TIF is bit over-moderated

[Dragonlordjl]

I have undeniable proof that y'all are anti-TEF. I posted an "illegal" script about a week ago in this thread on the same level as any of Wicked's scripts, even said it was so. At least one tif mod viewed it, as of the time of this post it's still there, and I have not been reprimanded in any way. If y'all were treating all such scripts at any location, including here, tef, mars, your mother's backside (I really do not want to know why you would check there for "illegal" scripts), the same, it would not still be up.

Looks like we missed that; thanks for the heads up. I've removed it now.

How convenient. You ignored it a week ago, after even replying about it, but now claim to just have "missed" it.

To be honest, at the time I thought that your first scripts (the original functions) were only pseudo code and not actually functional, so I left the illegal script. However, since you pointed out that it was an actual functioning script that is against the rules I've removed it.

So you have no knowledge over what constitutes a working script. Who's to say anything posted on TEF is just pseudocode if you obviously can't tell the difference? Also, what makes pseudocode acceptable over real code, the fact that you can't just copy and paste it and have it working?

 

You posted those scripts not to actually do something, but in order to demonstrate. I briefly scanned them, understood your point, and thought no more of it. Now that you've (rightly) pointed out that there was in fact a rule breaking script there, I agree with your insistence it must be deleted.

 

You really ought to stop replying about this, you're just digging a bigger hole. :mellow:

[Ginger_Warrior]

*sigh*

[Danqazmlp]

I have to admit, I'm finding it hard to take any of your arguments seriously any more when you constantly break the forum rules.You have been told countless times now how to air your grievances within the forum rules yet do not do so. You continue to break these rules knowing full well what they are and why they are there (as it has been explained to you many times). It seems then that you don't want to make TIF better at all, you don't want to comply with the rules, you just want to disrupt the forums and cause more work for the moderators.

 

Short story: Do things within the rules and everybody is happy, do things against the rules, both parties lose.

[Lose No Hope]

Both discussions within the rules and actions that are considered against the rules have been tried. Neither seem to work with you guys. There seems to be nothing that can be done that will appease you into making changes.

[Dragonlordjl]

I have to admit, I'm finding it hard to take any of your arguments seriously any more when you constantly break the forum rules.You have been told countless times now how to air your grievances within the forum rules yet do not do so. You continue to break these rules knowing full well what they are and why they are there (as it has been explained to you many times). It seems then that you don't want to make TIF better at all, you don't want to comply with the rules, you just want to disrupt the forums and cause more work for the moderators.

 

Short story: Do things within the rules and everybody is happy, do things against the rules, both parties lose.

Translation: Because you continue to protest against the draconian rules imposed by our fascist regime, we refuse to make any real effort to arrive at a happy medium. We'd appreciate if you'd all just go away.

[Alg]

Im sick and tired of all this stupid childish arguments sprouting up. I just want the damn place to go back how it used to be, none of this Efficiency Vs Fun crap, Users Vs Admins and vice-versa.

This. I for one don't give a [cabbage] about who wronged who, what's killing the community is the fact that the groups has an inflated sense of their own importance. These fights pop up on every damn thread, and it's getting old.

[Danqazmlp]

I disagree. Working within the rules created the Efficiency forum. It may not be perfect, but that is because we cannot tell what people want unless they then continue to come to use within the rules. Unfortunately, discussions within the rules don't seem to have happened since it was created. We would LOVE to have input on the forum, suggestions and help to digest and mull over, but continuous rule breaking doesn't aid us at all. If anything, it slows us down.

 

The best way to improve the forums is to talk to us, not shout at us. Don't insult us, insulting the moderators and administrators and being rude, but just talk to us. Tell us what we can add to make the forum better, a place for your community to grow within it. However, you also have to consider what we can and can't do within the constraints of this forum.

 

In short, just talk to us without insulting us and we will start listening. Be rude and we will be much more likely to dismiss your remarks as nothing but a means to antagonise.

[Obtaurian]

This goes back to the original issue, that being that we're not comfortable committing resources to Tip.it until we see some change in how things are done. Obviously there have been a good number of altercations since our original discussion with the admins, not the least of which has been this ridiculous censoring of our forums. I don't think anyone honestly believes that Tip.it is ever going to respect its metagaming community. Enaid is basically the only metagamer on these forums who would continue to contribute to guides and H&A if we decided to leave altogether, and the only reason I don't leave, personally, is DGS and my blog. I would wager that a large number of metagamers only continue to use Tip.it because of DGS. They're certainly not posting their guides/research.

 

This whole thing is just a joke to me now. It's like this endless loop of stupidity. We have leverage, Tip.it doesn't, but Tip.it admins/mods behave as if they do. It's really quite funny.

[muggiwhplar]

Oh wow this topic is still active

 

Quick question-- how come you guys are still arguing with the admins now that you have your own forums? >_>

[Lose No Hope]

Have you read the past few dozen pages?

[Ginger_Warrior]

Because they can't leave. If they could they would have carried out the multiple threats they've made through various ultimatums by now.

