely accurate, and a lot of people dont like to just throw in the towel and say everything is meaningless.

 

 

 

How does god existing make life any more meaningful? Because you believe you'll get a reward in an afterlife? Because you need some cosmic father figure to feel significant? If god doesn't exist then we still have something to live for, and that's life in the here and now. Life should be reward enough, especially so if it's the only one we have.

 

 

 

We all have hopes and dreams to make something of ourselves, to be surrounded with good people and to enjoy all that life has to offer. We all have things that are meaningful to us and dreams that drive us. Life is not meaningless without god.

 

 

 

Who really cares about meaning anyway? As George Carlin said:

 

 

 

Life is not that complicated. You get up, you go to work, eat three meals, you take one good [cabbage] and you go back to bed. Whats the [bleep]ing mystery?!

 

 

 

Do we really even need meaning? Who cares about meaning, just live your life to the fullest.

[EdgedThesis]

What you don't see is that everything we believe in tries to answer the same questions: Why are we here? What is our purpose? Is there something beyond our own puny life? We all try and answer it with our own beliefs. Whether it be with God, or Buddha, or from microorganisms from the ocean billions of years ago. They all try and answer the same thing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Some us do not presume that we have some deep-rooted, divine, cosmic purpose.

 

 

 

Our existence is directionless, save for whatever purpose we command ourselves.

 

 

 

So in a way, I guess deceiving yourself (I'm assuming God isn't real here) into creating a larger purpose would fit into this framework well enough. Though it wouldn't be as productive.

[mmmcannibalism]

religions tell some story as to why we are here, and guide people through their lives. If there isnt any higher power then nihilism is entirely accurate, and a lot of people dont like to just throw in the towel and say everything is meaningless.

 

 

 

How does god existing make life any more meaningful? Because you believe you'll get a reward in an afterlife? Because you need some cosmic father figure to feel significant? If god doesn't exist then we still have something to live for, and that's life in the here and now. Life should be reward enough, especially so if it's the only one we have.

 

 

 

We all have hopes and dreams to make something of ourselves, to be surrounded with good people and to enjoy all that life has to offer. We all have things that are meaningful to us and dreams that drive us. Life is not meaningless without god.

 

 

 

I agree entirely, I was just saying that some people need/want there to be something afterdeath. In a way it makes it more meaningful because your life will have a purpose other then its effect on the human race. Living for the fun of it and to help the human race is enough for me, some people just want their to be a higher meaning.

[Zierro]

Life is not meaningless without god.

 

 

 

I think life with god would be more meaningful than without. If we were just a mere accident, then that implies that there is nothing special about us at all. Sure, there is the fact that we overcame those ridiculous odds, but that's not really for us to gloat about since we had nothing to do with it (in the sense that we did not choose to evolve into humans from microorganisms). We are nothing more than a byproduct of the universe - like dust. If god exists, that implies meaning because there is always a reason for creating something. An artist paints to make something beautiful, a lyricist writes to appeal to the audience's ear, a chef cooks to make a delightfully tasty dish. If there is a god then we can wager that we have a reason for being here.

[Dizzle229]

Disclaimer: WHAT I AM SAYING IS MY OWN OPINION AND NOT THAT OF TIP.IT!!

 

 

 

You can't compare God to anything. He doesn't exist. Believing in God is having a faith. A faith that there is something else out there. Something that goes beyond anything me or you can ever understand. Personally, I believe that the world was created 13+ billion years ago. I believe that there were dinosaurs, and that life started out in the ocean. If you don't like my opinion, too bad; that's your problem. Do I say that people who believe in God, or Allah, or Buddha, are idiots because they believe in (their own respective) God? No, it's their own belief. People are entitled to their own opinion, and should leave it at that. What I don't like, however, is other people who try to impose their belief on others. I don't give a crap if you're "trying to make people see the light". If you want to make people believe in something, make them look at all the different religions/beliefs and then see what they think. Now some of you might argue "aww but halo god doesnt exist cant u see that?" What you don't see is that everything we believe in tries to answer the same questions: Why are we here? What is our purpose? Is there something beyond our own puny life? We all try and answer it with our own beliefs. Whether it be with God, or Buddha, or from microorganisms from the ocean billions of years ago. They all try and answer the same thing.

 

 

 

So please stop crying over eachother trying to disprove eachother. Really, it's sad.

 

 

 

Disclaimer: WHAT I AM SAYING IS MY OWN OPINION AND NOT THAT OF TIP.IT!!

 

 

 

You just won the thread.

 

 

 

Atheists say: I hate it when religious people push their beliefs on me!

 

 

 

You have a point, but it's equally annoying when you do it to us.

 

 

 

Halorocks, here $100,000,000, enjoy it.

[Obtaurian]

Life is not meaningless without god.

 

 

 

I think life with god would be more meaningful than without. If we were just a mere accident, then that implies that there is nothing special about us at all. Sure, there is the fact that we overcame those ridiculous odds, but that's not really for us to gloat about since we had nothing to do with it (in the sense that we did not choose to evolve into humans from microorganisms). We are nothing more than a byproduct of the universe - like dust. If god exists, that implies meaning because there is always a reason for creating something. An artist paints to make something beautiful, a lyricist writes to appeal to the audience's ear, a chef cooks to make a delightfully tasty dish. If there is a god then we can wager that we have a reason for being here.

 

 

 

You lack the confidence to create your own meaning and worth? If you live to die, what can you possibly contribute to the well being of the human race? If you live to live, you see the value in contributing to society, in furthering yourself as a person rather than preparing for death. If you lack talent and creativity, live for your family.

