Tip.it Times Presents: What the heck was THAT?

[nitram99]

My only disappointed really is the extremely poor solution to the main rwt problem. The 3k limit to trades is just ridicoulusly bad and it's like Jagex have no clue how actual players play the game. I would assume that like at least 25 % of all ppl give gifts, loan, borrow or do services that will be totally affected by this 3k limit. The 3k limit is just a very poor solution out of many.

 

 

 

I can actually think of 1 that do the same effect but keep the gave copeable. If they instead of a firm 3k limit made it a 3k + 10% limit. This solution still make it able to give items worth 3k for free but also makes a window for profit-making merchanting. Say a Whip is set to 1.3M worth, with this update the pricerange you could sell it in 1.17M+3k to 1.43M+3k. And for a expensive set like Full Guthans, worth say 6.5M, the range will be 5.85M+3k to 7.15M+3k, that's more than a 1M in range. The problem with rwt is that they do totally unbalanced trades, give all to one player and not get anything at all back. They do not do trades anywhere near a +/- 10 % balanced trade. So this solution would still make rwt almost impossible as they would have to put in 90 % worth of item in the reciving end too in a trade which they can't do and the solution also keep a thriving living merchanting market.

 

 

 

And as a addition to this to solve the problem with loaning/borrowing, giving and such it is also very simple to solve without doing anything this drastic that Jagex now did.

 

 

 

Just make it so that you can only loand/borrow and such with players that have been on your friends list for say 30 days. How do this stop rwts from not abusing this you ask? Well, players that buy stuff from rwts do not want to wait 30 days to get there stuff, they want a quick trade as they most likely want the item/gold now as they want to use the item or spend the gold in the very near future after the trade. The seller do not either want to wait for 30 days before doing a trade complete. And the rwts has to add the players hand have them on their list for at least 30 days before they can do the whole trade. It's a fair chance that such a deal won't be completed as I assume they will be banned long before they can complete the trade. Is there any autoer/bot that last 30 days in the game?

 

 

 

So these 2 solutions do the same thing that the ones Jagex came up with, but they are way better and more game-playing implementable.

 

 

 

As for the PK:ing, just make the wilderness area smaller if the problem was for pk:ers to find targets. Bounty Hunter is way flawed as it now it's way to usual, there is no kinks to it, like hiding, planing your strike on your prey. Now, there are just clans roaming around in there killing anyone they see, bounty or not. And the area for it is also too big. Just make it a real mini-game with really, for a mini-game, different rules and goals, like all the other mini-games that are what their name states, mini-games. So put the old pk:ing back but in a smaller area so that rwts can harmlessly go out there and get killed by choise to transfer items. With my version of the unbalanced trade rule they all have to go into wildy and get killed if they want to do trades which makes the live of rwts much harder and the pk:ers got a real treat to kill. Everyone is happy! Not that hard at all!!!

[Ravenkana]

If even a third of the players who claim they are quitting go through with it, how will JaGex recover? After all, most of the new members of the game are gained through word of mouth. And JaGex doesn't advertise.

 

 

 

But what if JaGex, which takes its rules very seriously, decided to crack down on something else like, say, foul language? What if they severely limit the chat system so that all you can say are pre-arranged little quotes? You may say that won't happen but... would you have expected THIS two months ago? And what if they decide that players who have more time to play have an unfair advantage? They might then decide that every player can play for only three hours in a 24 hour period.

 

 

 

We must stand together on this issues, regardless of playstyle. If we don't, JaGex may change still more much loved aspects of the game.

 

 

 

P.S. What is up with JaGex's fixation on the number three???

[Polnar]

yeah I think they should make the bh craters smaller and make them single combat, I'm not sure the wildy is that necessary, pking was never that great, the sort of pking Elvemage did represented only a couple of percent of it.

[whackster]

well...

 

 

 

although i can understand the tough stand on pro-actively fighting RWT, i am saddened by the abolishing of free trade. Yeah, 3k limit.

 

That means...

 

1. i can't give out stuff to my friends anymore (3k limit).

 

2. i can't take an inventory full of lobbs and give it to my friend on the rare occasion when i go pk-ing. Oh, sorry... i can't pk like before anymore. Wildy is way different now. Oh, and i can't drop lobbs at my friend's feet when we pk now. I can, but it won't do him any good.

 

3. i can't go like... "hey, hold my 100k gp." for whatever reasons.

 

 

 

I'm no cheater or scammer... but now i can't sell any stuff for a little higher than the market price. Technically, i can actually... so long as the price difference is less than 3k. If a guy is desperate for, say, a rune scimmy and willing to pay 30k for it... well, no one can sell it to him. Gotta go to the GE.