 

Pouring water over somebody's bonfire just as they've been promoted takes some doing though. I mean it's pretty low, but it takes balls I guess.

[Obtaurian]

Because they can't leave. If they could they would have carried out the multiple threats they've made through various ultimatums by now.

 

Pouring water over somebody's bonfire just as they've been promoted takes some doing though. I mean it's pretty low, but it takes balls I guess.

 

Jimmy_Jim was largely responsible for the initial [cabbage]storm. THE MORE YOU KNOW!

[Danqazmlp]

That may be so, but being rude towards somebody when they are promoted is not the way to go. We all know that being rude on a promotion topic will be removed, not due to any personal feelings but due to it being offensive and just a horrible thing to do. I know that you are all of a fair intelligence and aren't stupid, so would know this. The only logical reason then can be that posts were made to antagonise. This is just not on.

 

As I said, be polite and come to us in the correct places and manner and we will talk back. Give us respect and we will respect you back.

[Ginger_Warrior]

Yeah, and?

[muggiwhplar]

Have you read the past few dozen pages?

 

I figured it'd be easier for someone to give a simple response than to read a dozen pages of arguing which has ultimately gone nowhere lol

 

Because they can't leave. If they could they would have carried out the multiple threats they've made through various ultimatums by now.

 

Pouring water over somebody's bonfire just as they've been promoted takes some doing though. I mean it's pretty low, but it takes balls I guess.

 

Jimmy_Jim was largely responsible for the initial [cabbage]storm. THE MORE YOU KNOW!

 

Two wrongs don't make a right. Behavior like this is very disappointing-- which is why I was hoping there's more to this than what it looks like.

[Obtaurian]

As far as I'm aware, the comments made were negative, but not intrinsically insulting. If I posted on that thread with a simple "I disagree with Jimmy_Jim being made an admin," it would be removed because it's "negative." Sorry, but I see no reason why I can't voice my disapproval.

[Andy]

You're allowed voice your opinion, but only in private where nobody else can see it and nothing will be done.

[muuuuuuuuuu]

And when proof is presented that people are either incompetent to make decisions related to this area or clearly biased against it from the getgo, the response is to continue denying it.

[obfuscator]

And when proof is presented that people are either incompetent to make decisions related to this area or clearly biased against it from the getgo, the response is to continue denying it.

By extension, when proof is presented from our side that we are not only competent to make the decision but have fully explained it it's completely ignored (and continues to be).

[Danqazmlp]

You're allowed voice your opinion, but only in private where nobody else can see it and nothing will be done.

 

 

The rules cover this pretty comprehensively:

 

 

2.8 - Tip.It Staff

 

Moderators and Administrators of this site monitor your compliance with the rules of the site and dispense disciplinary action at their discretion. Any posts containing inappropriate content will either be edited or removed from the forums and posting such words/phrases/content after being warned can result in being suspended from Tip.It forums for a given amount of time defined by the infraction and the Staff Member. If you are consistent about posting this sort of content after you have been warned you will be permanently banned from the site. NOTE: Only Administrators and Super Moderators have the power to do this. There are always at least 2 people involved in putting a ban in place - the Moderator who finds a breaking of the rules and the Administrator or Super Moderator who takes the action they feel is appropriate.

 

Tip.It Moderators and Administrators use their discretion in taking any actions. They are here to ensure the rules are applied, to keep order, and to help members. Posting personal attacks against Tip.It Moderators or Staff Members for taking these actions is not tolerated. If you disagree with an action taken by a Moderator, DO NOT confront Tip.It Moderators or Staff Members anywhere on the forums, NOR anywhere else (3rd party messenger programs, chats, etc). Please attempt to resolve the issue through PM's (private messages) in a professional manner. If you are not satisfied with the resolution, please send your complaint to a Tip.It Administrator. Moderators will give everyone the respect they deserve, it's only fair they get the same in return.

 

Impersonating or acting like a Tip.It Moderator or Staff Member is forbidden and can result in disciplinary action. This includes use of "Official Tip.It" in thread topics, descriptions or content as well as using Tip.it Staff avatars as your avatar, signature, etc. If a user finds a thread or post that is inappropriate please report the thread or post and let the administration and moderating staff handle the situation.

 

Confronting staff directly will only heighten the situation and make it worse. More often, it also allows the person who has the complaint to think it through more thoroughly if they compose a Private message instead of immediately reply to a topic. It is not an attempt to hide any problems as the staff members in question will be aware of the situations very swiftly if they receive a complaint. The only reason I can see to want an issue public is to stir the pot and make the problem larger than actually wanting to resolve it. Admins are the ones who can solve a problem the fastest, so it is best to message them. Also remember that staff are people too, having your name slandered across the forum you volunteer on is a horrible thing to happen and I wouldn't wish it upon anybody. It is certainly not something you should aim for. Using Private messages with Admins allows them to calmly and professionally discuss the matter.

 

Again it is coming down to just having some respect for the staff. Give people respect and they are much more likely to respect you back. Confronting them in public will get no results and only succeeds in making the situation worse.

