Torso is NOT better then Adamant

[pulli23]

Pulli, the Proselye Top will beat it in offense, and you said it yourself, you won't use it because you're lazy and don't want to watch the screen all the time. But it IS better than a torso. I know lazy comes off as an insult, I don't mean it to be, but it's the only word I can think of at this time. :?

 

 

 

And I think the Rune Defender will come out to be worth the time as it takes signifigantly less time than a torso and it's the best armour for the shield slot.

 

I wonder: I really wonder if it's more efficient (since I also earn all my money from those tasks, and my point would be to maximize profits at those lesser tasks). Prayer potions really add up in the costs.

[Poppet]

I don't get the point of saying the fighter torso is terrible.

 

1. First torso item with str bonus which is 4 and the Bandos Chestplate still gives the same bonus yet more expinsive.

 

2 The Fighter Torso is for TRAINING on low level monsters not things like Armored Zombies.

[Calzer101]

Lol I totally Understand your arguement after reading several pages,

 

 

 

I personally own 1 Torso ATM, I have lost 1 during DT, SK, and one other I forget which is 4 torso's and about 40+ hours of wasted time.

 

 

 

Anyway I wear a torso mostly for looks (Looks good on girls as I am on rs) but sometimes I do prefer a SC Platebody which is equal to a Rune Platebody. Torso has 4+ Strength which gives me 1 Extra hit for most of my weapons used and also has a similar slash defense bonus which is the most commonly used weapon style eg Whip, D scim, SS, GS.

 

 

 

For rune plate (SC plate), I use this for when fighting real tough NPC's that doesn't deserve the extra 1 hit to sacrifice maybe 20HP on myself, Plate has an alrounded defense bonus stats which is good when there are rangers, obby maul or what so ever in pvp (in and out pvp worlds). As this also mentions Barrows and Proselyte I highly prefer to use these OVER torso on many occasions.

 

 

 

In the 8 Hours spent I can make 2-4M (using WC, Mining, fishing, Aviansies etc), While using a rune platebody takes absolutely no time to get, and considering its only 45k seems free to me (lol a bit rich :D). Torso I personally ONLY EVER use to well Show off with my Skill cape + ags such and such, and also when I fight NPC's like Moss giants, Pest control, Yaks etc as they dont hit much. TIP! Also another very good combination for using torso is using a black or slayer mask together (ONLY ON SLAY TASKS) as this will cause more hits then damage received (what I beleive).

 

 

 

Overall Result!

 

Torso = Skilling, Showing Off, Hitting hard, No defense quality, Not Worth time.

 

Rune/SC Plate = And all rounded AFFORDABLE AND Timeless Plate and most common choice for a Platebody.

 

Barrows = Extra Defense + Prayer bonus Gives it a edge in PVP (in and out worlds), and NPC Combat.

 

Proselyte = Pray Bonus that will last very long and is good for versing NPC's 150+ (Most) with the use of Prayer potions and also a decent PVP Armour as can keep prayer on for a long period of time.

 

 

 

There you go Longest post ever on a forum LOL by me :D

 

 

 

~~Calzer101~~~

[Kietaro1]

So let me get this straight, you guys defending the efficient side of the torso being not worth the time never sit in game and talk to friends. How about clan events or community things such as MMSW or TET events? Do you ever go to Godwars dungeon? Ever done a quest? How about Castle Wars or Pest Control? Have you ever had one of your friends die at DKs and left what you were doing to open the doors for them before their inventory degraded? If you have, why not do the math on how much experience you lost doing those things? Or potential gains that you may have earned by doing an activity that makes hundreds of thousands of gold/hour (because it seems that is all you do, efficiency of course is best).

