"I want a girlfriend/boyfriend", and other such relationship advice

[muggiwhplar]

So wait are you guys mad about his approach to his lifestyle, or the choice he made for his lifestyle? Child support is an issue regardless if you're married and alimony is settled with prenups beforehand. Planning finances and life goals isn't an issue unique to monogamy, either, nor is becoming completely infatuated with the idea of something rather than the reality.

 

 

...But seriously, I'm basically saying what he wants isn't what's going to end up happening. Therefore, it's crazy to start making sacrifices and being unhappy for the sake of pursuing something that will never come to fruition. You're right in that many of these ideas aren't exclusive to monogamy, but I don't really see what you're getting at >_>

 

At the end of the day, a lot of you still disagree with my assertions regarding the implications of long-term monogamy. And that's fine, I guess, but you have to keep in mind that you have to make some extreme sacrifices and put your money where your mouth is in order to see if your beliefs are actually possible. I don't consider that worth the risk in any way whatsoever, especially when all of the "rewards" and "benefits" of long-term monogamy can be obtained without promising monogamy and without the massive risks, sacrifices, and compromises.

[Noxx]

Okay so basically you're saying that there's a "chance", however big or small it may be, that everything you're saying will in fact one day become my reality. You believe that it's more probable for it to happen rather than a "happily-ever-after". Therefor i should abandon all hope now, before it's too late?

 

Assuming that this is correct, aren't you telling me to run away from something just because it MIGHT not turn out the way i hope? Heck, then i might as well quit school now and become a hobo, because my career also MIGHT not turn out the way i have it all planned in my head.

 

Also, my parents ([bleep]ed up as they are), have been married for almost 28 years now. I know very well that 4-5 nights a week, when they go to bed, i should stay clear of their bedroom door for an hour or two to avoid nightmares. It's been 28 years and they're more active than me and my girlfriend are at the moment. My dad is an accountant. He's more than provided for his family. Okay, we're only two children. No big deal. But even if we were 7 children we would still be able to afford our current lifestyle. I plan on being a pilot, in the middle east. 10 years from now, assuming all goes well, i'll have a ~$250k salary in a tax free country. Pretty sure that's more than enough to provide a middle-class lifestyle. I'm not saying i'm going to have 5 kids, as i said it's just a number. But even if i did have 5 kids, i think i'd do alright (again, assuming things go according to my 10-year plan).

 

Many variables come into play no matter how you choose to look at it (from a mono or poly point of view). There will always be that one mono couple that dies at the age of 90 while having sex. And there will always be that one poly couple that dies at the age of 70 of a stoke induced by a rage-full argument.

 

And i think you totally missed my OP. I think you missed the plot. I was not asking for reassurance on anything.

Instead, i was asking for advice on how to approach my parents, and by doing so "re-assure" my girlfriend that i'm not their pet, nor do i want to be their pet. As that, at the moment, is the only thing that really concerns me in our relationship (that being my parents' drama). That is why, in my OP, i said this is more of a parental/girlfriend advice post.

[Randox]

Muggi's prejudice against monogamy aside, it is something worth considering that major sacrifices so early in a relationship are often...ill advised, especially since it can breed resentment down the road which will kill the relationship. There are many people on this planet that you could be happy with. You only have one set of parents. Don't burn that bridge.

 

For dealing with your parents, assuming that you don't want to burn that bridge, you are going to have to walk the line between obedience and defiance. You need some measure of defiance just to prevent them from closing ranks on you, assuming even more control. You seem to have some level of leverage, at least for now, and that's buying you some obvious latitude since they haven't come out with the 'us or her' ultimatum yet.

 

As for her, I am of two minds with this. The position is incredibly selfish, that you should give up your family and set your dreams back by years so that she can see you more often and more regularly. Read that outloud a few times. However, I find that many people are mad at the situation, and will simply direct their anger wherever they can. She can't direct it at the situation itself becuase it's an abstract concept. She can't direct it to your parents either, so she is angry at you. At some point though, she is going to have to actually think about the situation you are in, accept that the situation exists, and deal with it. If she is legitimately angry at you for not doing all of that, then this is not someone you should be dedicating your life too.

