Squeal of Fortune "Updates" was: Spin Results (970 spins)

[stonewall337]

Did you hear about that decade long CIV II game? Was that a competition? Not in the sense that its a tournament, heck no. But is it competitive? DUH.

 

I don't know what you're talking about, so I'll just respond to the other part of your post.

 

I provided you with MY definition of what constitutes competitiveness for online games, and you refuted my argument with the fact that Runescape has a high scores table. I responded to that by saying that high scores tables are a bad measurement of competitiveness because experience earned doesn't translate into skill. Mini games with ratings, like Fist of Guthix, fit under my definition because rating is similar to the elo rating system used in Chess and League of Legends. But mini games alone are not enough to make a game truly competitive. All you've said is that I'm wrong because what I've said is baseless despite the fact I've given you example after example. Your progression argument goes back to the point I've been trying to make about time spent playing not translating into skill.

 

If comparing time played is your definition of competitiveness, then all I have to say to that is, "I disagree wholeheartedly."

The point is, Your definition doesn't matter. No one cares. What matters is the facts. As stated before, when opinions and facts meet, facts need always win out. The fact is, your definition is wrong. You are free to believe what you want, but that doesn't make it valid.

 

As for RS, like I said, there are different paths of progression. High Scores, for one (Compared to say World of Logs or WoW heroes for WOW) as well as things like proficiency or efficiency which are harder to tabulate, but which honestly are competitive as well. Minigames, PVP, etc, are all competitive in nature. Even if its a Jagex sponsored event, like the Clan Cup. Honestly, just because some parts of RS aren't as competitive as say Starcraft II doesn't mean it isn't competitive. Hell, to disprove you, all I need to do (and have) is show one instance in which RS is competitive.

 

I dare you to try and show me one game that isn't competitive in some sense, whether single or multiplayer. (Baring erotic games and the like)

 

You can agree or disagree, it doesn'tmatter. But logic, facts, and definitions of the terms all agree with me.

 

Now, I will concede that to gauge SUCCESS or PROFICIENCY by high scores alone will fail. Anyone who has DG'ed with Green098 or w/e will know this. For skills can be leveled slowly, given enough time.

 

But take it from someone who has three times your total XP in one skill, (and their are people with double my XP in 3 skills I know) to make a universal claim like "RS isn't competitive" not only is asinine because making universal claims is never a good thing (joke intended) but when you haven't even explored many of that facets of the game that people make competitive, it just doesn't hold a whole lot of weight.

[Heart of a Lion]

Snip

 

So you're basically saying that it is a fact that my opinion doesn't matter. What?

 

Progression is arbitrary. That's just your personal progress versus someone else which doesn't matter because we all may have started playing at different times. The mere fact of that possibility makes high scores tables meaningless when trying to define competitiveness.

 

I'll concede that there are certain competitive aspects to Runescape, but because the game as a whole caters to a casual audience, mini games alone don't make Runescape competitive. How can you say Runescape is competitive when PvM and PvE are just as much apart of the experience as much as PvP is? Other truly competitive games focus solely on PvP (LoL, SC2, SF IV, etc) and keep randoms (like lamps that GIVE experience or quests that award experience) to a minimum because the best determinant of competition is skill. Why would a good definition of competitiveness include randomness and not place as much of an emphasis on skill?

 

Since you've resorted to Ad Hominem arguments, I'm going to discontinue posting in this thread. The fact that you have more experience than me is as irrelevant as the amount of time I've played. Do you know what the latest quest was back then? Horror from the Deep.

[muggiwhplar]

Yes, Stone, some people do consider RS competitive. But I don't think the majority of players do.

 

However, considering that some players consider the competitiveness of RS a "fact," do you think that invalidates every other RS player's opinion regarding the issue, even if it's for the "greater good" of RS?

[stonewall337]

Yes, Stone, some people do consider RS competitive. But I don't think the majority of players do.

 

However, considering that some players consider the competitiveness of RS a "fact," do you think that invalidates every other RS player's opinion regarding the issue, even if it's for the "greater good" of RS?

 

I think that where facts are available, opinions become moot. Evidence provided to back up my stance has been given. No evidence from the other has been seen.

 

OPINION

1. A belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.

2. A personal view, attitude, or appraisal.

 

An opinion is normally not backed up with evidence "I think" or "I believe".

Give me logical reasons to prefer your opinion at the very least.

 

I'm not saying RS is a MLG type of game. I'm saying RS has competition in it. That is all. It could be the duel arena alone, but that is competition. Seems to me other people like to insert their own beliefs into what others say, and then argue that (false) view instead of what is actually said. Sigh.

[muggiwhplar]

Yes, Stone, some people do consider RS competitive. But I don't think the majority of players do.

 

However, considering that some players consider the competitiveness of RS a "fact," do you think that invalidates every other RS player's opinion regarding the issue, even if it's for the "greater good" of RS?

 

I think that where facts are available, opinions become moot. Evidence provided to back up my stance has been given. No evidence from the other has been seen.

 

OPINION

1. A belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.

2. A personal view, attitude, or appraisal.

 

An opinion is normally not backed up with evidence "I think" or "I believe".

