Torso is NOT better then Adamant

[3hitm4g3u]

Torso rules. Used my torso since realease day of BA, don't plan on gettin rid of it or changing to bandos plate either.

 

 

 

K3nny12 - Proud owner of 2 torsos.

Did you bother to read this thread and the arguments within, or did you just jump right in?

 

 

 

Could you provide some explanation as to why the torso rules?

 

 

 

If he is 99 defence and still uses torso you can rest assured none of the arguments in this thread will sway him.

[AlexDT]

Torso rules. Used my torso since realease day of BA, don't plan on gettin rid of it or changing to bandos plate either.

 

 

 

K3nny12 - Proud owner of 2 torsos.

Did you bother to read this thread and the arguments within, or did you just jump right in?

 

 

 

Could you provide some explanation as to why the torso rules?

 

 

 

If he is 99 defence and still uses torso you can rest assured none of the arguments in this thread will sway him.

 

I'm 99 defence, and I'm always open to new ways of training, equipping myself, etc :?

[3hitm4g3u]

Torso rules. Used my torso since realease day of BA, don't plan on gettin rid of it or changing to bandos plate either.

 

 

 

K3nny12 - Proud owner of 2 torsos.

Did you bother to read this thread and the arguments within, or did you just jump right in?

 

 

 

Could you provide some explanation as to why the torso rules?

 

 

 

If he is 99 defence and still uses torso you can rest assured none of the arguments in this thread will sway him.

 

I'm 99 defence, and I'm always open to new ways of training, equipping myself, etc :?

 

 

 

Yes but the arguments in this thread are extremely weak, and mostly based on 'torso is liek uber lame bcuz u cud mke muny insted of getin torso' and he has already stated he has two.

[Kenneh]

Im maxed melee, 95 slayer.. you really think i need to change my set-up for 0.6% faster kills or whatever? By the time you hit 99 prayer, the extra points you loose on 'speeded' up prayer drain rate dont even come into consideration.

 

 

 

I won't change my gear, and i'll stick with my torso untill something similar comes out. Yes, similar as in you have to work for it.

 

 

 

Also as a side note, I'll keep my finger warm with my serker ring, i refuse to use a wealth.

[Lets_3ekout]

From a statistical point of view, sure torso isn't worth the time. But sometimes you have to come out of the math and into the game,that's what we play it for, right?

 

 

 

Personally, I enjoyed obtaining my torso and would do it again if I could. I've collected multiple items from there, used many high level gambles and spent more hours there then I care to know. Does it really have to be efficient? If you're going to class it as wasted time, then you may as well class playing RuneScape as a whole a waste of time (which in the end, turns out to be very true rofl).

 

 

 

I have bought a Bandos chestplate since I got my torso (sometimes I get tasset aswell, but I never buy tasset without plate), do I consider it a waste? Of course not. Firstly, as you've stated I can re-sell my Bandos chest plate and "fall back" on my torso with an extra 11M or so freed. Even then, I got torso for the fun of it.

 

 

 

Now on a statistical standpoint, you forgot to include the time taken to make the cash for the hefty price of Bandos (if you covered it, my apologies. I tend to start skimming posts without noticing it.). Since the fighter torso has no real money you have to pay to obtain it, the time is the only factor. Bandos requires no time, yet 11M cash is required (price is rough). I'd say an average player makes 300k/hr, which is actually quite generous considering most players just do what they enjoy more, possibly not even realising it's less efficient. At 300k/hr it takes 36.6 hours for a Bandos plate, less than a torso.

 

 

 

For someone in my position who has both, you must realise that although the Bandos plate might seem the obvious choice, it isn't. By selling my chestplate, I have an extra spare 11m to spend on a fury, beserker ring, supplies on getting new better equipment and generous supplies of super potions, prayer potions, summoning potions and food for months to come.

 

 

 

Granted, I don't play for statistics so I keep my bandos plate, there's very little arguement against it when it comes to looks!

[Dr_Vermin]

OH... MY... GOD... :shock:

 

 

 

I've read every post on this thread, and it's physically painful. Are any of you listening to each other? Here we have have two groups of people arguing two slightly different points, with the result that a satisfying conclusion cannot be reached.