 

 

 

And the GE... well, i do like it... but it's kind 'disturbing' that i'm buying things from faceless players. And selling things to faceless players too. I do like it a bit more personal... even if it takes me ages calling out at the banks. At least strangers still have a face (lol).

 

 

 

To sum it up... i'm gonna miss the freedom of trade... and the freedom to do what i want with my gp or stuff-in-my-bank (e.g. give it away).

 

 

 

Maybe RS is becoming more like what it is... just a game.

 

It was more real before. Darn those RWTs!! (insert a full string of curses!)

[Ravenkana]

Just tried bounty hunter on four separate worlds. Four separate world with the BOUNTY HUNTER THEME. I couldn't get in once. Reminds me of the duel tournaments: clunky, hard to use, and dominated by a specific group of players who use less then savory tactics.

[Kazel]

Wow. SO much to say on the subject...

 

 

 

To start, let me say I was never an avid PK'er. Yet, I really feel sorry for those who just lost what was once most dear to them. However, that's not what I'm most angry about. No, the trading update is that. I know ti's the best way to get rid of real-world item traders, but I love to let my friends borrow items. This gets rid of that ability completely.

[lordkrohn1626]

Best update ever, not a single friend on my thought otherwise...all adults...all 125+ combat, 12 of them mods...

 

 

 

the SMALL portion of the players who pk (say 1%) are unhappy, well adjust or quit...they made you a little sandbox to go play in and pk each other til you puke, use it....the other portion of unhappy campers are the scammers and rwters....nuff said there.

 

 

 

the 1 mil+ players who LOVE the update will adjust and move on quite happily. In the old wildy, if I saw a white dot, it was a rarity, compared to the nonstop masses of white dots outside of the wildy :-k do I need to paint a picture on where the majority of the players play?.....*pats pockets* nope, left my crayons at home.

 

 

 

Great job Jagex, you just made a great game that much better. :thumbsup:

[Bloodveld]

I can't believe it. Jagex has actually let their paranoia get this far. I quit runescape a while ago, but I still liked to check up on the updates and check up on friends too, but wow...

 

 

 

Here is a quote that I think is fitting.

 

Well done Jagex, you have just killed Runescape =D>

 

Here's another quote.

 

Won't be coming back to RS this time

 

And finally, here is the quote that speaks my mind.

 

I can see another one of Qeltar's expertly written journalist pieces about the recent updates *cant wait* =P~

 

 

 

Actually, all he had to say on TS was "I am speechless... They actually destroyed the game."

 

 

 

 

 

October 2002 - September 2007

RIP

[maisie54]

RS comes to an end for me =/

 

 

 

Maybe, just maybe jagex will see the error of their ways and change this back.

[lordkrohn1626]

I can't believe it. Jagex has actually let their paranoia get this far. I quit runescape a while ago, but I still liked to check up on the updates and check up on friends too, but wow...

 

 

 

Here is a quote that I think is fitting.

 

Well done Jagex, you have just killed Runescape =D>

 

Here's another quote.

 

Won't be coming back to RS this time

 

And finally, here is the quote that speaks my mind.

 

I can see another one of Qeltar's expertly written journalist pieces about the recent updates *cant wait* =P~

 

 

 

Actually, all he had to say on TS was "I am speechless... They actually destroyed the game."

 

 

 

 

 

October 2002 - September 2007

RIP

 

 

 

=D> wow, can we be just a bit more over dramatic? VAST majority love the update. For every whiner that quits, another player joins.....the game isn't going anywhere....but then again, you no longer play, so your opinion isn't relevent anyway.

[Chach09]

Does it seem like the beginners of runescape are being babied more and more with every update? I lost probably 1.5 mil on item scamming, and im ok with it, because the other people were smarter than me. Example- i saw a kid selling a ring of fury, i asked him how much, he said 2 mil, but i only had 1.7 mil, he said that 1.7 mil was fine, and i was thinking; "Yeah, thats less than half price!!! I'll buy it from him, then sell it for 4 mil, for a 2.3 mil profit! So i said "ok, i'll buy it." He said ok, but i need help on a quest. I asked what quest and he told me the Black Night Fortress quest. That is a very easy quest so i said ok. First, i showed him where the Fortress was. He then went to the back of the Fortress and saw the Wilderness ditch and started jumping over it, over and over again, all while typing "lag." Then he typed "item dropped!" and logged out. I thought he had dropped the ring so, i waited for it to show up. It did not show up but what did show up was a big pile of money so i went and got it. It was about 25k. i was about to go back but i saw a white dot on my map and i was not moving. from there, there was nothing i could do, cause i had forgot tele runes and i did not bring food. He just kept entangling me and attacking me with other spells, and i died, quickly. My friend was at my house, and was sitting next to me. As soon as it happened i said; "That was the most brillent thing i have ever seen." I was of course angry, but they got me fair and square. It was my stupidity for going there, and i have no problems with it.