Give me logical reasons to prefer your opinion at the very least.

 

I'm not saying RS is a MLG type of game. I'm saying RS has competition in it. That is all. It could be the duel arena alone, but that is competition. Seems to me other people like to insert their own beliefs into what others say, and then argue that (false) view instead of what is actually said. Sigh.

 

Would you agree that the first part of your response was an opinion then, by your own definition? :P (see underlined part)

 

 

-----

 

Anyways, I apologize if this damages the validity of my posts regarding the issue, but I'm just saying that people are just making mountains out of molehills when it comes to microtransactions, etc. Like I said-- if most players were buying SoF spins, or if the people constantly featured in the 200M Thread were buying spins, the issue might hold more weight. But that doesn't seem to be the case.

[stonewall337]

Yes, Stone, some people do consider RS competitive. But I don't think the majority of players do.

 

However, considering that some players consider the competitiveness of RS a "fact," do you think that invalidates every other RS player's opinion regarding the issue, even if it's for the "greater good" of RS?

 

I think that where facts are available, opinions become moot. Evidence provided to back up my stance has been given. No evidence from the other has been seen.

 

OPINION

1. A belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.

2. A personal view, attitude, or appraisal.

 

An opinion is normally not backed up with evidence "I think" or "I believe".

Give me logical reasons to prefer your opinion at the very least.

 

I'm not saying RS is a MLG type of game. I'm saying RS has competition in it. That is all. It could be the duel arena alone, but that is competition. Seems to me other people like to insert their own beliefs into what others say, and then argue that (false) view instead of what is actually said. Sigh.

 

Would you agree that the first part of your response was an opinion then, by your own definition? :P (see underlined part)

 

 

-----

 

Anyways, I apologize if this damages the validity of my posts regarding the issue, but I'm just saying that people are just making mountains out of molehills when it comes to microtransactions, etc. Like I said-- if most players were buying SoF spins, or if the people constantly featured in the 200M Thread were buying spins, the issue might hold more weight. But that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

Not entirely, just because someone says "I think' doesn't mean its the same type of opinion, or an opinion at all any more than starting a sentance with the words "what if" means it is a question.. As the definition stated, there are different types of opinions. One is the illinforemed type, the baseless opinion. The other is the one backed up by logic and fact. "I think therefore I am- is an opinion reached by a logical conclusion. "I think this is a good car" is not.

 

In this instance, its a logical process to come to the conclusion I stated. If opinions are of less worth(weight) than facts, facts are better. Facts are available. Therefore, facts are better. It could have been phrased differently, but that doesn't chance the fact that it is correct. You can't have a discussion without having an opinion of some sort, but an opinion based on fact is more than just a baseless opinion.

 

Perhaps, all in all, it would be better said that "where baseless opinions are, as well as fact and data, facts are the correct choice logically".

 

 

 

 

 

Now on to what muggi said. Ya, I am against the PUSH of the SoF. And the RNG of buying spins to win certain items. But I don't think it will ruin the game, as it is now.

[muggiwhplar]

I think we more or less agree on the issue, then :P

[Amonitas]

I'm glad that I don't care if someone else gets an advantage or something for real money. I see 20 times a day the message where someone becomes maxed, so why care anymore? And I play the game for my personal enjoyment so I don't care what people do. I know some people with a little more competitive mind cannot agree with me. I still want to burn the damn sof Goblin.

Out of interest and so I can build an analogy that suits you, what mmo aspects of rs do you enjoy?

 

Because it's the best damn timekiller I know. And I generally enjoy getting random stats in games so RS is perfect for me that way.

[Platinum_Myr]

Yes, time spent in game is a luxury that not many people can afford. However, the difference is that everyone has a maximum number of hours per day or per month they can physically play. (24 hours a day). EVERYONE will always have a maximum of 24 hours in one day that they could play.

 

Money doesn't work that way. A person with more money can use that ot make even more. There isn't a limit on how much money a person can spend in a given day (assuming they have it.) That's the difference between time and money.

 

A person who can spend 24 hours a day will never be able to spend more than that. Being able to spend money on the game creates a much bigger impact than time spent.

If you exclude gp purchased from illegal sources, there is a limit on how much money a person can spend on the game. At the moment, that's $200 per day. Granted, paying $200 a day is as likely as playing 24 hours a day for a vast majority of players. It's just not going to happen. However, there will be people that spend money and spend 12+ hours a day on RS. If they're going through channels that Jagex set up and don't disrupt other player's game, I don't see the major problem. It's not healthy (excess time) and it's probably going to encourage more silly SoF escapades (excess money), but overall I'm not impacted.

 

At the end of the day, from what I've seen of RS, putting in excessive time or money won't help you if you don't learn to play the game. You can have tons of items and xp, but that won't help in playing strategies in PvP or Boss hunting.

 

The whole point of my post was about gaming in general, not about specifically runescape. Yes in Runescape there is (currently) a 200$ limit a day. But this is a limit defined by Jagex. It is a barrier that could be overcome or changed. The issue is that some players like to be able to compete on the same aspect. In Runescape, those aspects are efficient use of your time. We can already determine (if people are willing to truthfully share it) the number of hours spent on a game character.

