Jump to content
Racheya

Tip.It Times - 5th September 2010

Recommended Posts

I haven't read the first article but I pretty much agree with the 2nd. I think skillcapes are to blame for it, because they honestly did do more harm then good. Many people just get 99's just for the 99 now :mellow: All of mines was gotten for a reason.

 

However; I am guilty of playing for efficiency, but I don't find it harming any fun in the game. It allows me to get to the fun parts faster; which for me, is mostly minigames and pking. I hunt for a hour or 2, then go on a pking trip or do some barraging in cw or something. I've been training dun lately though for the ASN.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Why? Because people know the festival, just in the same way that we know Jagex. Jagex needed to to seperate wheat from chaff some how
I have the luxury of knowing multiple people who book cons. Great people, typically great shows, but I can honestly say typically only San Diego Comic Con has a big enough name for people to rush in blind, and thats with a decade of dominance. as a 9 year player, had the con been on my side of the pond, I can tell you Jagex doesn't inspire $75, or $50 worth of confidence to buy in blind. Just because you can make a game, doesn't mean you can do a convention. Backwards logic.

 

 

And Das, even without you having been at RuneFest, or me having been to some of your cons, you will agree there is a difference between Revenge of the Nerds-type nerds, and the people that attend these cons.

 

Oh?

 

I remember one person going completely berserk after he must have thought that his in game account was going to get that Party Hat.

 

I'm sure other things happened to fulfill those sterotypes ;)


"Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up, and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable - a most sacred right - a right, which we hope and believe, is to liberate the world."

Abraham Lincoln

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many thanks for the review of Runefest, I couldn't get time off work or I would have been there myself. It seemed like it would have been the kind of event that I wanted it to be, about bringing together like minded people in a fun place, with no shame in being a 'Scaper.

 

Which brings me to the second article. I too remember hanging out in the blue moon just chatting around with players rather than playing the game. I do kinda miss those days, I enjoyed the game more. I think I'd been a member for about 18 months before I heard about Tip.it, it never occured to me that you wouldn't try the quests without a guide. Back in those days, everyone who played was a guide. Players would hang around after finishing a quest to help someone who was just starting it, it was almost a kind of 'quest etiquette'.

 

Whilst I still think that playing the game to achieve a goal is a good thing, it does mean that other aspects of the game are being missed out on. If all you are doing is grinding on Yews, I hope you're happy with your cape. But there's more to Runescape (and life) than toil.


Cultjunky.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The first half of this article is essentially needless commentary that would fail even the most basic English Lit paper. So you went for an Indian? Nice... who hasn't? I don't get what that has to do with RuneFest.

 

And then, when I think you're about to give an opinion of RuneFest and move out of descriptive mode, you open some huge tirade about people who stereotype gamers conventions. An issue that has about as much to do with RuneFest as Classic.FM does to a Muse concert, an issue based on social pseudo-paranoia, and an issue which frankly I find ridiculous. People judge other people. It's a fact of life, and thank goodness it is or else our existance would be pretty damn boring. If you go to a convention for an MMORPG with loads of people dressed as Elves and Dwarves, be prepared for people to laugh at you and suggest you're not completely grounded in reality, or that you don't necessarily fit into the 'norm' of society. It's a common sense association.

 

You may as well argue that the Sun shouldn't rise in the morning, because you're fighting against a naturally-occuring inevitability. Aside from this, it has nothing to do with RuneFest and I don't understand why felt a need to write about it, except maybe a deeply-embedded fear of people judging you for gaming that was brought out by the experience of being at a convention and no one there apparently judging you, which actually, you mentioned in about paragraph two.

 

Can I suggest maybe removing that chip off your shoulder?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

This is boring to me now. Why is level hunting so popular, you ask? Well, because it gives players a tangible aim and a means to compare and compete. Simple as that. Sure, I agree that the grind approach seems to be missing the point, but who are we to judge what is fun for other people? If they get their kicks from having a better level than someone else and that constitutes entertainment in their eyes, surely that achieves the very same as your ideas on what "fun" is?

 

Clans, for example, offer many of the group collaboration/"fun" events that you mentioned. Even solo players can interact and perform activities with their friends, the opportunity is theirs to take. If they don't take it, so be it, but is there really any point in criticising someone else just because they don't play in the way that you, in your seat of Godly wisdom, deem best?

Why are you assuming that people are grinding for the fun of it? The whole point of the article is that they don't do it for the fun of it, or at least it's not their main goal. You can very well tell that these people aim for some kind of "ultimate account" which they plan using for fun later on, but they never get to the part where they have fun.

 

No, we shouldn't care about how people like to have fun. But we should start caring when those people start having way too much influence in the progress of the game. See how it's becoming more elitist because of these elite diaries, and a level 120 skill? That's the problem. The game should remain as accessible as possible to everyone who pays for it and therefore contributes to its improvement, and not manipulated by hardcore players/no-lifers that whine all the time just because they can't find anything else to do in real life.

 

You have the freedom to enjoy the game the way you want. But your freedom still ends where other people's freedom begins.

 

Can you honestly tell me that the people grinding levels derive no pleasure at all from either the experience or the outcome? I suspect that if this really was the case, Runescape would have virtually no 99ed skills because, let's face it, every single skill requires some kind of grind in order to level. Players discern a "need" to level based upon the prospect of greater wealth/enjoyment/"social" status etc and are therefore bound to the inevitability of grinding a skill at some point. Whether or not fun is their "main goal" seems somewhat irrelevant to me, if your assertion is that grinding cannot ever be fun.