 

 

 

In other words you seem to be trying to discredit those that spent time getting a torso because it is not the best way to get experience. To me you are making the game into more of a job than a game BUT if that is what you enjoy then by all means have at it. I understand liking to maximize time spent/xp or money gains. While not playing I will often mull over ways to fine tune my daily activities to make them faster or include more things. In the same regard you have to understand that players are not going to care about your math, your argument, or even documented evidence. They are going to play the game the way they want because they enjoy it. I do not have a torso nor have I ever wanted/needed one. I have mastered Barbarian assault in all the roles though, gotten the gloves, and many granite platebodies. I enjoy the game as well as an aspect of completion that I strive for in game.

 

 

 

In contrast however, math and efficiency seem to control your gaming enjoyment. So be it. When other such as myself that enjoy other aspects present ideas contrary to yours, in order to be a good conversationalist, you must respect their ideas or they write you off even more. They shut down and ignore any points that you may present, no matter how true they may be. This carries over into many aspects of life but it seems the majority of our community have no concept of paradigms. Anyway I digress. Since you look for efficient ways to do things the torso is not worth it to you.

 

 

 

To a slayer however, higher hits are more important than combat experience. They will often use super potions as well as piety/chivalry in order to complete tasks faster. As far as xp goes, sure the torso may not compare but if you are hitting 1 extra damage every so often that is 1 less damage that needs to be made thus quickening your ability to kill things. This in my opinion trumps the 132 million experience, even though that is a arbitrary number in my opinion, needed to even out the gap of time spent getting the torso. Within the realm of slayer where the torso is most often used, extra damage equates to less time on task and more tasks per hour, therefore more useful.

 

 

 

Now if you sit in the dungeon below the alter in the wilderness just getting combat experience and cash, you are missing out on slayer experience and in my opinion THAT is inefficient. Xp in my opinion always outweighs cash and xp in two skills is better than one, regardless of how quickly you can get one or another. For instance, I have full lumberjack, ring of fire, flame gloves, and a strung rabbits foot. In the time it took me to get all of that (hunting levels for the rabbits foot, combat levels for temple trekking, temple trekking, firemaking levels, and the beacon network), I most certainly could have a higher woodcutting level BUT now I can level firemaking and woodcutting at a faster rate which appeals to me in the same way that the torso makes slayer quicker.

 

 

 

Bottom line is you will always be able to argue one way or another as far as these things go. It comes down to how you want to play the game. To me the promise of faster slayer makes the alure of the torso much more important in my opinion. Sure melee experience may get lost in the fold but I waste more than 8 hours a week on helping friends, participating in group events, doing things that are not even decent ways to train, or completely wasting time and just chatting with friends in a Lumbridge sheep farm.

[Danqazmlp]

Quoting myself in the other thread:

 

 

 

Can i please start the 'Anti-Efficiency' Club, for people who play for fun not 0.3% better exp over 500 hours?

 

 

 

I personally couldn't give three ducks about torso being less efficient, it looks nice is more fun to use and fun to get. So put that way, Torso IS better than Addy.

 

 

 

Lets use a points system. 1 point for effiency, 1 point for looks, 1 point for fun to use, -1 point for embarrisment while wearing

 

 

 

Toros = 2

 

Adamant= A big fat 0

 

 

 

I'm glad people in real life don't cling on to this attitude 'No don't buy that supercar, your ford fiesta is more efficient! in the time it takes you to earn the extra money you could already have driven around quicker!'

[Cha0sx]

Pulli, the Proselye Top will beat it in offense, and you said it yourself, you won't use it because you're lazy and don't want to watch the screen all the time. But it IS better than a torso. I know lazy comes off as an insult, I don't mean it to be, but it's the only word I can think of at this time. :?

 

 

 

And I think the Rune Defender will come out to be worth the time as it takes signifigantly less time than a torso and it's the best armour for the shield slot.

 

 

 

What if you're very unlucky and it ends up taking 20 hours for the Rune Defender? ...>_>

[AlexDT]

Quoting myself in the other thread:

 

 

 

Can i please start the 'Anti-Efficiency' Club, for people who play for fun not 0.3% better exp over 500 hours?

 

 

 

I personally couldn't give three ducks about torso being less efficient, it looks nice is more fun to use and fun to get. So put that way, Torso IS better than Addy.