 

 

Really at the end of the day though, it's a cost-benefit analysis if you like. You stand to lose substantially more by getting kicked out by your parents because you'll lose something that you can never get back, something that is immediately much more valuable for setting up the rest of your life.

[muggiwhplar]

Okay so basically you're saying that there's a "chance", however big or small it may be, that everything you're saying will in fact one day become my reality. You believe that it's more probable for it to happen rather than a "happily-ever-after". Therefor i should abandon all hope now, before it's too late?

 

I'm not saying "abandon all hope"; I'm saying that assuming I am correct, act accordingly. This means don't make stupid decisions, compromises, or sacrifices which will eventually have been in vain. If you want to get married, get a prenup. If you want to move in together, don't co-own anything. If you want to stay with her for a very long time, make a list of things which you will and will not compromise on, ever, because you know deep down that doing so would be a mistake. Prioritizing a relationship over everything else in your life (especially your own happiness) never works out well. Whether you like it or not, this special girl of yours is completely replaceable (and IMO temporary). The same cannot be said for your parents.

 

Also, my parents ([bleep]ed up as they are), have been married for almost 28 years now. I know very well that 4-5 nights a week, when they go to bed, i should stay clear of their bedroom door for an hour or two to avoid nightmares. It's been 28 years and they're more active than me and my girlfriend are at the moment. My dad is an accountant. He's more than provided for his family. Okay, we're only two children. No big deal. But even if we were 7 children we would still be able to afford our current lifestyle. I plan on being a pilot, in the middle east. 10 years from now, assuming all goes well, i'll have a ~$250k salary in a tax free country. Pretty sure that's more than enough to provide a middle-class lifestyle. I'm not saying i'm going to have 5 kids, as i said it's just a number. But even if i did have 5 kids, i think i'd do alright (again, assuming things go according to my 10-year plan).

 

Makes me wonder if they've ever cheated on each other :P

 

Glad to see you've planned financially in that aspect. Do you plan on getting a prenup? Have you looked into how alimony works in your area? Are you ok with going without sex for months at a time if your wife doesn't feel like it? Are you ok with not being able to see other women under such circumstances? What are you going to do if your wife starts getting fat and grumpy?

[Noxx]

Muggi's prejudice against monogamy aside, it is something worth considering that major sacrifices so early in a relationship are often...ill advised, especially since it can breed resentment down the road which will kill the relationship. There are many people on this planet that you could be happy with. You only have one set of parents. Don't burn that bridge.

 

For dealing with your parents, assuming that you don't want to burn that bridge, you are going to have to walk the line between obedience and defiance. You need some measure of defiance just to prevent them from closing ranks on you, assuming even more control. You seem to have some level of leverage, at least for now, and that's buying you some obvious latitude since they haven't come out with the 'us or her' ultimatum yet.

 

As for her, I am of two minds with this. The position is incredibly selfish, that you should give up your family and set your dreams back by years so that she can see you more often and more regularly. Read that outloud a few times. However, I find that many people are mad at the situation, and will simply direct their anger wherever they can. She can't direct it at the situation itself becuase it's an abstract concept. She can't direct it to your parents either, so she is angry at you. At some point though, she is going to have to actually think about the situation you are in, accept that the situation exists, and deal with it. If she is legitimately angry at you for not doing all of that, then this is not someone you should be dedicating your life too.

 

 

Really at the end of the day though, it's a cost-benefit analysis if you like. You stand to lose substantially more by getting kicked out by your parents because you'll lose something that you can never get back, something that is immediately much more valuable for setting up the rest of your life.

Look, the situation with my parents is something that has bothered me for the past 4 years. The only way i could ever make them approve of any of my relationships is if i come home with a white girl. Sadly, i am not as attracted to white girls as i am to "darker" girls. That is just my personal preference, and a preference they do not agree with. So, ultimately, i'm going to end up with the same issue i have now. Whether it's now, or 10 years down the line, i'm going to have the same problem. Sooner or later i'm going to get the "her or us" ultimatum from them, it might just be with a different girl. But i WILL end up in the exact same position. It's something me and my sister has struggled with for a very long time now (she is dating an arabic guy, and they don't approve of him either).