 

I for one find any skill incredibly tedious, yet I still have 4 99s, 2 other skills in the 90s, and several not far behind (even if that lot has taken over 6 years to achieve for me). It's been slow progress and the levels bring little enjoyment on their own, but there are so many activities that I have taken part in (often with friends and clan-members) whilst gaining those levels that it has for the most part been an enjoyable ride. In a way, you could say that the grind HAS been fun, even if the fun was not directly derived from the grind.

 

I sympathise with your stance on the elite diaries and other high level content. I am 100% behind you when it comes to the stupidity of having a 120 skill, even if it does look like making sense in the context of dungeoneering. At the same time however, you have to remember that for many people, what YOU want is not necessarily what THEY want. Just as you mention the necessity for sensible co-existence, you must therefore apply it to your own desires. Clearly your account is well-balanced - as your level breakdown shows - but, if it is lacking in the areas demanded by elite content, should that require that those with the elite stats be "penalised" because of you? Let me assure you that as level-based elitism beckons, you will find your perspective has changed as you actively seek to overcome the greatest challenges, pushing both yourself and your pixellated avatar to new limits. Just because something is "hard" does not in any way mean that it is not fun, or that the journey to successfully completing that task cannot also be fun.

 

Might I also add that it is not just no-lifers or "hardcore players" who whine? Just as Stormrage has demonstrated by his outrage at being labelled a geek, I cannot give you any proof that I am not a no-lifer or hardcore player, but I will assure you that I am not. Either way, I don't habitually whine about all the "nooby" content that gets released. Similarly, the fact that I cannot hope to achieve the vast majority of the new elite tasks has not prompted me (nor will it) to hurl a bitter diatribe at Jagex for failing to meet MY needs. Nor have any of my high-levelled friends. Be careful to keep a distinction between high-levelled "casual" players and no-lifers (and any other class of person inhabiting the space between): their approaches, opinions, lifestyles, social skills etc will ALL be different. You might even find you like some of them, appreciate their personalities and experience, God-forbid you might even form your strongest friendships with some of them!! :P By the same token, you may well find that lower-levelled players constantly whining about their own inadequacies becomes tedious very quickly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good times. Thanks for your article and nice meeting you at RuneFest Cabbage Man.


ren_tbv450.png

Mechscape World (the original MechScape fansite)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The first half of this article is essentially needless commentary that would fail even the most basic English Lit paper. So you went for an Indian? Nice... who hasn't? I don't get what that has to do with RuneFest.

 

And then, when I think you're about to give an opinion of RuneFest and move out of descriptive mode, you open some huge tirade about people who stereotype gamers conventions. An issue that has about as much to do with RuneFest as Classic.FM does to a Muse concert, an issue based on social pseudo-paranoia, and an issue which frankly I find ridiculous. People judge other people. It's a fact of life, and thank goodness it is or else our existance would be pretty damn boring. If you go to a convention for an MMORPG with loads of people dressed as Elves and Dwarves, be prepared for people to laugh at you and suggest you're not completely grounded in reality, or that you don't necessarily fit into the 'norm' of society. It's a common sense association.

 

You may as well argue that the Sun shouldn't rise in the morning, because you're fighting against a naturally-occuring inevitability. Aside from this, it has nothing to do with RuneFest and I don't understand why felt a need to write about it, except maybe a deeply-embedded fear of people judging you for gaming that was brought out by the experience of being at a convention and no one there apparently judging you, which actually, you mentioned in about paragraph two.

 

Can I suggest maybe removing that chip off your shoulder?

 

Well, maybe you should start appreciating that articles don't necessarily need to be about single faceted, narrow things? If we're going to describe the experience of a Runefest trip, things like stereotypes and what to do before and after the event are going to be at the forefront of your mind. Parties and events are often judged by what happened before and after, because it's an effective way to establish whether the people got along well and also whether they felt good afterwards, aka the atmosphere of the event.

 

If the people who went to Runefest turned out to be the exact percieved stereotype of people who would have gone to Runefest (that of annoying nerds who have nothing better to do in their lives), the point wouldn't have been made. But the fact that these people were fun loving and the exact kind of people that would make an event like this great instead was noticeable and commendable.


~ W ~

 

sigzi.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because my two posts discuss different articles with large amounts of text, I shall not combine them even though they run side by side. If any forum mod sees the need to combine them (possibly with a hide section for matter quoted from other posters), please feel free. I lack the knowledge of how these forums work to do such a thing.

Apparently, some people feel that the rant bit is out of place in the article. You are perhaps right, but it is that emotion that comes up with many RuneFest go-ers when another idiot trolls up to the RuneFest forums, demanding he deserves a Flagstaff too. The same emotions that wash over you when you just planted that same Flagstaff, and people come up to you and start insulting you, calling you nerd, geek, loser or whatever, when they are enjoying the very same game that caused you to decide to go to Runefest. The same goes for the numerous people claiming to have gone if it was free.

 

I understand money is an issue to some. It is even an issue to me, but I had decided on making the trip to London my holiday for the year anyways. Could Jagex have handled things a little more sensitivly? Yes, I even said so in my article. But I am reminded of a giant festival in my own country. Lowlands (one of europe's biggest) has sold out all of its 70k tickets only three days after ticket sales opened up, without a single band having been anounced to be playing there. Why? Because people know the festival, just in the same way that we know Jagex. Jagex needed to to seperate wheat from chaff some how, and I tend to agree that they did indeed need to. That will without a doubt unleash the comments of elitism, but I can guarantee you that a lot of RuneFesters will agree (so aim those comments to Jagex as well?). And Das, even without you having been at RuneFest, or me having been to some of your cons, you will agree there is a difference between Revenge of the Nerds-type nerds, and the people that attend these cons.