 

If the Wilderness was gone then, it obvously would not have happened. Or the new trade updates, like the flashing red light, the value estimater at the bottom of the trade screen, and in the grand exchange, the maximum and minimum values. I was never babied like that when i was a beginner, and it seems very unfair that the beginners now dont even have to wory about it at all.

 

And also to me it seems that jaGex has taken away a lot of the things in runescape that make it a great game (everything that they have updated so far).

[AceScope]

"It's lost a lot of popular features today, but perhaps - for those who still wish to play - it'll end up as a better gaming experience when Jagex isn't waging a constant battle with RWT merchants and their bots?"

 

 

 

I agree with that statement 100%. We lost some great things, and will lose another soon enough. But for those who stay, runescape, while there will still be bots almost idefinatly, will be much better, as these bots will have, essentially, no use at all.

[Queenie]

 

I'm sure Jagex will do fine. Over time, they'll lose a lot of their old players, but they'll retain more new players. I would have preferred they make a RS3 so I could still enjoy my old game. Oh well. I'm done with RS. I'll stick around with the small hope that they'll fix things, but that is all but gone. :boohoo:

 

 

 

I agree with this, actually. Creating a RS3 so that we can keep our RS2 would be an idea. I'm not much of a PKer...I'm a total quest and skill noob...so the Bounty Hunter and Clan Wars update don't affect me as much. However, my husband was a HUGE PKer and always did so with many of his friends, who have all decided that they are no longer playing anymore because of this update.

 

 

 

I like the Grand Exchange idea (that's actually pretty useful, especially for someone like me who has no idea what the value of anything is)

 

 

 

The unbalanced trading...stupid! I've helped out a lot of people, not to mention that I've paid back in spade what my friends have given me to help start me out on RuneScape. My husband had almost 10M worth of stuff in his bank which he's been massively trying to sell because he has no use for it anymore. He has 5 accounts (3 of which HAD members) and he's given it up. He was so proud of the game that was RuneScape. Took him 2 years to convince me to play. I will continue playing because my account is just barely 1 year old but I kind of agree that...yeah...December 10, 2007...Death of RuneScape. It'll never be the same.

[Cloud9157]

I personally think gold farmers knew it might come to this... They knew in order to be stopped, Jagex would have to tare this game to pieces. Summoning appears to be their last line of defense, seeing as they put so much talk on it. They really have to pray that it impacts this game HUGELY. A few people I know are saying Summoning is all they're sticking around for, and if it's not good, they're going to quit.

 

 

 

I have to say that we can't give up JUST yet. Think of all the things we might miss. Sure, maybe you lived in the wilderness, but what if in January, something that you think sounds good and then go try it out, and actually enjoy it, is added to the game? Some people don't want to risk it anymore, and that's fine. But patience pays off remember. We have to roll with the punches, and take this thing head on.

[snpralpha]

Actually, this new update might get rid of all the RWT's. When most of the players go away the demand for rs gold will disapear, then all the bots will go away. But there wont be any players left to play anymore...

[reaper88888]

Great read, and right on the target. I'm seriously considering quitting for quite a few months, if not years, considering how much crap they've forced down our throats. The real issue is with the trading, it pretty much eliminates any form of help or skill-related trade. No more handing out piles of coins, cakes, and sets of full steel in Lumbridge. No more trading sets of materials for end products. No more loaning items to friends. No more giving gifts, unless they happen to be exchanged at the same time, and they are virtually the same 'value'. No more staking. No more all-or-nothing clan wars at the gdz, where the winners go home with glory and piles of loot. No more monster-hunting teams. No more player interaction...

 

 

 

It really is sad that the JaGEx staff are willing to drive off thousands of loyal players, and trash important, long-loved features of the game, just to keep a few spoiled kids from wasting their money on gold... If this really is what they want in their crusade, could they at least take a different route? :|

 

 

 

And seriously, 3k.. What. The. Hell. :?:

[Orion_Dezagrats]

 

EDIT2: Oh yea, I don't like how dying doesn't affect you anymore... Just go back there and get stuff... But on the other hand I DO die... but if you can go back and get stuff why not just make it so you keep items when you die? I know there ARE scenarios where you would lose items but...