 

 

 

You look forward to death because you're lazy, or maybe because you just don't care. People like you are the reason that we have yet to embrace cultural and physical differences. People who believe that the afterlife is the only life that matters are why we have yet to solve world hunger, AIDS, and cancer. If you don't care, how do you expect to contribute to the world as a whole?

[Zierro]

You lack the confidence to create your own meaning and worth?

 

 

 

Actually I do create meaning for my own life. I guess you misunderstood. I was saying that anything (namely life) is more meaningful if it were created and not accidental. Compare dust to the Statue of David.

 

 

 

If you live to die, what can you possibly contribute to the well being of the human race? If you live to live, you see the value in contributing to society, in furthering yourself as a person rather than preparing for death. If you lack talent and creativity, live for your family.

 

 

 

You look forward to death because you're lazy, or maybe because you just don't care. People like you are the reason that we have yet to embrace cultural and physical differences. People who believe that the afterlife is the only life that matters are why we have yet to solve world hunger, AIDS, and cancer. If you don't care, how do you expect to contribute to the world as a whole?

 

 

 

You're putting words into my mouth. I didn't say that we should live to die. :? And what do you mean "people like you"? lol

[warri0r45]

Life is not meaningless without god.

 

 

 

I think life with god would be more meaningful than without. If we were just a mere accident, then that implies that there is nothing special about us at all. Sure, there is the fact that we overcame those ridiculous odds, but that's not really for us to gloat about since we had nothing to do with it (in the sense that we did not choose to evolve into humans from microorganisms). We are nothing more than a byproduct of the universe - like dust. If god exists, that implies meaning because there is always a reason for creating something. An artist paints to make something beautiful, a lyricist writes to appeal to the audience's ear, a chef cooks to make a delightfully tasty dish. If there is a god then we can wager that we have a reason for being here.

 

 

 

Depends if you believe the reason for god putting us here is a good one.

 

 

 

It seems to me that something being meaningful is relative to whether or not you take meaning from it. I could look at the lyrics of a love song and think they're cliche and overly sentimental, but to someone else they could be the most meaningful thing in the world. Or, I could strive to be a scientist that helps humanity and find great meaning and purpose in that, while a religious person may rather see meaning and purpose in praying every day and going to church.

 

 

 

What reason do you think god has for putting us here? To give us an eternal reward? To me an eternity of anything is no reward. Or maybe you think the reason is to have a relationship with god? I don't care for that, I'd rather have a relationship with real people that I can relate to on a human level. I'd rather help people in a tangible way and enjoy my life while I'm here. That's what matters to me.

 

 

 

I'm not really interested in grading "meaning" on a scale and arguing like that (because as I said, I think it's relative), so I'd just like to say I'm completely fine with the possibility that we're here for no god-given reason.

[Lateralus]

religions tell some story as to why we are here, and guide people through their lives. If there isnt any higher power then nihilism is entirely accurate, and a lot of people dont like to just throw in the towel and say everything is meaningless.

 

How does god existing make life any more meaningful? Because you believe you'll get a reward in an afterlife? Because you need some cosmic father figure to feel significant? If god doesn't exist then we still have something to live for, and that's life in the here and now. Life should be reward enough, especially so if it's the only one we have.

 

 

 

We all have hopes and dreams to make something of ourselves, to be surrounded with good people and to enjoy all that life has to offer. We all have things that are meaningful to us and dreams that drive us. Life is not meaningless without god.

 

 

 

Life has no purpose without a God. We're here - That's all. I fully appreciate what you're saying, and I agree that we can assign value and significance to things, but without a God humans are just a burp on a useless little planet in a indifferent universe. I know that non-believers can and do live just as enjoyable and worthwhile lives as believers, but ultimately we're toiling in futility. The nihilistic problem can only be escaped through some kind of God.

 

 

 

EDIT: I should add that Nietzsche viewed Christianity as nihilistic as well because it devalues the importance of life on earth.

[warri0r45]

religions tell some story as to why we are here, and guide people through their lives. If there isnt any higher power then nihilism is entirely accurate, and a lot of people dont like to just throw in the towel and say everything is meaningless.

 

How does god existing make life any more meaningful? Because you believe you'll get a reward in an afterlife? Because you need some cosmic father figure to feel significant? If god doesn't exist then we still have something to live for, and that's life in the here and now. Life should be reward enough, especially so if it's the only one we have.

 

 

 

We all have hopes and dreams to make something of ourselves, to be surrounded with good people and to enjoy all that life has to offer. We all have things that are meaningful to us and dreams that drive us. Life is not meaningless without god.

 

 

 

Life has no purpose without a God. We're here - That's all. I fully appreciate what you're saying, and I agree that we can assign value and significance to things, but without a God humans are just a burp on a useless little planet in a indifferent universe. I know that non-believers can and do live just as enjoyable and worthwhile lives as believers, but ultimately we're toiling in futility. The nihilistic problem can only be escaped through some kind of God.

 

 

 

No universal or absolute purpose, sure. I have no problem with admitting that, but my question to you is why should that matter? What matters to me is that this burp on this useless little planet in this indifferent universe can make something out of it. What matters is that the meaning and purpose are mine and not the will of someone else. To me, getting a sense of purpose from god is as good as being a lawyer because your parents want you to be. What does that mean to the kid? Maybe he might like that, but then again he might not. At the end of the day it's him alone who imposes the value on that occupation, it's him alone who dictates that it has some relevance or meaning to him.