 

I'm sorry if people felt personally insulted by the rant, most likely it was not even aimed at you. As I said, you are perhaps right that it does not fit with the article, but I felt it necessary to address the issue, even though it may never properly reach the type of people it was aimed at.

I feel your closing sentence deals most pertinently with the issues at hand here. Your rant, on a major fansite article, was utterly misplaced and poorly judged. Very few, if any, of the people who directed insults at you will read, or indeed care, about your experiences or your opinions. Whilst you have been criticised on other aspects of the article by others who either were there, or felt your report may have missed more interesting facts for those who didn't go, my sole grievance lies with your pointless tirade.

 

As a foil to your emotions, consider that perhaps you and your fellow participants are among the minority who feel such outrage about being labelled as geeks. Several people on this response topic alone are self-confessed nerds, whether or not they went to the event, so there need be no shame in saying "Yes, I am a nerd." You will ALWAYS receive abuse for behaviour which is deemed unusual, immature, or "just wrong" - I'm afraid that is, as someone else posted, a fact of life. I have come across several hardcore gamers in my time, mostly perfectly nice people, but generally not people I have a whole lot in common with. Where I spent my youth playing rugby, cricket, football etc, I can be confronted by someone who shares absolutely no interest in such things because they grew up on a diet of gaming. I'll not be the one to hurl insults, but given such people are generally in the minority, it is to be expected that people will think them unusual and subsequently express those thoughts... The anonymity of a computer screen sadly gives many people the "right" to crassly abuse those with whom they have little in common. But similarly, in my neighbourhood in East London, if you were found in a bar dressed in RS fancy dress, it is a pretty safe bet that you would be leaving the same bar without your wallet, maybe even a few teeth. These are sad facts of life, it is unrealistic of you to set yourself up in such a noticeably different manner whilst expecting people to view you as "normal". Some people feel threatened, some people feel confused, some people are just asshats, if you cannot weather the storm of abuse from them without such a furious and ill-judged backlash as was in your article then it is you who comes off looking worse. You have done RuneFesters few favours by it.

 

Your opinions and emotions ARE important, both to you and to those around you, but there is a time and a place to express them and I'm sorry to say that the front page of Tip.It is neither.

 

Now for the money side of things:

I'm utterly inexperienced in the world of gaming conventions, but I will go by what others with more experience have said. There was no proof at all that RuneFest would ever prove to be worth the £75 ticket price plus any associated travel and lodgings, so that would instantly be a turn-off for many people in these times of economic hardship. During my work on a playscheme for schoolchildren this year, we were confronted by parents who said that £35 a week was beyond their means, despite it covering 20 hours of childcare at an extremely low cost of just £1.75 an hour, fully £4.45 below the minimum wage, and likely to be closer to £6-7 lower than what any childminder would charge. £75 for just one day suddenly looks a whole lot more excessive. Let's say that someone from Manchester wished to travel down for the event - that'll be another £20 for train tickets. Then tube travel across London? £4-5 minimum depending on your arrival point and tube route, so it's suddenly become £100 for a day. Even someone from Kent is likely to pay £90+ for the day... That is a lot of money to be gambling on a completely untested convention, without even considering the probable cost of flights/Eurostar/ferry for those from further afield.

 

Many people are increasingly frustrated by Jagex's oversights and failings, so even the once golden name of Jagex could be seen as insufficient guarantee of the quality of the event. Comparisons with music festivals seem a little fatuous here I'm afraid, rather like suggesting that RuneFest is like the World Cup Final so should sell out...!

 

I feel I must also dispute your "wheat from chaff" comment. I'll not doubt that the others at RuneFest2010 were well matched to you and the other positive posters on this thread, but are you saying that people unwilling to spend £75 on an event of this type are somehow unworthy? In what way does an arbitrary charge of £75 assure that the "best" kind of people were there? It is in no way elitism, since there is no hint at all that there was any qualification to join the "elite" sect except the trusting willingness to part with £75 of your money. Perhaps I should charge £500 an hour in the hope that people are fooled into thinking I'm the best in the world at my job?! Setting yourselves up as the elite in this fashion shows the same closed-minded approach that leads many members to dismiss the thoughts and comments of non-members out of hand without even giving them due attention.

 

Even completely discounting the comments above, do you really believe wholeheartedly that if free entry had been announced honestly before the tickets had gone it would have ruined the day for you? It is ridiculous to suggest such a thing and casts an unfair and unfounded slur on vast numbers of players who were put off by the pricing and secrecy. Perhaps there would have been more nutters, but in a nuthouse, is that such a bad thing?! :P I'm pretty sure that at the very least it would've served to prevent the torrent of abuse you've apparently received to prompt your outbursts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, maybe you should start appreciating that articles don't necessarily need to be about single faceted, narrow things? If we're going to describe the experience of a Runefest trip, things like stereotypes and what to do before and after the event are going to be at the forefront of your mind. Parties and events are often judged by what happened before and after, because it's an effective way to establish whether the people got along well and also whether they felt good afterwards, aka the atmosphere of the event.

 

If the people who went to Runefest turned out to be the exact percieved stereotype of people who would have gone to Runefest (that of annoying nerds who have nothing better to do in their lives), the point wouldn't have been made. But the fact that these people were fun loving and the exact kind of people that would make an event like this great instead was noticeable and commendable.