My girlfriend isn't angry that i spend more time with my parents than i do with her, because i actually spend a lot more time with her than i do with them. What she's angry about, is that fact that i give in to them as easily as i do, and always at the most inconvenient of times. I would go over to her house, pick her up, and we would make our way out. We would be out for dinner, waiting for our food to arrive, and i would get a call from one of my parents saying they need me home NOW, with some bullshit excuse. I'd argue with them, over the phone, for a few minutes. This would lead to the same speech as always (kick you out of the house, cut you off, etc.) and to avoid any further flames, i would give in and go home to take care of the drama. The drama would be extremely stupid and lengthy, and i would end up spending 1 - 2 hours at home fighting with them. After this i'm pretty much not in any sort of mood to go out. My girlfriend would get angry at this. She told me the other day that if the issues i got called home for were actually reasons and not excuses, she wouldn't have a care in the world. But the fact that i know they're calling me home for bullshit, but i still decide to go anyway...well that's what annoys her. Especially since she knows my dad has invested way too much money in me and my flying course to cut me off right now.

I do think you are right about her having to accept the situation existing. That's something i wish too. I've told her a few times that the situation only exists because i still live in their house. As soon as i move out, which will more than likely be the day i finish my course, things will change because i won't have to rely on them for survival any more. I think she understands this, but is frustrated that it's taking so long. I am too, in all honesty, but i guess i deal with it a bit better than she does?

[Randox]

That's fair. I'm not suggesting you keep your parents marginally happy forever though. I'm saying that, if it's a lost cause, it might as well pay for school first. There will always be one more thing, but that's the milestone presumably to making independance significantly more viable.

 

As for the excuses thing. I think that still comes back to accepting the situation. I imagine that's your parents game, they are trying to create tension so that the two of you break up without them having to force the situation (which also means that if you stick together, they are liable to escalate down the road anyway). I do also have to appreciate her point of view, because people not being in the same place in their lives at the same time is a big issue for me, and has certainly ended relationships for me. That is, I'll wait for a while if someone needs some time, but I'll not throw good time after bad.

 

I suppose a piece of relevant information would be, is she supported by or living with her parents, or does she have financial independence? It's just interesting for my own perspective.

 

 

Anyway, I can appreciate the anger, but I still don't think it's justified beyond the situation. She understands that your not complying with their excuses still ends in the same place. In the short term, he controlls the car, thus your primary access to her is at his leisure.

[obfuscator]

I do think it's a bit of a fallacy to say that having kids = poverty. Certainly raising children is expensive, but it's entirely possible to have a lot of fun and thoroughly enjoy life without spending large amounts of money on vacations and other extravagances.

 

If your goal is to spend large amounts of money on extravagant vacations and other things, then yes, having children will certainly eat into your budget for that.

[Noxx]

Okay so basically you're saying that there's a "chance", however big or small it may be, that everything you're saying will in fact one day become my reality. You believe that it's more probable for it to happen rather than a "happily-ever-after". Therefor i should abandon all hope now, before it's too late?

 

I'm not saying "abandon all hope"; I'm saying that assuming I am correct, act accordingly. This means don't make stupid decisions, compromises, or sacrifices which will eventually have been in vain. If you want to get married, get a prenup. If you want to move in together, don't co-own anything. If you want to stay with her for a very long time, make a list of things which you will and will not compromise on, ever, because you know deep down that doing so would be a mistake. Prioritizing a relationship over everything else in your life (especially your own happiness) never works out well. Whether you like it or not, this special girl of yours is completely replaceable (and IMO temporary). The same cannot be said for your parents.