 

 

 

Lets use a points system. 1 point for effiency, 1 point for looks, 1 point for fun to use, -1 point for embarrisment while wearing

 

 

 

Toros = 2

 

Adamant= A big fat 0

 

 

 

I'm glad people in real life don't cling on to this attitude 'No don't buy that supercar, your ford fiesta is more efficient! in the time it takes you to earn the extra money you could already have driven around quicker!'

 

:|

 

This thread has nothing to do with looks, fun or any other factor than mathematics. In the time it took you to get the torso, you could have gained about 500k experience. To make up for that, you'd need to gain millions of combat experience. That's it. That's all we're saying. We're not saying the adamant chainbody looks better than the torso. We're just saying that you'd gain more experience by buying an adamant chainbody then training than you would if you got the torso then trained. This efficiency does not need to be applied to the game - I stand around in banks a lot, wasting time I could have used to gain experience. I do not, however, argue that doing so is better than training constantly, because I would be fundamentally wrong.

 

 

 

And your point system seems a little arbitrary.

[bedman]

So let me get this straight, you guys defending the efficient side of the torso being not worth the time never sit in game and talk to friends. How about clan events or community things such as MMSW or TET events? Do you ever go to Godwars dungeon? Ever done a quest? How about Castle Wars or Pest Control? Have you ever had one of your friends die at DKs and left what you were doing to open the doors for them before their inventory degraded? If you have, why not do the math on how much experience you lost doing those things? Or potential gains that you may have earned by doing an activity that makes hundreds of thousands of gold/hour (because it seems that is all you do, efficiency of course is best).

 

 

 

In other words you seem to be trying to discredit those that spent time getting a torso because it is not the best way to get experience. To me you are making the game into more of a job than a game BUT if that is what you enjoy then by all means have at it. I understand liking to maximize time spent/xp or money gains. While not playing I will often mull over ways to fine tune my daily activities to make them faster or include more things. In the same regard you have to understand that players are not going to care about your math, your argument, or even documented evidence. They are going to play the game the way they want because they enjoy it. I do not have a torso nor have I ever wanted/needed one. I have mastered Barbarian assault in all the roles though, gotten the gloves, and many granite platebodies. I enjoy the game as well as an aspect of completion that I strive for in game.

 

 

 

In contrast however, math and efficiency seem to control your gaming enjoyment. So be it. When other such as myself that enjoy other aspects present ideas contrary to yours, in order to be a good conversationalist, you must respect their ideas or they write you off even more. They shut down and ignore any points that you may present, no matter how true they may be. This carries over into many aspects of life but it seems the majority of our community have no concept of paradigms. Anyway I digress. Since you look for efficient ways to do things the torso is not worth it to you.

 

 

 

To a slayer however, higher hits are more important than combat experience. They will often use super potions as well as piety/chivalry in order to complete tasks faster. As far as xp goes, sure the torso may not compare but if you are hitting 1 extra damage every so often that is 1 less damage that needs to be made thus quickening your ability to kill things. This in my opinion trumps the 132 million experience, even though that is a arbitrary number in my opinion, needed to even out the gap of time spent getting the torso. Within the realm of slayer where the torso is most often used, extra damage equates to less time on task and more tasks per hour, therefore more useful.

 

 

 

Now if you sit in the dungeon below the alter in the wilderness just getting combat experience and cash, you are missing out on slayer experience and in my opinion THAT is inefficient. Xp in my opinion always outweighs cash and xp in two skills is better than one, regardless of how quickly you can get one or another. For instance, I have full lumberjack, ring of fire, flame gloves, and a strung rabbits foot. In the time it took me to get all of that (hunting levels for the rabbits foot, combat levels for temple trekking, temple trekking, firemaking levels, and the beacon network), I most certainly could have a higher woodcutting level BUT now I can level firemaking and woodcutting at a faster rate which appeals to me in the same way that the torso makes slayer quicker.