Your first sentence is ridiculous. NOBODY has suggested that either article was single-faceted, or narrow. Many people have pointed out that Stormrage's article was marred by a silly tirade, also that the second article was too similar to previous articles to be of much substance. There is a clear difference.

 

For my part I had no problem with Storm telling us about the trips to the pub, it was fashioned similarly to the Jagex-released Golden Ticket interviews etc, so it seems to be a working format. That said, as you will read below, the fact that Storm and other members of the "elite" RF2010 club got on well doesn't really provide an accurate barometer of success... I can go to an event with a great bunch of friends who all get on well and it still be a terrible event regardless. Sure, I'd mind less in company, but it wouldn't make the event inherently any better.

 

I am pleased for Stormrage that he managed to make several acquaintances of like-minded people, but that merely points to the fact that a lot of the people were like Storm. None of us can honestly say that the people at RF2010 either were or weren't annoying nerds in some peoples' eyes, nor that their idea of "fun" matches in with general perceptions of fun and normality outside of the gaming world. To attempt to assert any such statement otherwise - by either yourself in favour of these possible nerds, or by an angry ranter against them - is pointless and will perpetuate itself rather like the "Evolution v Creationism" debate. Neither can prove the other 100% wrong, but a lot of hatred can be stirred up even if it is utterly misplaced.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Ts_Stormrage

 

Hey, i enjoyed your article (except the ranting bit)

 

Was quite sceptical about runefest, but i never vented it, and i would not even have gone if they paid my flightticket.

I just could not imagine it being fun or that i would enjoy being there (my age probably also has something to do with that)

 

Anyway, like i said, i enjoyed your article, cause i still was curious about what it was all about.

Your enthusiasm caught on and I was actually thinking: hmmm...maybe this was more fun then i thought

 

until i came to the ranting bit. Now i dont feel insulted by it but it automatically takes the whole article down.

and it changed my thoughts to : well if it really was that much fun, why would he bother ranting.

 

I know a big part of the rs community are a bunch of whining morrons and that they can really drive you mad.

But if you enjoyed it really that much, why care about what others think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Damn but that was the best Tip It times(s) I have ever read.

 

The first article left me feeling warm and fuzzy and wishing I lived in England.

The second reminded me of how I like to play. And I agree.

 

So, keep up the great articles!


"300 programmers make their futile but glorious last stand against 1000000 angry players in The battle of Misthalin. They fight for honor, glory and new content sacrificing themselves so that their game may live on. This is Madness! This Is JAGEEEX!"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wish I could have went, but I couldn't have flown to England :P

Great articles as usual :)


24zzxw3.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The unwarranted calling people of nerds (when nerd is used as an insult) is something to be discouraged, whether pertaining to Runefest attendees or otherwise.

It is often used purely to try and offend people for perfectly harmless lifestyle choices.

While I doubt the times article made that much impact on this issue, it seems ironic that there seems to be people taking offense at being asked not to offend people.

 

I will admit that basic uses of the word nerd, I'm not offended by. If a nerd is someone who has hobbies which require a little more intelligence/and or imagination than the average hobby (as is the case with most "nerd" hobbies) then I am a nerd and proud of it. After all many of the people who have done the most to advance human civilisation could be defined as nerds on this level.

but often people are including other factors when labelling people as nerds. They are saying that this person has no social skills, that they have no idea how to make friends or fit into normal society, that they have a virtually nil chance of a chance of attracting a member of the opposite sex.

While there may very well be a higher than average percentage of these socially inept types doing "nerd hobbies" - there is a tendancy for some people to lump everyone who engages in these hobbies into the same group.

 

It should come as no surprise then when some people will turn round and say no you're wrong, many of us do have social skills, more normal hobbies, friends, girlfriends, wives, families. - my personality is not defined solely by this one hobby.

 

Some might argue that people shouldn't worry about what other people think and say about you, and while that's true to an extent (especially on the internet) it's not something which people can turn on and off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@RuneFest:

 

Alas, I would have attendend if it wasn't but for 3 things:

1.) I live near D.C, so I would need to fly to England. Also, my familiy doesn't have passports, we would have to buy some.

2.) Saddly, I'm only 12, so my entire familiy would have to buy tickets, come, we would all have to stay in one hotel room, and my parents and sister don't care about Runescape, so they would be bored while I'm the only one having fun.

3.) Again, I'm 12, so I couldn't enjoy the entire event as mainly beer was being served.

 

Sounds like it was a fun event, I really regret that I couldn't attend it. I'm not upset about not getting the Flagstaff of Festivities. It's great that Jagex made an item to prove you attened the first Runefest. Also, it proves that now in the future, if Runescape toys or something are released, you could possibly get a code with the item, and have a copy of that toy in game, just for the heck of it! (I'm only 12 and aand I'm Christian, so I preach against the use of strong language, cursing, and swearing. I watch my language constantly, lol)

 

I hope that next year, Jagex can possibly make it so that younger Runescape fans will attend. Hopefully, the U.S will get out of the echonomic rut, and my parents will tolerate a Runescape wonder land for a day.

 

I also hope that next year, you DON'T get a code for buying a ticket, and that Jagex will state that before tickets go on sale. That way, like this year, only true Runescape fans, not affraid to be called a geak, will attend, instead of people just wanting a stupid in game item.