 

Also, my parents ([bleep]ed up as they are), have been married for almost 28 years now. I know very well that 4-5 nights a week, when they go to bed, i should stay clear of their bedroom door for an hour or two to avoid nightmares. It's been 28 years and they're more active than me and my girlfriend are at the moment. My dad is an accountant. He's more than provided for his family. Okay, we're only two children. No big deal. But even if we were 7 children we would still be able to afford our current lifestyle. I plan on being a pilot, in the middle east. 10 years from now, assuming all goes well, i'll have a ~$250k salary in a tax free country. Pretty sure that's more than enough to provide a middle-class lifestyle. I'm not saying i'm going to have 5 kids, as i said it's just a number. But even if i did have 5 kids, i think i'd do alright (again, assuming things go according to my 10-year plan).

 

Makes me wonder if they've ever cheated on each other :P

 

Glad to see you've planned financially in that aspect. Do you plan on getting a prenup? Have you looked into how alimony works in your area? Are you ok with going without sex for months at a time if your wife doesn't feel like it? Are you ok with not being able to see other women under such circumstances? What are you going to do if your wife starts getting fat and grumpy?

To be honest i am 100% certain my mom would never, and could never cheat on my dad. My dad though, i can't say. I've seen him cry over my mom before, and he's fought for her a lot. But he's been on a lot of business trips throughout his life, so i guess i won't ever really know.

And yeah, me and her actually said that one day if we do get married, we will get a prenub. I suggested it the one day, she was pissed at me for a week because "i'm already setting a non-existing marriage up for failure" but then she realized that it's not really a big deal. I'm not sure how to answer the "no sex for a long time" question. But right now i guess you could say our sex-life is healthy. We both have a healthy appetite. Can't say how that will change in the future. I'm not sure how i would feel about going without sex for a while.

My girlfriend is already grumpy, so can't really say i would do much about that. As for her getting fat... she's extremely weight conscious. I don't think she'd ever really get "fat". If she did, i guess i'll have to deal with it then.

 

And... i know she is replaceable. We actually spoke about this the other day. I told her that she's not the prettiest girl in the world, and she's by a long shot not the most perfect girl in the world for me either. I'd be lying to her if i told her she was either of those. But the reason i want her over anyone i have ever met is exactly because she's not perfect for me. We teach each other a lot of things. Her taste in music and movies differs so much from mine, but over this past week i've seen movies that are absolutely brilliant because i watched them with her. I would have never even considered watching them on my own. We have gone to places i would never have thought of going, but ended up loving. Nothing will ever be perfect, and we are probably as far away from perfect as you would ever get, but we just work well together.

 

Like i've said, the only problem is my parents. I do not approve of how they want to control who i love. Whether it's with her, or someone else. Sooner or later i'm going to walk that road, and i'd much rather it be now and not 10 years from now. I just don't know how...

[Noxx]

That's fair. I'm not suggesting you keep your parents marginally happy forever though. I'm saying that, if it's a lost cause, it might as well pay for school first. There will always be one more thing, but that's the milestone presumably to making independance significantly more viable.

 

As for the excuses thing. I think that still comes back to accepting the situation. I imagine that's your parents game, they are trying to create tension so that the two of you break up without them having to force the situation (which also means that if you stick together, they are liable to escalate down the road anyway). I do also have to appreciate her point of view, because people not being in the same place in their lives at the same time is a big issue for me, and has certainly ended relationships for me. That is, I'll wait for a while if someone needs some time, but I'll not throw good time after bad.

 

I suppose a piece of relevant information would be, is she supported by or living with her parents, or does she have financial independence? It's just interesting for my own perspective.

 

 

Anyway, I can appreciate the anger, but I still don't think it's justified beyond the situation. She understands that your not complying with their excuses still ends in the same place. In the short term, he controlls the car, thus your primary access to her is at his leisure.

 

Her financial situation is extremely weird. Her mom works, her dad doesn't. Her mom barely makes enough to pay the bills, so my girlfriend works to help with the bills. Recently her mom took a huge sum of money from my girlfriend to pay for one of her sisters' college. Her dad has no interest in working. Her mom loves her dad too much to divorce him. It's a messy situation. She's unhappy about the situation, but until she get's a better job she can't do anything about it. She can't move out of the house, because renting anything in this country is stupidly overpriced. She's kind of trapped at the moment.

