Pro DGing

[TheAncient]

I personally used to no more than 4 ores for 3 ragers and 10 scrolls.

 

but now I think even 4 ores is kind of excessive.

Necrolord and Thunderous you'd probably never use scrolls on.

And in our team, final likes to solo so, we haven't actually been using those 3 ragers all the time. 1 rager 10 scrolls might make more sense for us these days.

 

I am also starting to question rager scrolls for early warped floors because it's so easy to safespot mage dreadnaut.

 

I agree. I feel like we don't really use them. But I never really minded because someone else always ended up mining (seeing as I can't) or making the pouch(es)

 

I also think having one person with souls + waters + earths is well worth it. The curse gives -10% defense and costs 3 inventory spaces (+ getting lucky with soul / water / earth rune drops). If you need those inventory spaces you can always drop the runes.

[AlexRose]

I personally used to no more than 4 ores for 3 ragers and 10 scrolls.

 

but now I think even 4 ores is kind of excessive.

Necrolord and Thunderous you'd probably never use scrolls on.

And in our team, final likes to solo so, we haven't actually been using those 3 ragers all the time. 1 rager 10 scrolls might make more sense for us these days.

 

I am also starting to question rager scrolls for early warped floors because it's so easy to safespot mage dreadnaut.

 

I agree. I feel like we don't really use them. But I never really minded because someone else always ended up mining (seeing as I can't) or making the pouch(es)

 

I also think having one person with souls + waters + earths is well worth it. The curse gives -10% defense and only costs 3 inventory spaces (+ getting lucky with soul / water / earth rune drops)

 

I was meaning to ask you about Summons in your video. I've almost never seen combat familiars used, and my own tests with Tier 7 variants were.... dissapointing (alright, I know they're Tier 7, but I'll be damned if a Magic-Based summon can't hit a forgotten warrior.). Ignoring, for the moment, the time producing the pouches, how powerful are tier 10 Bloodragers against the various dungoneering monsters?

[TheAncient]

I personally used to no more than 4 ores for 3 ragers and 10 scrolls.

 

but now I think even 4 ores is kind of excessive.

Necrolord and Thunderous you'd probably never use scrolls on.

And in our team, final likes to solo so, we haven't actually been using those 3 ragers all the time. 1 rager 10 scrolls might make more sense for us these days.

 

I am also starting to question rager scrolls for early warped floors because it's so easy to safespot mage dreadnaut.

 

I agree. I feel like we don't really use them. But I never really minded because someone else always ended up mining (seeing as I can't) or making the pouch(es)

 

I also think having one person with souls + waters + earths is well worth it. The curse gives -10% defense and only costs 3 inventory spaces (+ getting lucky with soul / water / earth rune drops)

 

I was meaning to ask you about Summons in your video. I've almost never seen combat familiars used, and my own tests with Tier 7 variants were.... dissapointing (alright, I know they're Tier 7, but I'll be damned if a Magic-Based summon can't hit a forgotten warrior.). Ignoring, for the moment, the time producing the pouches, how powerful are tier 10 Bloodragers against the various dungoneering monsters?

 

The familiars themselves don't do that much damage. Theyre mostly for bosses. The special attack greatly reduces boss defense and is stackable.

[green9090]

On the subject of taking off the hood to avoid getting revealed- if you run into a room and THEN put the hood on, all the monsters in that room in line of sight would have already aggro'd on you anyway, meaning you'd have to leave to get them to recognize your hood. For that reason I don't see that strategy being useful for all the annoying extra clicks getting to your inventory screen and all.

 

On the subject of combat familiars- yeah, for straight damage they're all pretty bad. I've used all three, and none of them hit well even on monsters that should be extremely weak to them (deathslinger sucks on mages, stormbringer sucks on warriors). Bloodrager ironically seems to hit generic monsters the most, combat triangle be damned. However, it's still pretty bad for damage.