 

~Runes Rath

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I couldn't agree more with the 2nd article. My account has 65-70 days played (don't know for sure, last time i was member i had 63) and only 10m total xp. I like setting goals, but not ridiculous ones like 99 in a skill. I prefer something like getting 3 more fishing lvls or so, and even so i usually give up after the first lvl because it gets boring to do the same thing over and over again. I don't have any skills to brag with, no expensive items to show off, and i'm not training with the best xp/hr methods. If other people mock me because i use a rune longsword instead of a scimitar, I don't care. I'm just having fun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The one thing everyone has missed about grinding is the calming, self-hypnotic angle. Back before most RS players were born (that is, in the 90's), the desktop computer industry and commentators were astonished by the hypnotic appeal of a repetitive activity provided on new machines: Solitaire. Why? It's simple, it has easy rules, the player feels "in control" - just put the red 9 on the black 10 ... happiness! It's a break from real life (as long as you don't let it interfere with RL, like getting fired for playing it at work, lol.) It's a way to "decompress" from RL pressure.

 

Grinding in RS was the same way - click on the bowstring in the lower corner, click on the unf bow just below it: click-click, click-click, click-click. If your workstation was set up properly so you didn't get sore, you could do this for hours. Easy. Hypnotic. Calming. Soothing. Happiness. Yay!

 

There's no reason for someone to grind if they don't enjoy it. I was trying to get 92 fm in March 2009. After doing about 100K xp per night for a week, I decided I was fed up and would be ok if I NEVER got an inferno adze. A year later, the first double xp weekend got me to 92 (... and due to chopping ivy I never use the adze, lol.) I'll never grind FM again - it doesn't soothe me.

 

The second article needs two words to explain. Skill Capes. They ruined the mentality of Runescape. They started the trend of grinding levels instead of levelling for fun.
Basically, in modern RS, to skill you need money, to make money you need to skill. An endless cycle. <snip> Skillcapes drove the money out of skilling which drove the fun out of runescape.

Skillcapes pretty much ended all ability to profit from herblore, which used to be a respected and extremely necessary skill at higher levels. (Though friends point out that the GE started the slide - high levels with thousands of old pots in their bank finally could get rid of them without hawking them for hours in Falador.) There is NO profit in herblore now, if you count the sale value of the herb (versus considering it "free" because you picked it up.) That's "opportunity cost" - if you cash in the herb, and buy finished potions off the GE, you can spend the money on something else. The cost to train herblore (before the double xp weekend) ranged from 10 gp/xp up to 150gp/xp.

 

But it's nobody else's business what a player chooses to do with their time. As the line goes, "Play your own game."

 

 

RUNEFEST:

Das and waheera1 expressed my feelings on not attending Runefest. An unknown and untested con, with no published agenda and no details, wasn't something I could justify flying overseas (from the US) to attend. It's not how cons are generally established. Jagex does make mistakes, as we've all experienced - it doesn't make them bad, they are only human. (no offence against them, I am an avid player and fan of Jagex.) But without experienced con organiser guidance, I wasn't sure what to expect, and didn't want to be out hundreds of dollars for a disappointment.

 

Obviously the con turned out well - but this was entirely too unknown, with no agenda, nothing. I confess I am envious of the flag thing in RS, but I can't begrudge attendees their goodies. Doesn't make them better than me, it's just a souvenir, like a photo of the Eiffel Tower.

 

p.s.: I liked the article (less the rant) - the point about meeting in pubs shared his experience of meeting RS friends in Real Life. Made the article more vivid and more enjoyable! I think it was well done. <3:


gallery_28257_123_2330.jpggallery_28257_123_196.gif

it's a lot easier to get over yourself when you look at intelligence the same way you look at beauty, or height, or eye color: being smart is easy, but being good is hard ... being smart is handed to you, being good is handed to *nobody*.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

for the record, I'm lvl 136. I dont see no 'geeks', no 'newbs', in this game.

Some have attitude, to be expextected. But I find most respectful.

 

Ts! Your article was good. But for the rant :(

 

And the fun is out of RS, I disagree. I'm member, but stilll go F2P with friends :)

for fun. Not all of us play this for money :)

 

...Andre.


Andre the Giant (Gentle Giant)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like RuneFest was a lot of fun, i think i would still feel too geeky if i went tho :oops: god knows what the missus would say :shame:

 

Regarding the second article, i agree about the constant strive for squeezing every single point of xp out of your playing time ruining the fun of the game. I just started playing again with the bonus xp weekend, one last grind to max my combat stats then im going to actually play the game and explore all the new features that have been added over the last few years


RS Name: o Johnno o

Previously Ultrasmasher

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seriously, calling yourself the cabbage man and saying it should follow you a lot of time is downright egocentric. Almost noone will actually remember that in, say, 3 months. That's unless you continue to sign with it.

 

I don't know why, but your articles almost always have that elitist tone, this one is perhaps the worse.

 

 

 

 

Second article's topic has been revived so many times it's not even funy.


WarBlastoise.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am inclined to agree with Das here but I will add somewhat of an addendum to that in response to one or two comments in particular:

 

It also gets tiresome to listen to people saying "I would've gone if I knew it was free". MMG said at the very start of Runefest that he wanted the most tenacious and most ardent fans to be there, and the only way to get that done, was to give out no information about the event or its whereabouts. He could have been a bit more sensitive by announcing the price change a week after the announcement that tickets were sold out, but he didn't, so be it.

 

Here is something someone else posted elsewhere that is a pretty astute commentary on this subject, in my opinion:

 

If you believe MMG you will believe anything. Runefest was supposed to be a lot bigger than it actually was, they scaled it down in a hurry and gave people their money back because there was a lack of interest and they couldn't justify laying on something worth 75GBP in the end. Thats why they didn't release details and there was a large gap with no information at all. Someone found a hidden page on the website showing they were supposed to be in holding it at Olympia not a smallish cellar...