 

 

 

Bottom line is you will always be able to argue one way or another as far as these things go. It comes down to how you want to play the game. To me the promise of faster slayer makes the alure of the torso much more important in my opinion. Sure melee experience may get lost in the fold but I waste more than 8 hours a week on helping friends, participating in group events, doing things that are not even decent ways to train, or completely wasting time and just chatting with friends in a Lumbridge sheep farm.

 

 

 

Look at the bolded things to see what I want to comment on.

 

 

 

1) This topic was pointed to people who HATE BA, yet they do the minigame for 5-10 hour straight to get this torso. They do it cause they think the +4 str will make a world of difference. Well, the OP said, you are better off not doing BA and training with an addy chain then... You will get more experience in the total time. (unless you train the time it takes to get 137M xp)

 

 

 

However, IF you are having fun, or IF really really like hitting higher, despite wasting time to get it, then by all means, GET It.

 

They are just saying, EFFICIENCY WISE, they are not worth getting. Fun is a hard factor to compare. If you have fun training combat with a bronze dagger, go on. It's not efficient, I'll say, but you will say: I know, but I have fun, and I can say nothing to counter that.

 

 

 

2) This is were you start talking nonsense. You are saying people with a torso will get less experience, yet finish a task on a shorter time cause they hit higher. Well, let me tell you this: experience = hits (1 hit = 4 xp when you dont train controlled). So how on earth can compare "hits" with combat experience, when they are the same.

 

Let's say we both have 100 hours to waste. I get an addy chain and I go slaying. You get a torso first (=8h to get) and go slaying. I'll get more experience, thus more hits in. You will hit 1 higher (sometimes), but you will have less time to train (only 90 hours), so in the end I will have more experience (= total hits done).

 

However, if you had fun getting the torso, and hitting 46 in stead of 45 once in a while, all right, good for you. We are just saying, efficiency wise, it isnt worth it. Not more, not less.

 

 

 

Btw, I have a torso too, and I use it from time to time on slayer tasks when I use a bunyip. I also "loose" much time doing nothingin bank, etc etc...

 

I do like to hit as high as I can, and I dont regret getting the torso. However, I do admit that MATHEMATICALLY, and EFFICIENCY WISE, it's not worth it.

 

Is that that hard to understand?

[Kietaro1]

I was speaking in a general overview of the 132 million experience needed to close the gap. In other words, the player with the addy chain will have more experience with the 8 hour head start but the slayer with the torso will complete tasks faster. Faster tasks are more desireable to me than 8 hours of experience.

 

 

 

Not to mention the OP based this on one of the best ways to train combat. Not everything could give 500k experience in the 8 hours it took to get the torso. Taking into account boredom, lack of focus, crowded worlds, banking if needed, and any other aspect that could interfere with this method of training (Murphey's Law after all) I would speculate that not many people could get 500k experience in 8 hours, especially melee training. I mean if that were possibe then people could have a 99 in a combat stat in 2 weeks. But that is way off topic sorry. Anyway my point was more of completeing tasks faster (xp in two skills making up for lost time) as opposed to 8 hours of combat training.

[Soma2035]

Next why don't you try proving to me why Rune Defender is not worth the time to get, or how much it is worth :roll:

 

 

 

These calculations only go so far, you don't know the intricacies of the game like JaGEX.

 

 

 

Rune defender has fairly high attack bonuses (Over a 25% increase on a whip, for example) which is very helpful during slayer and such. In actuality, Rune Defender isn't all that useful for training on things such as rock crabs. Also, Rune Defender is still inferior to the better shields in this game.

 

 

 

The difference, though, is that a rune plate is 60K. A Dragonfire shield is over 10M, Divine and Elysian Spirit Shields are over 500M.

 

 

 

For Fighter's Torso, there's plenty of alternatives, most of them better. The only low cost alternative shields are really prayer books, Rune Kiteshield, Granite Shield, and Toktz-Ket-Xil. Granite and TKX are used when range defense is necessary. Prayer books are inferior to Rune Defenders unless you need prayer, and yes, people do use those for prayer bonus on occasion.