 

The fact of the game is that there *are* ways of comparing players. So while you might not find it competitive because you don't care about comparing yourself to another player, it is *possible* to be competitive.

[The Runar]

Grab the Gold!

 

Massive milestones deserve equally huge celebrations, and they dont come much bigger than RuneScape reaching 200 million accounts created since launch! Thats why - in anticipation of reaching this mind-boggling number - for this weekend only were adorning the Squeal of Fortune with gold coin goodness!

 

So from 00:00 Friday 22nd June to 23:59 Monday 25th June GMT, all gold coin prize slots will be sporting five times their normal values. Slots previously carrying 1000 coins will carry 5000, slots that once carried 5000 will now boast 25,000 and...well, you get the idea. Its fivefold coinage across the board!

 

Not only will all gold coin prizes be quintupled, but there's also a chance to win the monster ultra-rare grand prize: a 200 million gold coin mega-jackpot! 200 million accounts, 200 million coins its our way of marking the presence of every player whos ever walked the lands of Gielinor during our 11 year history, so this prize will be a permanent feature on the Squeal of Fortune from now on.

 

With all of that lovely loot up for grabs, plus all of the usual goodies waiting to be won on the Squeal of Fortune, this weekend is the perfect time to use your free, earned and bought spins to land yourself a dream prize. Dont forget RuneScape members get 2 free spins a day instead of the usual 1, and you can read more about the other ways to get yourself some extra spins by checking out our wiki article here.

 

Good luck!

 

The RuneScape Team

[Drazhor]

And we thought we were gonna get a week without a SOF related update...

[Bxpprod]

Calling in the butthurt brigade.

 

Butthurt Brigade to the front!

 

200m, mostly likely a super rare prize, causing such a huge fuss.

Sad really.

[Octarine]

By this point I'm not surprised by anything they do with the SoF now... S'only for a weekend (and not like the 200m prize will make much of a difference anyway) so it shouldn't really be a big problem..

[Bxpprod]

By this point I'm not surprised by anything they do with the SoF now... S'only for a weekend (and not like the 200m prize will make much of a difference anyway) so it shouldn't really be a big problem..

 

so this prize will be a permanent feature on the Squeal of Fortune from now on.

 

Plz sir.

[Octarine]

By this point I'm not surprised by anything they do with the SoF now... S'only for a weekend (and not like the 200m prize will make much of a difference anyway) so it shouldn't really be a big problem..

 

so this prize will be a permanent feature on the Squeal of Fortune from now on.

 

Plz sir.

Eh there's already stupidly rare divines and elys on there and not like that made a big difference :P

[Dire_Wolf]

 

Eh there's already stupidly rare divines and elys on there and not like that made a big difference :P

The items will be lost on death. 200M is a different case.

[Bxpprod]

 

Eh there's already stupidly rare divines and elys on there and not like that made a big difference :P

 

The argument will state that because Lucky Divines et.al are untradeable, the damage is minimal outside the initial shock on prices after it's release (unless they were going to change it to a common item in which case lolgf). 100m cash is liquid, moveable and tradeable for [anything]. It has the potential to do some damage.

 

 

The items will be lost on death. 200M is a different case.

 

*If not one of your items you choose to keep. And frankly, you'd have to being a [bleep]ing idiot to not.

[Hedgehog]

>.>

Not cool

[Ambler]

Well, there's a suprise.

Another step towards buying gold?

[Platinum_Myr]

Wow. How do they manage to sink my expectations of jagex lower every single week?

[Den]

Ahahahaha. There it is. I knew my prediction of every other week wouldn't fail me.:rolleyes:

[Heart of a Lion]

If the Squeal of Fortune is here to stay, at least keep all items cosmetic and or lucky status. Quintupling the amount of gold for one weekend isn't so bad, but making 200 million gold permanently winnable will be terrible for the economy.

[Platinum_Myr]

If its any consolation the 200m prize is likely to be incredibly rare. It will have a huge impact on 99% of the players who could possibly get it (anyone with under 100m networth). You are right I think its bogus, and they should've kept everything untradable, and at least the mask wasn't an inflation since it just moved money around.

 

It just feels like every SoF update gets more brazen.

[Robert_R]

They might as well just stop this stupid update the SoF every other week crap and start selling items like we all know they want to :rolleyes:

[Sir_Squab]

Yeah, if Jagex makes the 200m reward rare enough it shouldn't have a huge effect on the economy.

 

Still think it's bogus and should be removed. But hey, it turns the SoF into more of a lottery.

 

If you want to be optimistic, think about the real world value of 200m. If that money can be traded, in can be RWT. If it can be RWT, that means that the SoF is gambling, because of the potential but not guaranteed cash pay out. Which would hopefully cause the SoF to be nerfed or removed.

 

That being said, I'm not quite so optimistic that will happen. I'm hoping for it kinda in the same way I'm hoping I win that 200m. (I've never bought spins, but I've decided not to boycott it entirely. Especially since I don't think the SoF was a problem until a week or so after released when they started selling spins.)