 

The appeal of bloodragers is the SCROLLS. It drains enemy defense significantly, making certain boss battles into jokes. It seems about comparable to a statius warhammer special. If you spam 3-5 scrolls on something like the gravecreeper, nobody on that team is likely to be hitting 0s for the duration of the fight. It's also often worthwhile to use one scroll on something like a primal warrior or very high level fire giant, especially if the whole team isn't there to kill it.

 

The other combat scrolls are disappointing- stormbringer binds for a bit, and deathslinger poisons like 60. Not worth the time making them.

[AlexRose]

On the subject of taking off the hood to avoid getting revealed- if you run into a room and THEN put the hood on, all the monsters in that room in line of sight would have already aggro'd on you anyway, meaning you'd have to leave to get them to recognize your hood. For that reason I don't see that strategy being useful for all the annoying extra clicks getting to your inventory screen and all.

 

From my experience, monsters take a second to become agressive and attack, even when in agression range, and it's pretty doubtful that all monsters within a room will be within agression range when you enter. Furthermore, taking off your hood assures that any rooms you enter immediately afterwards, including hood-safe gatestone spots, will be tackled with the protection of the hood. It's not useful running past a solitary room, but when several dangerous rooms follow, it can be potentially lifesaving.

 

Hmmm, on the Bloodrager, is the defense debuff guarenteed/fixed, or does it vary with the hit?

 

 

 

85-88 DG in 2 days

 

Wha... what? Man, you kids are spoiled rotten. Back in my day, we only had to floor 35, and we only got 50k experience a dungeon. And we had no "Group Gatestones" or any building spots; oh no, we had to find those altars in the dungeons, and if you didn't have it gated, tough, you had to walk all the way! Kids these days don't appreciate their elders- *grumble grumble*

 

In all seriousness, that quote just reminded me how long I had been away from dungeoneering.

[green9090]

I can see the point of taking off the hood to reduce aggro, but at the same time it sounds like a gigantic pain for how much it'd actually do. I'm sure there are situations where it'd be very helpful, but I don't think they're very common. I probably won't bother just because it's too much clicking for my lazy ass :P

 

As for how bloodragers drop defense, I honestly couldn't tell you for sure. All I can say is that with one guy using his whole spec bar worth of scrolls (I think that's 5) on a boss, it usually makes a gigantic impact on the team's accuracy even starting from the first or second scroll. Same deal for using one or two scrolls on a primal warrior. Doesn't really matter how the math behind it works IMO- it makes for dramatically easier boss battles, especially if you have two or three people all spec spamming. That's enough for me.

[All_Is_Great]

I can see the point of taking off the hood to reduce aggro, but at the same time it sounds like a gigantic pain for how much it'd actually do. I'm sure there are situations where it'd be very helpful, but I don't think they're very common. I probably won't bother just because it's too much clicking for my lazy ass :P

 

As for how bloodragers drop defense, I honestly couldn't tell you for sure. All I can say is that with one guy using his whole spec bar worth of scrolls (I think that's 5) on a boss, it usually makes a gigantic impact on the team's accuracy even starting from the first or second scroll. Same deal for using one or two scrolls on a primal warrior. Doesn't really matter how the math behind it works IMO- it makes for dramatically easier boss battles, especially if you have two or three people all spec spamming. That's enough for me.

 

Do t9 and t10 bloodragers have much difference? I might charm-in and get 91 if it helps.

[TheAncient]

I can see the point of taking off the hood to reduce aggro, but at the same time it sounds like a gigantic pain for how much it'd actually do. I'm sure there are situations where it'd be very helpful, but I don't think they're very common. I probably won't bother just because it's too much clicking for my lazy ass :P

 

As for how bloodragers drop defense, I honestly couldn't tell you for sure. All I can say is that with one guy using his whole spec bar worth of scrolls (I think that's 5) on a boss, it usually makes a gigantic impact on the team's accuracy even starting from the first or second scroll. Same deal for using one or two scrolls on a primal warrior. Doesn't really matter how the math behind it works IMO- it makes for dramatically easier boss battles, especially if you have two or three people all spec spamming. That's enough for me.