 

 

 

Fighter Torso's unique aspect is +4 strength, which is really not all that helpful, as pointed out, it doesn't even always increase your max hit, and when it does, it only increases it by 1 or so.

 

 

 

Rune Defender is unique for its attack bonuses for melee, which are large enough to make a difference on almost any higher level monster.

 

 

 

You gain experience and other drops while killing Cyclops, you don't gain these bonuses from BA.

 

 

 

All in all, it comes to the same thing. If you like Barbarian Assault, then by all means, get the Torso. It's nowhere near the best piece of equipment, but it's not the worst either. However, it's not worth it to play 6-8 hours of a game solely for an item that's inferior to several other alternatives.

[muggiwhplar]

I'd ignore the time efficiency factor when it comes to time spent in BA... just because most people don't mind losing that efficiency. As a rule of thumb, people prioritize fun over efficiency - or at least variety.

 

 

 

The torso's a rune chain w/ str bonus - it really doesn't matter if you're using it for melee, but when I see people maging w/ a fighter torso and ahrim skirt I just shake my head in disappointment lol

[dutchdreams]

Just document xp/hour markers and compare.

 

 

 

Not hard. Where are you getting 0.6%?

 

(120/4)*2)/100 = .6% faster XP

 

120 (average strength bonus with whip) /4 (for the exact boost the torso provides) *2 (to allow for strength bonus being only half of the formula, strength being the other half) / 100 (to convert to a percentage) = .6% (final allowance for how much of a boost fighter torso provides at a hypothetical 100% hitting rate)

 

 

 

Testing to determine such an exact decimal would be virtually impossible; there are far too many variables, and far too much variance in combat to determine that. However, previous mathematical experiments of mine have proven that results in combat can be calculated with a high degree of accuracy if one simply has a general idea of the underlying factors behind combat hits and XP.

 

 

 

I'll have a go to:

 

 

 

- Player A with addy chain (using your average str bonus with whip): 120 strength bonus, killing zombies

 

- Player B with Torso: 124 strength bonus, killing zombies.

 

 

 

How much of an improved efficiency is this? (124-120)/120 *100% = 400/120 = 3.333%

 

 

 

(the factor 2 is irrelevant, since Player A is regarded as the '100%'-individual.)

 

 

 

Assuming your eight hours to get the torso, the experience loss will be made up by player B after 8/0.0333 = 240 hrs.

 

 

 

Assuming both player A and B need an additional total of 36 million combat experience to max out to 99 att+str+def (allowing each player to have approx. 1 mill xp in each combat stat), then player B (Torso) will need around 12 hours less than Player A (Chain) to max out.

 

 

 

In other words, is investing 8 hours into BA worth gaining 12 hours if you wouldn't? Anything I missed ?

[Soma2035]

Just document xp/hour markers and compare.

 

 

 

Not hard. Where are you getting 0.6%?

 

(120/4)*2)/100 = .6% faster XP

 

120 (average strength bonus with whip) /4 (for the exact boost the torso provides) *2 (to allow for strength bonus being only half of the formula, strength being the other half) / 100 (to convert to a percentage) = .6% (final allowance for how much of a boost fighter torso provides at a hypothetical 100% hitting rate)

 

 

 

Testing to determine such an exact decimal would be virtually impossible; there are far too many variables, and far too much variance in combat to determine that. However, previous mathematical experiments of mine have proven that results in combat can be calculated with a high degree of accuracy if one simply has a general idea of the underlying factors behind combat hits and XP.

 

 

 

I'll have a go to:

 

 

 

- Player A with addy chain (using your average str bonus with whip): 120 strength bonus, killing zombies

 

- Player B with Torso: 124 strength bonus, killing zombies.

 

 

 

How much of an improved efficiency is this? (124-120)/120 *100% = 400/120 = 3.333%

 

 

 

(the factor 2 is irrelevant, since Player A is regarded as the '100%'-individual.)