[Noxx]

Yeah i know what i want. But i don't know how to get it. That is the big problem.

[constrictor]

Patience? If you want it so badly, and are willing to fight for it - days, months, years, shouldn't make any difference. Especially if you are sleeping with her already, etc.

 

Commitment (in relationships - aka marriage) is a lie, in my opinion - outside of religious background that is.

[DownToFletch]

Following :)

 

I asked out a girl I've known for awhile

All is going well. Only problem is that she lives over a bridge :(

 

I'm also here to help others that might need it, as that's what I'm assuming this thread is for :)

 

Just a little about me

17 year old from New York, USA. That's about as far as I think I need to go without this being a dating ad lol

[Kaida23]

Maybe it's literal. If he lives in Manhattan, then pretty much everything on the other side of a bridge. :P

 

If your goal is to spend large amounts of money on extravagant vacations and other things, then yes, having children will certainly drain your entire budget for that.

 

Fixed that for ya. ;)

[RpgGamer]

Noxx, you need to get some imdependence from your parents, destroy the validity of their threats. Finish school and get the hell away from them. If you leave them, there's a chance they'll come back to you (same concept as not calling a girl for a while and then she ends up calling you). The struggle of independence will strenghthen your relationship with your girlfriend, who already has a hand in financial independence. The struggle to pay bills, working constantly and earning frredom from your parents threats with your own hands is a great way to keep a lady interested. Nothing boring about a provider, given that she also works hard for the shared goal of living with you away from your parents.

 

Or you could dye your girlfriends skin a few shades lighter and tell your parents you met a new girl thats just as good as the last but whiter haha

[Sir_Squab]

Noxx, you need to get some imdependence from your parents, destroy the validity of their threats. Finish school and get the hell away from them. If you leave them, there's a chance they'll come back to you (same concept as not calling a girl for a while and then she ends up calling you). The struggle of independence will strenghthen your relationship with your girlfriend, who already has a hand in financial independence. The struggle to pay bills, working constantly and earning frredom from your parents threats with your own hands is a great way to keep a lady interested. Nothing boring about a provider, given that she also works hard for the shared goal of living with you away from your parents.

 

Or you could dye your girlfriends skin a few shades lighter and tell your parents you met a new girl thats just as good as the last but whiter haha

 

His problem is he doesn't know what to do until that happens.

[RpgGamer]

Until then he kinda just has to live with it, but it does give a kind of romeo and juliet feel to his relationship, keeping things interesting in the meantime

[muggiwhplar]

"Interesting" is one way to put it :lol:

[Kimberly]

"Interesting" is one way to put it :lol:

 

Russian roulette is usually another.

[Kaida23]

Just keep poison and revolvers away from them and they'll be fine. :P

[constrictor]

Tiny update: the one month "test" type thing that my girlfriend and I did to see what LDR would be like went amazingly. We both got back from our trips, hadn't seen each other in person in a month and hadn't talked in 2.5 weeks (because neither of us had internet), and everything picked up right where it left off. A small amount of hope that University will be similar (but not going to be toooooo hopeful).

[Kimberly]

The thing about long distance relationships is there is a reaaaaaaally long time in between seeing your girlfriend/boyfriend. Before you go, "HURR DURR NO KIDDING" just let it sink in. If you're trying it out, really trying it, give it more than one break and one visit. The reality of what you try to do often doesn't set in until after the first departure, where you're waiting all over again, in my experience.

[constrictor]

The thing about long distance relationships is there is a reaaaaaaally long time in between seeing your girlfriend/boyfriend. Before you go, "HURR DURR NO KIDDING" just let it sink in. If you're trying it out, really trying it, give it more than one break and one visit. The reality of what you try to do often doesn't set in until after the first departure, where you're waiting all over again, in my experience.

 

 

Yep, I know. So for all I know it won't work out. But it went better than I had thought this time soooo, who knows.