 

 

 

The people stating that torso isn't worth it are claiming that EVEN IF IT DIDN'T TAKE ANY TIME, MONEY OR RESOURCES TO GET, IT WOULDN'T BE WORTH GETTING.

 

 

 

To which the poeple who believe the torso is a useful item raise the counteragument that THEY DON'T MIND HOW LONG IT TAKES TO GET THE TORSO, because they enjoy BA, so they disregard the exp, money and resources they could have gotten in the time they spent obtaining the torso. :wall:

 

 

 

See the problem here?

 

 

 

 

 

If the torso isn't better than other platebodies, then it isn't worth getting for combat no matter how much you like BA. It's only use is for looks, or to show off etc.

 

If the torso is better than other platebodies, then it is only worth obtaining if you like playing BA, in which case you can disregard the time spent taken to get it (this is a game after all), or if you plan on using it to train for incredible amounts of time.

[Slayer_Jesse]

i get the feeling that if these guys ran runescape, the'd slowy but surely drain all the fun out of it and replace it with efficency (no, i cannot spell. i know this.) the other problems i have with you is that you totaly dismiss the torso, because your numbers told you so. leme tell you something. those numbers mean NOTHING, unless you actualy intend to train/make money for those 6 hours.....10 hours... where do ou come up with that? ive never taken over 8 hrs.

 

 

 

As far as I'm concerned, your all "Holier than thou", jackasses. you refuse to take any argument seriously.

 

...

 

 

 

Are you insinuating...

 

a. that Barbarian Assault is universally fun for every player, ever, including the ones who have never played it before and are only interested in the rewards?

 

b. that avoiding efficiency is more fun than embracing it?

 

c. that math is meaningless?

 

d. that I am a "Holier than thou" jackass who does not know how to have fun?

 

 

 

Hey, guess what. I am offended. I don't see how you can say I have a "Holier than thou" attitude when you're the one projecting your ideas of fun onto others and ridiculing the activities that I enjoy. You can get 99 strength with a mithril warhammer on muggers and get 99 mining on blurite and catch wimpy birds to 99 hunter for all I care, but don't try to tell people that they should emulate your "more fun" methods. Here's something that may surprise you: "efficient" and "boring" are not synonyms. There is nothing inherently making it less fun to train firemaking on maples than to train firemaking on willows. I consider it much more entertaining to find the best method for training something before I spend my time training it. That research and thought is the only part of training most skills that requires any skill.

 

A. i did not say that. i'm saying that SOME people enjoy the game, and therefore, time there is not "wasted."

 

B. i dont mean that you should ignore effecncy. you guys just obsess over it.

 

C. i did not say ALL mash was meaningless, i said YOUR math was.

 

D. you? not nessisarily. i can think of a few other people though... plus, i was ticked off when i wrote that.

[AlexDT]

Ok, this thread is getting out of control. The original argument is this: To make up for the time lost obtaining the torso, you would need to train for about 130m experience. That is the only premise. If you have trouble working out what the OP is trying to say and have decided to argue relentlessly for something which really holds no relevance whatsoever, here are a few lists.

 

 

 

Here is a list of things which don't matter:

 

- How much you enjoy Barbarian Assault

 

- Whether or not you would have trained in the time you spent obtaining the torso. We will assume that you would have.

 

- "Perception", whatever the heck that means when applied to mathematics

 

- Any other applications of the words "fun" or "enjoyable"

 

 

 

Here is a list of things which do matter:

 

- How long it takes to get the torso

 

- Whether or not the +4 strength boost outweighs the exp you could have gained whilst obtaining the torso

 

- The numbers, which have been worked out

 

 

 

Here is a list of things which we can all agree on, but hold no relevance to the original premise:

 

- It is a game, and efficiency should not prevent you from playing Barbarian Assault if you enjoy it

 

- If you like hitting 1 point higher than normal, wear the torso. Or a Bandos Chestplate. Or Vesta's Chainbody.