 

 

 

Assuming your eight hours to get the torso, the experience loss will be made up by player B after 8/0.0333 = 240 hrs.

 

 

 

Assuming both player A and B need an additional total of 36 million combat experience to max out to 99 att+str+def (allowing each player to have approx. 1 mill xp in each combat stat), then player B (Torso) will need around 12 hours less than Player A (Chain) to max out.

 

 

 

In other words, is investing 8 hours into BA worth gaining 12 hours if you wouldn't? Anything I missed ?

 

 

 

Yes, you missed quite a bit actually.

 

 

 

1) Your strength level is included in the calculation. 4 strength bonus is not a 3.333% increase in efficiency. In fact, +4 strength doesn't even always have an effect. If it does have an effect, it's a single point of damage higher.

 

 

 

2) Going off your maximum hit doesn't work either. Seeing as the distribution of hits is generally randomly distributed, the one point may not increase your average by a whole lot.

 

 

 

3) You are not factoring the potential gains of using +5% attack / strength prayer for slightly longer, in case of proselyte, or the higher defense, thus less time spent eating + earning food, in the case you are fighting something that does damage and thus rune is a better option.

 

 

 

4) After 65 defense, the +4 strength is meaningless, because of Bandos Chestplate... which you can also assume is FREE, because many people are more than willing to lend one to a friend or associate if they are not lending anything else.

 

 

 

EDIT: From Tip.It's calculator:

 

 

 

80 Strength, +120 Strength Bonus, No potions or prayers, Controlled, max hit of 27.

 

80 Strength, +124 Strength Bonus, No potions or prayers, Controlled, max hit of 27.

 

 

 

Admittedly, Tip.It's max hit calculator isn't fully accurate. However, pending my set up at the time, my max hit doesn't always increase when I put on Bandos Chestplate. When it does, it's never by more than 1. While these exact numbers might not hold true, the theory behind it does: that +4 strength does not always equate to an increase in damage.

 

 

 

In other words, you are spending 6-12 hours on an item that's "unique" bonus isn't very useful, and occasionally has NO effect at all. It is also inferior in other aspects.

[Laura]

I'm glad people in real life don't cling on to this attitude 'No don't buy that supercar, your ford fiesta is more efficient! in the time it takes you to earn the extra money you could already have driven around quicker!'

People don't? I know I do. I'd rather buy a $30,000 car that gets 100mpg then a $20,000 car that only get 25. Efficiency drives most peoples lives and certainly economical decisions.

[Nytestryke24]

From where I stand, alot of people saying it's all about perception don't seem to be understanding what the author of the thread is trying to get across: that if you get torso because you think it will help your training, you have wasted time. He is not saying that if you enjoy BA you shouldn't get Torso, as clearly the game is about fun. He is also not saying that your opinion is rubbish [as some of you seem to be interpreting], merely pointing out that mathematically it is pointless. Notice mathematically.

[Danqazmlp]

From where I stand, alot of people saying it's all about perception don't seem to be understanding what the author of the thread is trying to get across: that if you get torso because you think it will help your training, you have wasted time. He is not saying that if you enjoy BA you shouldn't get Torso, as clearly the game is about fun. He is also not saying that your opinion is rubbish [as some of you seem to be interpreting], merely pointing out that mathematically it is pointless. Notice mathematically.

 

 

 

I agree with your point.

 

 

 

Surely the title of the thread should be changed, as torso is better than addy FACT.

 

 

 

Shouldn't it be more like 'BA'ing when you dont find it fun is pointless'

[Nytestryke24]

From where I stand, alot of people saying it's all about perception don't seem to be understanding what the author of the thread is trying to get across: that if you get torso because you think it will help your training, you have wasted time. He is not saying that if you enjoy BA you shouldn't get Torso, as clearly the game is about fun. He is also not saying that your opinion is rubbish [as some of you seem to be interpreting], merely pointing out that mathematically it is pointless. Notice mathematically.

 

 

 

I agree with your point.

 

 

 

Surely the title of the thread should be changed, as torso is better than addy FACT.