[Andy]

Danq does disagreeing with a choice of an admin (as in jimmy jim being an admin now) = slandering? Or ranting/raging like you said earlier?

[Stev]

I have undeniable proof that y'all are anti-TEF. I posted an "illegal" script about a week ago in this thread on the same level as any of Wicked's scripts, even said it was so. At least one tif mod viewed it, as of the time of this post it's still there, and I have not been reprimanded in any way. If y'all were treating all such scripts at any location, including here, tef, mars, your mother's backside (I really do not want to know why you would check there for "illegal" scripts), the same, it would not still be up.

My scripts are not functioning. If you simply copied and pasted any of the functions in that first post and executed it, nothing would happen.

 

Sure, the functions produce many actions. But if it's going against the 1:1 rule, that's the fault of the user; they set the requirements to call such functions. If my functions aren't 1:1, that your fault. :).

 

However, I've added functions for those paranoid, uneducated people who seem to think they go against 1:1. I introduced along side the RS_Click_... functions, a new set of RS_Move_... functions. They produce simply one action. For example, say you had your inventory open and tried...

F3:: RS_Move_Prayer(3)

...it would move the mouse over the prayer tab as to not create more actions then 1. If your prayer tab was open, it would move your mouse to the 3rd prayer.

 

You could use those RS_Move_... functions for things like Firemaking...

Log_Color:=0x000000   ;~ Use RS_Get_Inventory_Item_Color() to get the color of the logs and store it into Log_Color

Home::
  RS_Move_Inventory_Item(1)
Return

End::
  Loop, 28
     If(RS_Get_Inventory_Item_Color(A_Index)==Log_Color)
     {
        RS_Move_Inventory_Item(A_Index)
        Break
     }
Return

See? Nothing illegal done here. Pressing Home moves the mouse to the first inventory item slot, that's it. Pressing End moves the mouse to the first found log in your inventory, that's it. 1:1. So you could Firemake with (And this is legal according to TIF standards)...

• Home (Move mouse)
  
• Left Click
  
• End (Move mouse)
  
• Left Click
  
• Home (Move mouse)
  
• Left Click
  
• End (Move mouse)
  
• Left Click
  
• ...

 

However, according to you, the TIF administrators and mods, the above is legal. What you're having problems with is scripts being 2:2 or 3:3. Pushing 2 buttons and then the 2 actions being performed. I thought macros and things were illegal if they gave players and unfair advantage. Is it not? How is changing a script from 1:1 to 2:2 or 3:3 giving them an advantage? After-all, the following are the exact same...

^F3:: RS_Click_Quick_Prayer()   ;~ Moves the mouse to the quick prayer and clicks. 2 actions produce 2 outputs. 2:2.

...and...

F3:: RS_Move_Quick_Prayer()   ;~ Moves the mouse to the quick prayer. The user must then press a second button to click.  2 actions produce 2 outputs. 1:1.

They both require to buttons to be pushed for the same outcome. Why in God's name are you making such a big [bleep]ing deal over it? Is the first one giving someone an advantage that the second one isn't? Is the first one any faster then the second? No? Then what the hell is the big deal?

 

You people seem to think those functions and scripts were written with ill-intent. "Zomg! Botting with AHK!" Believe it or not, they were written to make RuneScape more enjoyable and perhaps a little easier. They were written to help out. They do what Jagex fails to do; Provide a customizable gameplay. For example, I don't like my F5 key opening my attack styles. I'd rather it open my friends list for quick chatting. Imagine that; there's functions for just that!

 

Ask yourselves, administrators and mods, what is the difference between 1:1, 2:2 and 3:3? A few milliseconds, if any at all. Is that worth the hassle that you are causing over it?

 

Also remember that staff are people too, having your name slandered across the forum you volunteer on is a horrible thing to happen and I wouldn't wish it upon anybody.

Which is exactly what you, and I mean the TIF staff in general, are doing to me. Saying that my work, which was designed for the sole purpose of helping out, are scripts and functions for botting.

[Aiel]

I disagree with this, mostly because nobody knows a lot about jimmy jim, he never really posts which is what I feel makes a strong mod (for example mods/admins like quy, tripsis, and formerly das were very active and connected to the community where as I feel jimmy jim isn't), in fact the only reason I even know about him is that he recently deleted my sig for having 7 lines of text and an image ~1 line of text large, which, while technically against the siggy rules (only 6 lines w/ an image), is obviously not how what the rule was trying to prevent, which is my second issue with his moderating technique, that he moderates to the letter, and doesn't really think about what the rules were intended to prevent, just what they say.

[All_Is_Great]

Oh jeez the nitpicking doesn't stop.

 

I'm pretty sure you guys know full well why you posted on the new admin thread, and that reason is not to voice public dislike, and instead to incite reaction from the admin group.

 

It is getting just a teensy bit old.

 

I can only wonder what will happen after Jagex replies the email.

[Lose No Hope]

I posted to show that I disagreed with the choice that was made to make him an admin. Thanks for assuming you knew my reason anyways.