 

So he comes out saying this as a ruse to cover up their ineptness, I'm sure it was only intended for the people who went to hear[referring to the whole opening speech abut weeding out certain people..], also to make them feel special, rather than to belittle anyone else who wasn't there.

 

---JMB

 

So, while I am glad you enjoyed the event and from the looks of it it was probably a nice little get together, lets try to be a little critical shall we, instead of just expending the benefit of the doubt upon Jagex recklessly(though, on Tip.it that has been long established as the norm by this point.)

 

was to give out no information about the event or its whereabouts

 

And here we were all thinking they were gauging the interest in the event(which would be a sensible approach) before booking a venue but it appears they were a step ahead. :rolleyes: :^o

 

Here, by the way, is a P-Moderator who is typically quite on the 'Pro-Jagex side', his take on the matter, to give some perspective:

 

Ready for some seriously controversial stuff? Okay...

 

 

Search YouTube for MMG speech at Runefest. I can confirm from friends that attended that it's true. Basically, MMG said (paraphrased) "We wanted to weed out our loyal fans from the everyday player, so what we did was purposely jack up the price to insane levels and then see who was still coming to see the real fans. We really intended it to be free all along, so you guys (talking to the crowd) are the real loyal fans."

 

 

Gotta love that, don't you. Instead of paying bills, mortgages, college, etc., we should've payed thousands of dollars for plane ticket and traveling for a 1-day event for a game we play (not even considering the ticket price of the event, which in any case, was trivial in comparison). Gotta love MMG.... .... ... ... ...

---Psychoticyo

 

Both of these were extracted from the Runescoop thread on the matter. Anyways, if you bought into the event, great, but don't tell the rest of us to "shut the hell up" because we happen to opine differently or because we happen to think about it critically rather than drooling over the event like a preppy little school girl. Aside from that, not a bad article about the event by any stretch of the imagination, quite a good recap.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am inclined to agree with Das here but I will add somewhat of an addendum to that in response to one or two comments in particular:

 

It also gets tiresome to listen to people saying "I would've gone if I knew it was free". MMG said at the very start of Runefest that he wanted the most tenacious and most ardent fans to be there, and the only way to get that done, was to give out no information about the event or its whereabouts. He could have been a bit more sensitive by announcing the price change a week after the announcement that tickets were sold out, but he didn't, so be it.

 

Here is something someone else posted elsewhere that is a pretty astute commentary on this subject, in my opinion:

 

f you believe MMG you will believe anything. Runefest was supposed to be a lot bigger than it actually was, they scaled it down in a hurry and gave people their money back because there was a lack of interest and they couldn't justify laying on something worth 75GBP in the end. Thats why they didn't release details and there was a large gap with no information at all. Someone found a hidden page on the website showing they were supposed to be in holding it at Olympia not a smallish cellar...

 

So he comes out saying this as a ruse to cover up their ineptness, I'm sure it was only intended for the people who went to hear[referring to the whole opening speech abut weeding out certain people..], also to make them feel special, rather than to belittle anyone else who wasn't there.

 

---JMB

 

So, while I am glad you enjoyed the event and from the looks of it it was probably a nice little get together, lets try to be a little critical shall we, instead of just expending the benefit of the doubt upon Jagex recklessly(though, on Tip.it that has been long established as the norm by this point.)

 

was to give out no information about the event or its whereabouts

 

And here we were all thinking they were gauging the interest in the event(which would be a sensible approach) before booking a venue but it appears they were a step ahead. :rolleyes: :^o

 

Here, by the way, is a P-Moderator who is typically quite on the 'Pro-Jagex side', his take on the matter, to give some perspective:

 

Ready for some seriously controversial stuff? Okay...

 

 

Search YouTube for MMG speech at Runefest. I can confirm from friends that attended that it's true. Basically, MMG said (paraphrased) "We wanted to weed out our loyal fans from the everyday player, so what we did was purposely jack up the price to insane levels and then see who was still coming to see the real fans. We really intended it to be free all along, so you guys (talking to the crowd) are the real loyal fans."

 

 

Gotta love that, don't you. Instead of paying bills, mortgages, college, etc., we should've payed thousands of dollars for plane ticket and traveling for a 1-day event for a game we play (not even considering the ticket price of the event, which in any case, was trivial in comparison). Gotta love MMG.... .... ... ... ...

---Psychoticyo

 

Both of these were extracted from the Runescoop thread on the matter. Anyways, if you bought into the event, great, but don't tell the rest of us to "shut the hell up" because we happen to opine differently or because we happen to think about it critically rather than drooling over the event like a preppy little school girl. Aside from that, not a bad article about the event by any stretch of the imagination, quite a good recap.

 

 

First of all, of course MMG may have lied, but he may also have said the truth. Who knows? I wouldn't trust some "hidden page", why would they put the info there? A long time there was also an adress of some area in london(I don't exactly know how the english system works here) and it turned out to be a ticket selling station of ticketmaster.

 

Also, on the Pmods post, that guy is an idiot. MMG was talking about the ticket price and about that only. It's not their fault someone lives far away and they can't do anything bout it. Considering its their first event, they sure as hell won't scale some in different locations simultaneously.

MMG sure as hell didn't expect anyone to pay for the ticket instead of mortgages, college or bills. If you do that, you're an idiot. He means that you are willing to spend 75 pounds on this convention instead of buying two new computer games.