 

Do t9 and t10 bloodragers have much difference? I might charm-in and get 91 if it helps.

 

Not really.

 

Also, the hood trick takes a while to get used to.

[green9090]

I've never tried below sachem, but I've seen other people in my team use adept and it seemed to work well. The main reason I'd get 91 is just because when people make extra ragers and drop them at the base they'll almost always be t10. It's also that much closer to a pack yak, so why not?

[AlexRose]

I've never tried below sachem, but I've seen other people in my team use adept and it seemed to work well. The main reason I'd get 91 is just because when people make extra ragers and drop them at the base they'll almost always be t10. It's also that much closer to a pack yak, so why not?

 

That and finding natural ore below tier 8 on high level dungeons. I'd certainly try out the viability of the lower tiered bloodragers (less competition for blue charms too!), but you don't see too many argonite rocks in high level dungeons.

 

Hmmm, there's a thought. Do to the Tier 1 and lower scrolls have the same reduction as the Tier 10? I highly doubt it, but it's certainly worth trying out.

[Squisher_33]

my guess is that a scroll lowes the def of the monster by 1% per tear

 

meaning sachem scroll will lower def by 10% per scroll, adept will lower def by 9% per scroll

 

thats my guess, and ive used both for ages

[Grimy_Bunyip]

my guess is that a scroll lowes the def of the monster by 1% per tear

 

meaning sachem scroll will lower def by 10% per scroll, adept will lower def by 9% per scroll

 

thats my guess, and ive used both for ages

I wonder if that means the flesh spoiler is simply resistant to ragers, since we haven't had too much success in that.

Perhaps they reduce levels by some function of the amount of damage dealt by the attack.

[AlexRose]

Hmmm, so 4-5 scrolls would be a 40% defense reduction, a little more than the Statius Warhammer. Not too bad.

 

 

my guess is that a scroll lowes the def of the monster by 1% per tear

 

meaning sachem scroll will lower def by 10% per scroll, adept will lower def by 9% per scroll

 

thats my guess, and ive used both for ages

I wonder if that means the flesh spoiler is simply resistant to ragers, since we haven't had too much success in that.

Perhaps they reduce levels by some function of the amount of damage dealt by the attack.

 

A good test for this would be Runebound (when he's not glitched) or Nightgazer. Use the scrolls while they're resistant, and see if they have any effect.

[AlexRose]

Whoops, double.

[green9090]

I've never found flesh spoiler to have particularly noticeable defense anyway. I always just figured that rager scrolls don't seem to do much because it doesn't have a significant defense level to begin with. Presumably most of its defense comes from equipment bonuses rather than levels, making it defacto immune to scrolls.

[DyingSilent]

Rager scrolls take 20 summoning points each, so 3 per special bar. Just for reference :thumbup:

[Viv]

yeh as a keyer its best to first get ur team at a gd and then open doors til u find another gd generally thats what makes a good key verse bad key

with a good keyer its like "gt gd" "gt gd" and w/ a bad key "idk what to do" im kidna bad at this too (reason alot of my maps are slow is i let gds stack up) :P open all doors then go "k guys everything i didnt open is gd have fun!"

 

also its best to instruct another player to solo puzzles or 100+ skill doors if u have doors to open

 

mainly gds, mimes and levers need to be done asap

 

and as a non keyer gd > gate doors (following paths u gated til either 1.) hard gd 2.)door keyer doesnt have key for 3.)de) (call and notify the keyer of the doors u do)> ragers > plant herbs > fish > afk > make armor

[Grimy_Bunyip]

Hmmm, so 4-5 scrolls would be a 40% defense reduction, a little more than the Statius Warhammer. Not too bad.

 

 

my guess is that a scroll lowes the def of the monster by 1% per tear

 

meaning sachem scroll will lower def by 10% per scroll, adept will lower def by 9% per scroll

 

thats my guess, and ive used both for ages

I wonder if that means the flesh spoiler is simply resistant to ragers, since we haven't had too much success in that.