 

 

 

Shouldn't it be more like 'BA'ing when you dont find it fun is pointless'

 

 

 

Actually, BA'ing for a torso because you think it will help you in training is pointless is more to the point :P

[Danqazmlp]

Well yes but you get my point, the title is a false claim.

[compfreak847]

Well yes but you get my point, the title is a false claim.

 

It's still not false. If you want to get a platebody, like many threads in H&A are about, you will get more XP from getting an adamant chainbody then a fighter torso.

[BloodArgon]

While only reading the first page (complain all you want, I had a bad day)

 

I think hes trying to say that people go "zomg ur noob str is t3h cooli3st" and how everyone has the EXACT SAME OUTFIT ALL the time. (Fire cape, rune legs, torso, fury, whip, climbing boots/dragon boots, rune defender, helm of neit) I think it gets old too.

[Danqazmlp]

Well yes but you get my point, the title is a false claim.

 

It's still not false. If you want to get a platebody, like many threads in H&A are about, you will get more XP from getting an adamant chainbody then a fighter torso.

 

 

 

But it is false. 1 to 1, discounting the way you get either item, torso IS beter than addy. comparing the 2 items side by side the torso is better, and will get mroe exp FACT. What you are comparing is the time it takes to get the two items, and adding that to the equation. What i'm saying is straight out, 1 on 1, torso is better.

[Silver_Corner]

Well yes but you get my point, the title is a false claim.

 

It's still not false. If you want to get a platebody, like many threads in H&A are about, you will get more XP from getting an adamant chainbody then a fighter torso.

 

 

 

But it is false. 1 to 1, discounting the way you get either item, torso IS beter than addy. comparing the 2 items side by side the torso is better, and will get mroe exp FACT.

 

 

 

Actually not 100% fact(regarding the fact you get more xp). The torso only gives +4 strength which alone is not enough to increase your max hit. The max hit will only increase under certain circumstances where +4 str puts you over the bracket for a max hit increase. As someone mentioned before you need +6 or +7 str bonus addition to increase your max hit by 1.

 

 

 

So consider that in your argument as well, that sometimes in some circumstances, the torso's offense +4 stats will not increase your max hit, and the only stats that function are its defensive stats.

 

 

 

Considering your in the situation where the +4 bonus does nothing:

 

Rune > Torso > Addy

[Kenneh]

 

Actually not 100% fact(regarding the fact you get more xp). The torso only gives +4 strength which alone is not enough to increase your max hit. The max hit will only increase under certain circumstances where +4 str puts you over the bracket for a max hit increase. As someone mentioned before you need +6 or +7 str bonus addition to increase your max hit by 1.

 

 

And for most cases, the +4 str DOES put you over the bracket, increasing your max hit.

 

If we're gonna argue over bonus's, then why don't you all go and ask yourself why idiots melee in armadyl, with it's negative melee bonus, cause hell, there's loads of [bleep]s that do.

[Madmanpur3]

Well yes but you get my point, the title is a false claim.

 

It's still not false. If you want to get a platebody, like many threads in H&A are about, you will get more XP from getting an adamant chainbody then a fighter torso.

 

 

 

But it is false. 1 to 1, discounting the way you get either item, torso IS beter than addy. comparing the 2 items side by side the torso is better, and will get mroe exp FACT. What you are comparing is the time it takes to get the two items, and adding that to the equation. What i'm saying is straight out, 1 on 1, torso is better.

 

The title doesn't say "Torso is NOT better than Adamant statwise", the title simply states "Torso is NOT better than Adamant" then in the first post the OP stated HOW adamant is better than the torso.

 

 

 

So in terms of efficiency, the torso isn't better than adamant - which is exactly what this thread is discussing.

 

 

 

Also to the person on the first couple of pages ranting about 'perception'... :wall:

[sk8_tolivv]

Runescape has just become a race to who can get the best stats the fastest.

 

 

 

Some people don't understand the concept that games are meant to be fun so basically, I don't care.