 

- The torso's stats are better than an adamant chainbody

 

 

 

Here is a conclusion:

 

- The time it takes to obtain the torso can only be reimbursed by using the torso for millions upon millions of combat experience points. While Barbarian Assault may be fun, and the torso may be an epic-looking item, and hitting higher occasionally may be good in theory, when you work it out the torso is not all that useful. Do not let this stop you from using it if you already own one, but do not obtain a Fighter Torso simply to boost your exp/hr, because you will actually lose experience.

[Kenneh]

 

C. i did not say ALL mash was meaningless, i said YOUR math was.

 

 

Couldnt of agreed more

[stormveritas]

I agree with Dr. Vermin on this one.

 

 

 

The two sides aren't looking at the problem from the same perspective. Until that happens, you're never going to have any semblance of congruence.

 

 

 

I thought the argument made to start the whole thread is a very well thought, interesting one, but it is all predicated upon a very unrealistic assumption: that all people value their time the same way.

 

 

 

"Efficiency" is a very slippery slope. Who can play and tell someone else they're "wrong" for playing games in the Burthope Games room?

 

 

 

Of the 5M or so members, there are like 40 great people who enjoy it. They aren't making money, or exp, but so what?

 

 

 

The process of getting the torso is inefficient, but I'd wager most who play the game are not operating at full efficiency. Depending on your goals (money, item, skill, skill total), definition of efficiency can vary wildly.

 

 

 

For some people, the value of an item that lets them hit a little higher is extraordinary, since they really love the high red numbers. This appreciation may not be completely logical, but to them it makes the game more fun.

 

 

 

The argument for itself certainly works as a very valid opinion/argument based on the author's opinion. It also fails to account for the intrinsic value of hitting a smidge harder, and how much people enjoy that.

 

 

 

I don't have a torso; to me it's not worth MY time. If the next guy wants one, well, too each his own. Head down to BA and have fun.

[Obtaurian]

OH... MY... GOD... :shock:

 

 

 

I've read every post on this thread, and it's physically painful. Are any of you listening to each other? Here we have have two groups of people arguing two slightly different points, with the result that a satisfying conclusion cannot be reached.

 

 

 

The people stating that torso isn't worth it are claiming that EVEN IF IT DIDN'T TAKE ANY TIME, MONEY OR RESOURCES TO GET, IT WOULDN'T BE WORTH GETTING.

 

 

 

To which the poeple who believe the torso is a useful item raise the counteragument that THEY DON'T MIND HOW LONG IT TAKES TO GET THE TORSO, because they enjoy BA, so they disregard the exp, money and resources they could have gotten in the time they spent obtaining the torso. :wall:

 

 

 

See the problem here?

 

 

 

 

 

If the torso isn't better than other platebodies, then it isn't worth getting for combat no matter how much you like BA. It's only use is for looks, or to show off etc.

 

If the torso is better than other platebodies, then it is only worth obtaining if you like playing BA, in which case you can disregard the time spent taken to get it (this is a game after all), or if you plan on using it to train for incredible amounts of time.

 

 

 

THIS.

 

 

 

Also, everyone in this thread is a troll, excluding Dr Vermin (and Compfreak/Kent because they generally know what the hell they're talking about), but including me.

[AlexDT]

OH... MY... GOD... :shock:

 

 

 

I've read every post on this thread, and it's physically painful. Are any of you listening to each other? Here we have have two groups of people arguing two slightly different points, with the result that a satisfying conclusion cannot be reached.

 

Only one side is listening, and it is aggravating us. It's like arguing that the whip is a better weapon than the godsword because it has been textured red and black, and red is the colour for FAST, or that soloing Graar'dor with a rubber chicken is better because it's hilarious. They're both sort of valid points in a way, but they do not address the initial argument.

[bedman]

Totally agree, but with one thing:

 

 

 

"If you happen to have one, drop it, it's a waste of bank space".

 

 

 

On non multi tasks, where a bunyip heals me enough, I wear it since barrows plate is overkill.

 

Okay, I could wear prossy top and piety, but I either dont use prayer, or I flash piety, so prayer bonus is insignificant.

 

 

 

*Waits for you to say: "Using no piety, or at least 10 % strength is very inefficient if you make x amount of money per hour" , which is true...