Perhaps they reduce levels by some function of the amount of damage dealt by the attack.

 

A good test for this would be Runebound (when he's not glitched) or Nightgazer. Use the scrolls while they're resistant, and see if they have any effect.

Special effects do not always apply if the defense is not natural defense.

You can saradomin spec to heal, even if a tormented demon is praying melee, and you deal no damage for example.

[stonewall337]

Hmmm, so 4-5 scrolls would be a 40% defense reduction, a little more than the Statius Warhammer. Not too bad.

 

 

my guess is that a scroll lowes the def of the monster by 1% per tear

 

meaning sachem scroll will lower def by 10% per scroll, adept will lower def by 9% per scroll

 

thats my guess, and ive used both for ages

I wonder if that means the flesh spoiler is simply resistant to ragers, since we haven't had too much success in that.

Perhaps they reduce levels by some function of the amount of damage dealt by the attack.

 

A good test for this would be Runebound (when he's not glitched) or Nightgazer. Use the scrolls while they're resistant, and see if they have any effect.

Special effects do not always apply if the defense is not natural defense.

You can saradomin spec to heal, even if a tormented demon is praying melee, and you deal no damage for example.

 

In addition,if your spec kos, then you heal what you would have hit had the monster had enough HP.

[la la la]

mainly gds, mimes and levers need to be done asap

The way I see it,

 

Mime/levers > single-person skill doors/rooms (handled by keyer usually, will call others if needed) > ghost/obelisk GD > Mono > GDs

 

That's the order things should be taken. Leave 100+ skill doors for later, unless you have the herb on you, as they are guaranteed to be bonus rooms.

[green9090]

mainly gds, mimes and levers need to be done asap

The way I see it,

 

Mime/levers > single-person skill doors/rooms (handled by keyer usually, will call others if needed) > ghost/obelisk GD > Mono > GDs

 

That's the order things should be taken. Leave 100+ skill doors for later, unless you have the herb on you, as they are guaranteed to be bonus rooms.

Sometimes it's worth it to leave a mono for later and kill some other GDs first if the team is low on food, but generally I agree with that order.

[TheAncient]

untested, but it may be good to do monos right after other monos, ghost rooms, or merc leaders because apparently the game autobalances it to make it easier. not sure tho.

[green9090]

I've always thought the monos were scaled like any other room, and the "level" of mono is just harder to see. For example, a skill room will have a requirement in say the 90's, whereas a mono will have a certain level range of shades it'll spawn. Sometimes you'll just get a low level mono room with level 2 shades in the same way that sometimes you'll get a skill door requiring like 30 to open. I doubt the level of the room will change once it's brought into being- it just has a set difficulty in the same way a skill door's level is set once it's made.

[All_Is_Great]

I've always thought the monos were scaled like any other room, and the "level" of mono is just harder to see. For example, a skill room will have a requirement in say the 90's, whereas a mono will have a certain level range of shades it'll spawn. Sometimes you'll just get a low level mono room with level 2 shades in the same way that sometimes you'll get a skill door requiring like 30 to open. I doubt the level of the room will change once it's brought into being- it just has a set difficulty in the same way a skill door's level is set once it's made.

 

But sometimes the mono spawns 4 133 shades at once, and once you let it die, it spawns level 67s and 90s after you reactivate it. Weird huh?

[TheAncient]

I've always thought the monos were scaled like any other room, and the "level" of mono is just harder to see. For example, a skill room will have a requirement in say the 90's, whereas a mono will have a certain level range of shades it'll spawn. Sometimes you'll just get a low level mono room with level 2 shades in the same way that sometimes you'll get a skill door requiring like 30 to open. I doubt the level of the room will change once it's brought into being- it just has a set difficulty in the same way a skill door's level is set once it's made.

 

But sometimes the mono spawns 4 133 shades at once, and once you let it die, it spawns level 67s and 90s after you reactivate it. Weird huh?

 

Could just be luck. no one really knows how mono works.