[muggiwhplar]

girl on OKC asked me what my worst quality was. told her I'm a serial killer with an insatiable bloodlust. we'll see how it turns out, feeling pretty good about this one.

[Noxx]

"Interesting" is one way to put it :lol:

 

Russian roulette is usually another.

Kinda have to agree with this. I don't think that the role my parents play in this relationship (wow that sounds so stupid to say) is in any way a good contribution to our relationship. Like, it's an enormous strain. It's frustrating, because whenever i do something a bit out of the ordinary (something they would consider to be "disrespectful") they assume it's because of her. Like, i've been living on my own for a year and a half now. I have my own habits and routines. I'm used to picking up my car keys and heading out whenever i feel like it, till whatever time i feel like it. That's the way i lived in the US this past year and a half. But now that i'm back here temporarily i have to live by their rules again. So i need to "ask" before i go out, and i need to be home at a "decent" time. So whenever i come home at like 4am instead of 2am, they blame it on her. They say "Oh, he went to see HER again. She probably MADE him stay out this late." And that is something i REALLY hate about them. I am my own person, and i go home when i want to. On the other hand though, she (as in my girlfriend) sometimes thinks the same way too. If i choose to go home at 12am or 1am, instead of 2am or 3am, she thinks it's because my parents are making me go home that early. It's all turned into a blame game now. I've leaned how to look past this though, because i've had to deal with similar issues because of my sister. So i already know how to get around this. But it's still very frustrating when it happens sometimes.

A few days ago my and my parents got into an argument about my girlfriend. My parents told me that they were unhappy that i am dating someone non-white. They told me that it is not they way they raised me. I told them they raised me as a christian, and as long as i live (even though i consider myself agnostic now) i will live my life according to religious morals (to a certain extent at least). I do not believe in God, but i do believe in Good Orderly Direction. And to me that means being colorblind. I do not see color in the sense that white is wonderful and everything else is bad. But that being said, something in me just makes me more attracted to darker skin. I don't know what it is. But ever since the age of 13, when i really started liking girls, i liked girls with a darker skin more. And lately i have almost no attraction to white girls anymore. I still think there are some of them that are insanely hot, but i can't see myself spending my life with one. So i told them that if i was to live my life they way they wanted it, i would end up being single for the rest of my life. Because i am not going to marry a white girl. Simple as that. In some ways i think my parents really think about the things i say now, though. Because shortly after i had this conversation with my parents, i overheard my dad telling my mom the one night that "maybe it is time we start accepting". I don't take things like that too serious though, because i know my dad changes his mood from day to day. But it's still a very fragile topic in our house, and always one i fear to bring up.

I'm going away on family vacation in 6 hours. 3 weeks with my sister and parents. I guess sometime during this trip my relationship is going to be brought up. I just hope that when it is brought up, i can talk to them about it in a civil manner. I don't want it to turn out to be a shouting contest. I guess i just want them to understand that i'll always bring a brown girl home. She's either going to be South American brown, or Asian/Middle Eastern brown (meaning Indian/Pakistani/Arabic). They're never going to have a white daughter in-law. So whether or not they accept my current girlfriend isn't going to change the way i choose my next one. Another thing they need to realise is that if they continue to go down their current path, the moment i get a job i'll be out of the house and they won't ever see my again. If they choose to be more accepting, they will continue to see me.

 

I guess basically what i'm getting at is that whether or not you guys think i'm causing myself a lot of inconvenience with this doesn't really make any difference to my situation. Even if i choose to break up with my current girlfriend or not, i'm going to have the same issue down the road. So "you need to decide if this girl is worth the trouble or not" doesn't really work in this case because if i break up with her and start dating someone else, the same thing will happen. So it's more a situation of "you need to decide if you want to lose your parents (possibly), date a while girl and never be happy about it, or stay single for a veeeeeeeeeeeeeery long time".

[RpgGamer]

Would it be impossible to move in with your girlfriend's family in the meantime? Earn your keep best you can and whatnot