[Dr_Vermin]

I've thought about this a bit more, and I think I have an answer to the following question:

 

 

 

1)Is there any situation where torso is the best body to use (disregarding bandos)?

 

 

 

One argument to this is that for offense proselyte is better, and for defense rune is better, so there is no scenario where the torso is the best thing to wear. Let's consider the scenarios:

 

 

 

If you're training with prayer potions and offensive prayers, proselyte is better for offense. You could wear the torso and still use prayer, but your prayer would drain far more quickly, causing you to drink more prayer pots. And no-ones time is worth that much, by several orders of magnitude.

 

If you're training without prayer potions, proselyte is still better since you can still use offensive prayers. Once you run out of prayer points, or if you have none to begin with, the torso becomes the best body for training quickly

 

If you are fighting an enemy which has a decent chance of killing you, the torso in inferior to both rune and proselyte

 

If you are playing a minigame where all that matters is offense, and prayer points can easily be replenished (think taking down the flag holder in c-wars, or pest control) the best option is to use the torso as well as prayers. Prayer is free and replensihed in these minigames, meaning proselyte is not superior

 

 

 

So there are situations where the +4 strength of the torso makes it the best body to wear despite it's lack of prayer and defensive bonuses.

 

 

 

Of course, this doesn't address the actual subject of this thread, 2) is obtaining the torso for these situations an efficient use of time? The answer to this depends on which definition of efficient we use. If we only consider money, exp and time as resources to be maximised or minimised, then it isn't. If we also consider 'fun' as a factor to be maximised, then whether or not obtaining the torso is worth it depends entirely upon the individual player.

[xSxqPowerx]

Alright, I got my torso on the first day of BA when I was just playing it to test out the minigame... I wouldn't call that a waste of time.

 

 

 

Prayer bonus is not offensive bonus.

 

It's defensive stats are irrelevant to me, I don't need food for any of the things I use it for.

 

Before bandos plate, it was totally worth getting to have the max strength bonus.

 

 

 

Maybe it's not worth getting the torso just to train with it. However, once I have the torso, as a result of playing the minigame for fun, it is the best platebody to use for slayer other than bandos chestplate.

 

 

 

Also, your calculations are based on nothing.

[JustPokemon]

lol what an escuse not to have a torso =P

 

 

 

torso = STRENGTH

 

any other top (other than bandos or ancient warriors) = NO STRENGTH

[JoeDaStudd]

I think your calculations are off or don't make complete sense.

 

Look

 

Your calculation;

 

((120/4)*2)/100 = 0.6%

 

Which ok it sound fine from the off, but look into it.

 

((A/B)*C)/100=R



A = average strength bonus with whip

B = for the exact boost the torso provides

C = to allow for strength bonus being only half of the formula

R = Result as a percentage

 

Lets use your formula, but with the climbing boots boost.

 

((120/2)*2)/100=1.2%

 

Which would mean, if the formula was correct climbing boots are better then torso. Which would also mean 2 strength bonus is better then 4.

 

See where I'm coming from?

 

 

 

You should fix the formula.

[Cha0sx]

Yeah it is (during slayer), def doesn't matter, bunyip heals all my hp during slayer, and I slay endlessly so it IS worth the time and the additional bonus to max hit it gives.

 

 

 

Your calculations are [cabbage], when you play RuneScape you investigate new updates for opportunities, so the people who were there when it came out weren't wasting time tbh, and how would they even know if the update was or wasn't worth going to do/investigate? They wouldn't because not all was known about it yet.

[bedman]

I think your calculations are off or don't make complete sense.

 

Look

 

Your calculation;

 

((120/4)*2)/100 = 0.6%

 

Which ok it sound fine from the off, but look into it.

 

((A/B)*C)/100=R



A = average strength bonus with whip

B = for the exact boost the torso provides

C = to allow for strength bonus being only half of the formula

R = Result as a percentage

 

Lets use your formula, but with the climbing boots boost.

 

((120/2)*2)/100=1.2%

 

Which would mean, if the formula was correct climbing boots are better then torso. Which would also mean 2 strength bonus is better then 4.

 

See where I'm coming from?

 

 

 

You should fix the formula.