 

Of course the method is controversial, but, although "dividing wheat from chaff" sounds too elitist too me, its basically true. If the convention was free from start on, they would have loads of idiots who basically don't care about the game, but oh well, might as well go. If you ask for the money, you will get two groups of people:

 

1.those who moderately care about runescape and just have a lot of money(a rather small group)

2.and those with an average income, dedicated to this game(but not addicted...those will rather stay in their cellars and just continue to play runescape)

 

Of course its a bit unfair on those who have rather few money, but as said, you have to get immature idiots out of it somehow. I'm sure Jagex will love it if you come up with a better solution one that does not exclude anyone based on their richness.

 

 

 

also, on the rant bit...yes it was a bit over the top, but he doesn't direct "shut the hell up" to those who think differently, he directs it to:

1.those saying everyone going to runefest are nerds(in a negative way, meaning they have no social skills, live in their basement playing runescape 24/7 etc.) - which is not true

2.those complaining that they would've gone to runefest too if they knew that it was free - for not being really dedicated to the game, although once again this is a bit unfair to those with few money

3.those demanding for a flaggstaff

4.and the ridiculous complain about food and drinks costing.

 

I don't see him bashing those who have another opinion, but simply the idiots who have to feel important, want stuff they don't deserve and are so narrow-minded to believe everyone going there has no real life.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[hide]

I am inclined to agree with Das here but I will add somewhat of an addendum to that in response to one or two comments in particular:

 

It also gets tiresome to listen to people saying "I would've gone if I knew it was free". MMG said at the very start of Runefest that he wanted the most tenacious and most ardent fans to be there, and the only way to get that done, was to give out no information about the event or its whereabouts. He could have been a bit more sensitive by announcing the price change a week after the announcement that tickets were sold out, but he didn't, so be it.

 

Here is something someone else posted elsewhere that is a pretty astute commentary on this subject, in my opinion:

 

f you believe MMG you will believe anything. Runefest was supposed to be a lot bigger than it actually was, they scaled it down in a hurry and gave people their money back because there was a lack of interest and they couldn't justify laying on something worth 75GBP in the end. Thats why they didn't release details and there was a large gap with no information at all. Someone found a hidden page on the website showing they were supposed to be in holding it at Olympia not a smallish cellar...

 

So he comes out saying this as a ruse to cover up their ineptness, I'm sure it was only intended for the people who went to hear[referring to the whole opening speech abut weeding out certain people..], also to make them feel special, rather than to belittle anyone else who wasn't there.

 

---JMB

 

So, while I am glad you enjoyed the event and from the looks of it it was probably a nice little get together, lets try to be a little critical shall we, instead of just expending the benefit of the doubt upon Jagex recklessly(though, on Tip.it that has been long established as the norm by this point.)

 

was to give out no information about the event or its whereabouts

 

And here we were all thinking they were gauging the interest in the event(which would be a sensible approach) before booking a venue but it appears they were a step ahead. :rolleyes: :^o

 

Here, by the way, is a P-Moderator who is typically quite on the 'Pro-Jagex side', his take on the matter, to give some perspective:

 

Ready for some seriously controversial stuff? Okay...

 

 

Search YouTube for MMG speech at Runefest. I can confirm from friends that attended that it's true. Basically, MMG said (paraphrased) "We wanted to weed out our loyal fans from the everyday player, so what we did was purposely jack up the price to insane levels and then see who was still coming to see the real fans. We really intended it to be free all along, so you guys (talking to the crowd) are the real loyal fans."

 

 

Gotta love that, don't you. Instead of paying bills, mortgages, college, etc., we should've payed thousands of dollars for plane ticket and traveling for a 1-day event for a game we play (not even considering the ticket price of the event, which in any case, was trivial in comparison). Gotta love MMG.... .... ... ... ...

---Psychoticyo

 

Both of these were extracted from the Runescoop thread on the matter. Anyways, if you bought into the event, great, but don't tell the rest of us to "shut the hell up" because we happen to opine differently or because we happen to think about it critically rather than drooling over the event like a preppy little school girl. Aside from that, not a bad article about the event by any stretch of the imagination, quite a good recap.

 

 

First of all, of course MMG may have lied, but he may also have said the truth. Who knows? I wouldn't trust some "hidden page", why would they put the info there? A long time there was also an adress of some area in london(I don't exactly know how the english system works here) and it turned out to be a ticket selling station of ticketmaster.

 

Also, on the Pmods post, that guy is an idiot. MMG was talking about the ticket price and about that only. It's not their fault someone lives far away and they can't do anything bout it. Considering its their first event, they sure as hell won't scale some in different locations simultaneously.

MMG sure as hell didn't expect anyone to pay for the ticket instead of mortgages, college or bills. If you do that, you're an idiot. He means that you are willing to spend 75 pounds on this convention instead of buying two new computer games.

 

Of course the method is controversial, but, although "dividing wheat from chaff" sounds too elitist too me, its basically true. If the convention was free from start on, they would have loads of idiots who basically don't care about the game, but oh well, might as well go. If you ask for the money, you will get two groups of people:

 

1.those who moderately care about runescape and just have a lot of money(a rather small group)

2.and those with an average income, dedicated to this game(but not addicted...those will rather stay in their cellars and just continue to play runescape)

 

Of course its a bit unfair on those who have rather few money, but as said, you have to get immature idiots out of it somehow. I'm sure Jagex will love it if you come up with a better solution one that does not exclude anyone based on their richness.

 

 

 

also, on the rant bit...yes it was a bit over the top, but he doesn't direct "shut the hell up" to those who think differently, he directs it to:

1.those saying everyone going to runefest are nerds(in a negative way, meaning they have no social skills, live in their basement playing runescape 24/7 etc.) - which is not true

2.those complaining that they would've gone to runefest too if they knew that it was free - for not being really dedicated to the game, although once again this is a bit unfair to those with few money

3.those demanding for a flaggstaff

4.and the ridiculous complain about food and drinks costing.