 

 

 

 

Most people aren't going to trade up to the five minute grave. A lot of them will stick with the two minute ones, frees only having access to what, three max? And in all seriousness, it usually takes more than two minutes to get back to where you were (barrows, Kalphite Queen lair). And if you die again, pfft, all your items are fair game!

 

 

 

~~~~

 

 

 

On a side note, so what if some things are ruined? Some things are improved! In all truth, I find it much easier to stick around and see what happens than running away. RuneScape is a fun timewaster, and I'd hate myself to get rid of it. I'd have too much spare time! TOO MUCH, I TELL YOU! So I'll continue playing, despite the negatives.

[cnconrad]

Best update ever, not a single friend on my thought otherwise...all adults...all 125+ combat, 12 of them mods...

 

 

 

the SMALL portion of the players who pk (say 1%) are unhappy, well adjust or quit...they made you a little sandbox to go play in and pk each other til you puke, use it....the other portion of unhappy campers are the scammers and rwters....nuff said there.

 

 

 

the 1 mil+ players who LOVE the update will adjust and move on quite happily. In the old wildy, if I saw a white dot, it was a rarity, compared to the nonstop masses of white dots outside of the wildy :-k do I need to paint a picture on where the majority of the players play?.....*pats pockets* nope, left my crayons at home.

 

 

 

Great job Jagex, you just made a great game that much better. :thumbsup:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

WoW... you must not have many friends if none of your friends disliked the update...

 

 

 

Perhaps you are scared of other player... thats fine you were never forced into the wild...

 

 

 

But to say that 1% of the population didn't like the update is not only stupid its sad... Try looking at the poll on this site over 20% are quitting now and 33% are unsure if they should quit or not.

 

 

 

One final note, If by some chance some of your so called *Cough* Friends *Cough* want to ever kill a Boss monster with you I hope you will enjoy not splitting the drop...

[warshadow212]

Um, can we think about this rationally? You guys are over-hyping this situation out of proportion. Yes, 3k in 15 minutes cap is cr.ap.py, but don't you think JaGEx would have wanted someone to say,

 

 

 

"In time, this will weed out a lot of players out of the game." ?

 

 

 

They've already had many people say this statement. Guess what? Regular old players are not the only ones that will be leaving. JaGEx hopes that the people who use bots to farm gold will find it extremely slow and pointless to do this anymore. 3k in 15 mins = 12k in 1 hour = 288k in 1 day. That's not profit, if you're one of those websites that offer 10mil gp for $35USD. Not effective enough for them to stay in business.

 

 

 

That's why JaGEx implemented this in December. Why December? Obviously, anyone playing this game can tell you that December is the last month of a year. Very good! Well, typically, like the U.S. President gives a State of the Union address in January, stating changes they will (try to) implement to fix the nation.

 

 

 

Now, tell me, wouldn't it be effective to scare these botfarmers during the holiday season, when people will spend crazy? (Your answer should be YES, people will spend crazy on RS gold for RW money, especially in the holiday season; if you say NO, there better be a really, really humanistic reason to think like that, which I doubt.)

 

 

 

I predict JaGEx, prediciting themselves the outpouring of complaints over "No PKing!" "JaGEx, uh, we mean, the GE rules the market now!" and etc, will lift the caps to a more sane number.

 

 

 

Look for botfarmers to decrease. Not even the people who "operate" yew and ess autoers can resist the thought of losing MAJOR money and not leaving RS.

 

 

 

I agree with Qeltar 100% on his statements. I thank TIF staff for bringing his veteran economic experiences in front of us. Truthscape is awesome. However, I can't believe we've shortsighted ourselves into possibly thinking JaGEx has prepared for the complaints.

 

 

 

Or they can always save face, let alone their arses, from further humiliation come January. :D

 

 

 

~WSW~

[inferno_char]

They are intentionally dictating items values based on the GEs figures which is just plain wrong.

 

 

 

As a retired veteran player, it doesnt make me want to come back to the game.

[amitoz]

That was an awesome article, thanks so much for posting it. It was a truthful, cool-headed way of looking at the positives as well as the negatives about these updates. I think you did a great job at presenting both sides of the story with out being all doom and gloom or all happy happy joy joy. I appreciate that. It is what it is, what the rest of us need to decide now is if we want to carry on with the new Runescape or pack up our toys and leave.

 

 

 

Well said. =D>

[nitram99]

Best update ever, not a single friend on my thought otherwise...all adults...all 125+ combat, 12 of them mods...

 

 

 

the SMALL portion of the players who pk (say 1%) are unhappy, well adjust or quit...they made you a little sandbox to go play in and pk each other til you puke, use it....the other portion of unhappy campers are the scammers and rwters....nuff said there.

 

 

 