 

 

 

Seems you are right.

 

 

 

It should be (4/120) /2 * 100 and thats 1.66%.

 

For climbing boots it comes down to half that: 0.83%

 

 

 

Dammit comp, you let me down :-)

[compfreak847]

I think your calculations are off or don't make complete sense.

 

Look

 

Your calculation;

 

((120/4)*2)/100 = 0.6%

 

Which ok it sound fine from the off, but look into it.

 

((A/B)*C)/100=R



A = average strength bonus with whip

B = for the exact boost the torso provides

C = to allow for strength bonus being only half of the formula

R = Result as a percentage

 

Lets use your formula, but with the climbing boots boost.

 

((120/2)*2)/100=1.2%

 

Which would mean, if the formula was correct climbing boots are better then torso. Which would also mean 2 strength bonus is better then 4.

 

See where I'm coming from?

 

 

 

You should fix the formula.

 

Your right, it only works for torso; the problem is, it's calculation how much of the strength bonus is coming from torso, which is messing up the other end. I'm too lazy to fix it right now, but I'll rewrite it later to include misses; I'm sure the results will be similar.

[daniels911]

Thank you for saving me 10hours playing a minigame i dont like. :D :thumbsup:

[pulli23]

 

Barrows gloves are the best in class, fighter torso is garbage.

 

 

 

 

I could've got a 99 stat or a hell of alot of money instead of getting barrows gloves.

 

 

 

Therefore using your logic barrows gloves are trash.

 

Not the point I'm making, as quests unlock so many pieces of game content that doing them is almost vital. The point I'm saying (goes along with this):

 

 

if all you're basing it on is training exp then others that are waste of time are void, barrows gloves, fire cape since it takes time to get them that you will not get back. People just get minigame/quest items to have them, not everyone is trying to be as efficient as possible with what they have.

 

There's a big difference - those items are actually worth using. Fighter torso has ZERO use, since other platebodies are better. So assuming you do spend the time getting it, it will simply rot in your bank, as it has no uses whatsoever.

 

Ever done slayer with a bunyip? - For example at dust devils a bunyip heals me enough so that I actually don't need defense (I don't even wield legs to minimize my energy loss getting there).. And I want to be as offensive as possible.

 

 

 

I happen to have torso in my bank: in that (lowish monsters) case it's really usefull!

 

 

 

The only thing that might beat it are proselyte top/bottom: but I really dislike having to watch the screen all the time (I always log out due to the 90 second timer, it goes like: logging in, clicking to fight something, waiting another fight - logging out)..

[Cha0sx]

Next why don't you try proving to me why Rune Defender is not worth the time to get, or how much it is worth :roll:

 

 

 

These calculations only go so far, you don't know the intricacies of the game like JaGEX.

[BabyPunchers]

Pulli, the Proselye Top will beat it in offense, and you said it yourself, you won't use it because you're lazy and don't want to watch the screen all the time. But it IS better than a torso. I know lazy comes off as an insult, I don't mean it to be, but it's the only word I can think of at this time. :?

 

 

 

And I think the Rune Defender will come out to be worth the time as it takes signifigantly less time than a torso and it's the best armour for the shield slot.

[nicrune007]

Pulli, the Proselye Top will beat it in offense, and you said it yourself, you won't use it because you're lazy and don't want to watch the screen all the time. But it IS better than a torso. I know lazy comes off as an insult, I don't mean it to be, but it's the only word I can think of at this time. :?

 

 

 

And I think the Rune Defender will come out to be worth the time as it takes signifigantly less time than a torso and it's the best armour for the shield slot.

 

 

 

But as you are getting the rune defender you are training at the same time, so defender is fine. :

 

 

 

Yeah on the fact that you need many experience points to make up for the torso, then yes torso is not as good. (Unless you are getting 200mil xp combat).

 

 

 

But overall-wise, not based on the point above, the reason to get it is if you are 45 defense and you want to hit 40-40 with dds instead od 39-39 like Bruno said.(Not sure if he said that but meh i cba to check :D ).

 

 

 

I wouldn't get a torso because BA sounds boring (never tried it), and i has my bandos plate