 

I don't see him bashing those who have another opinion, but simply the idiots who have to feel important, want stuff they don't deserve and are so narrow-minded to believe everyone going there has no real life.

[/hide]

 

Thank you, you said it all...

 

I am uncertain if the Vinopolis was the 2ndairy location, I have not seen any confirmations or screenshots or anything about that, so, in this case I tend to believe MMG. Also, the place as packed to the brim...

Also Yomi, whatever you think about Tip.it being in Jagex's pocket; I just write stuff and Tip.it posts it on the front page once a month. Quite a few of my pieces have expressed criticism to Jagex as well...

 

Finally, another reason to make the tickets free AFTER announcing they have sold out is of course to prevent people re-selling their tickets for profit (some people actually did that with tickets that were not going to be used, the bastards)...


Former Leader of The Tal Shiar Alliance - An Original Tip.it Clan
Member of the Wilderness Guardians and Founder of the Silent Guardians
Founder of The Conclave - A Tip.it Clan institution
Tip.it Times author (click for all my articles) - When I use the wrong reasons to make the right statement, argue the reason, not the statement.
MSSW4 General - Did we kick your ass too?




Check us out!
wildsig3.gif
clanmotif.png
==> No seriously, if you like FREE GP, XP and Dung tokens, as well as Community, Opportunity and above all FUN... <==
CLICK IT!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And you've also barely read the article, this is actuallity I'm dealing with. Don't expect me to take into account random bashing for the lulz.

I'm sorry I offended you.

 

No, wait, I'm not. I'm sorry you can't seem to handle even the smallest bit of criticism or disagreement (it is not "random bashing for the lulz," thank you). Yes, I read your article. All of it. I've been keeping up the Times for a while and the trend I tend to notice the most lately is that a lot of people want to complain about something in the game. Maybe it's always been this way, though I don't remember it being so a year ago when I cared about it a lot more. That's what I'm saying; I disagree with your article, but that's not the sole reason I posted. I posted because I'm tired of seeing the same stuff every week on the Times, and this just happened to be a subject I was particularly interested in and have thought about a good deal myself. There's no reason for you to get so worked up over it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wonderful write up on the Runefest! Sounds like a blast. Maybe if it was near me and I was still such an avid player, I would have thought about it, but I never seriously considered it at all. Glad those that were able to go enjoyed it! :)


A reflection is just a distorted reality held by glass and your mind.

 

optimizedbrokenmirrorpn.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

First of all, of course MMG may have lied, but he may also have said the truth. Who knows? I wouldn't trust some "hidden page", why would they put the info there? A long time there was also an adress of some area in london(I don't exactly know how the english system works here) and it turned out to be a ticket selling station of ticketmaster.

 

Some of us aren't as naive as to take everything told to us at face value. Is it possible that the plan from the start was to do refund the money? Sure. Is it probable or likely? Doubtful. Instead, the scenario that was described in that post that I quoted of JMB's is more plausible.

 

Also, on the Pmods post, that guy is an idiot. MMG was talking about the ticket price and about that only. It's not their fault someone lives far away and they can't do anything bout it. Considering its their first event, they sure as hell won't scale some in different locations simultaneously.

MMG sure as hell didn't expect anyone to pay for the ticket instead of mortgages, college or bills. If you do that, you're an idiot. He means that you are willing to spend 75 pounds on this convention instead of buying two new computer games.

I

First of all, I would advise you NOT to avoid name calling, the only purpose that serves if any is to indite you as an idiot. Furthermore, think before you post. What he was saying is, that other people have other commitments, not everyone can afford the kind money of it takes for all the other aspects of this trip, including travel. For MMG to come out and say something like he did, can be considered, and was indeed considered offensive. To insinuate that because we can't make it to London and pay all the tickets and whatnot because some of us have bills and other expenditures, we aren't loyal CAN indeed be offensive and was taken as such by some players. Jagex by the looks of it, made a mistake in gauging and oraganizing this event and interest surrounding it and instead of owning up to that, they came up with a BS excuse.

 

Of course the method is controversial, but, although "dividing wheat from chaff" sounds too elitist too me, its basically true. If the convention was free from start on, they would have loads of idiots who basically don't care about the game, but oh well, might as well go. If you ask for the money, you will get two groups of people:

 

1.those who moderately care about runescape and just have a lot of money(a rather small group)

2.and those with an average income, dedicated to this game(but not addicted...those will rather stay in their cellars and just continue to play runescape)

 

Qeltar of Runescoop ALREADY proposed a solution to this(and to even Jagex directly, though not sure of that) back when Runefest was originally announced: a lottery, keep it nice and simple.

 

 

also, on the rant bit...yes it was a bit over the top, but he doesn't direct "shut the hell up" to those who think differently, he directs it to:

 

2.those complaining that they would've gone to runefest too if they knew that it was free - for not being really dedicated to the game, although once again this is a bit unfair to those with few money

3.those demanding for a flaggstaff

 

And I took issue to both of those because some people DO have legitimate counterpoints to those, to tell them to just 'shut the hell up', is childish and immature at best.

 

I don't see him bashing those who have another opinion, but simply the idiots who have to feel important, want stuff they don't deserve and are so narrow-minded to believe everyone going there has no real life.

 

He pretty much said that if you don't agree with any or all of those 4 points you paraphrased earlier, then one should 'shut the hell up' if they happen to opine differently on those 4 points. So that is precisely what he did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.