the 1 mil+ players who LOVE the update will adjust and move on quite happily. In the old wildy, if I saw a white dot, it was a rarity, compared to the nonstop masses of white dots outside of the wildy do I need to paint a picture on where the majority of the players play?.....*pats pockets* nope, left my crayons at home.

 

 

 

Great job Jagex, you just made a great game that much better.

 

 

 

 

Wow, Lordkrohn1626, I can just say wow. You must be one of the most ignorant and narrow-minded player I have ever seen here.

 

 

 

To say that yesterdays updates was the best updates ever is just so wrong that I can't even describe it. Your friends must be really lying to you or haven't red the whole thing or thought even one bit of how these latest updates could be made much better for all and do the same the same major thing, get rid of the rwts.

 

 

 

Just to state the errors in your post, I would not say that the players who pk are as small as 1 %, more like 10 % or more in my estimates.

 

 

 

The worst error is that you state that 1M+ players love this update. Just take a look at the rsof and you will see maybe 100+ positive ppl and like 100k+ negative ppl. That can't just be a coincidence! I would say that it is tops 10 % that love this update, more likely way less. The biggest part is really negative, the next biggest is just trying to deal with it and accept it even though the do not like it at all. Third biggest group are those whom see some good in them but have some major problem with some of the kinks. Then the fourth and way smallest group are ppl like you, the ones that love this update.

 

 

 

I can't see how you can even like it, even love it is way out of my insanity to understand.

 

 

 

1. They were way to many updates that restricts us at the same time!

 

 

 

2. Some of the are really poorly thoughtout but mostly the problem lies in how they are implemented and made in the game environment.

 

 

 

3. There are at least 1 much better way to combat the unbalanced trade and the thing about rwts using unblanced trades. The 3k limit is just horror and will makes this game less fun when it is finally fully integretaded into the game in Jan.

 

 

 

If you think only 1 % of ppl are unhappy with these updates, then add the thousands and more thousands in hordes that loan/borrow, give gifts, help friends, do services to ppl, clans that kill boss-monsters, are being friendly to other players and many more groups that really will hate the 3k limit. Those ppl are way more than a mere 1 %, try maybe 20 %, then add maybe 5 % extra of the pk:ers that don't fall into the just described group. 25 %, 1/4 of all players that do not like these updates at all. I would bet thare are several more % of ppl that haven't really understand the whole implication of these updates yet and how they will affect them negatively and some players that haven't red and seen the news yet.

 

 

 

I can not for my life understand why Jagex did so many updates to get rid of the rwts when there are way simpler methods that do the same thing but still make up a thriving and living merchanting market (the 3k limit will succesfully kill that), boss-monster drops-dividing (3k limit also effectifely kills that). And then add a simple little adjustment to make it possible for loaning7borrowing, gifting and such too.

 

 

 

There is no need for killing, pk:ing, merchanting, social interactions will doing buisness, boss-monster-hunting and some other aspects of the game. These updates are way to hastely done and implemented. If Jagex lived the live of an ordinary rs player for like a month they would see how flawed these updates would be and how much fun they kill. They do not have had to be made like they have been done now at all.

 

 

 

Just to state some things to clear some things up:

 

 

 

1. I really do think that the rwt problem should be delt with and harshely too. It just the method for doing it is way to flawed as it is now!

 

 

 

2. I have never done any pk:ing nor will I ever, I just don't like doing it personally

 

 

 

3. I do very seldomly merchant, I make my own money otherwise, mostly by getting and then making items to sell myself. My aim when I sell is not do merchanting and make a profit out of it. I just sell it to ge the money I can. I usally sell for less than the normal price so I'm not trying to make profit out of the shere merchanting part of it.

 

 

 

4. I extremely seldom loan out things to my friends due to the even remote possiblity that they can scam me and keep the item and never return it to me.

 

 

 

If you wonder what those "clever" alternative solutions are that I'm refering to, just take a look in the Bugs & Suggestion forum and look for a thread with me as the author.

 

 

 

Nitram out....

[SMR_]

Jagex was left with no choice but to completely stuff their own game and lose a lot of their revenue to stop GP transfer. Who really lost? People who made some cash via their game or the company who is now going to lose a large portion of their userbase?

[anish00b]

i believe the 3k limit is fair, although very harsh but FAIR... now think about it, your an autoer and your bots have done their work and you want to gather it all up to one account. Guess what? you cant! why? because jagex has prevented you from doing it. now i think i that is a fantastic idea. we all have noticed the past year there have been A LOT of BOTS!!!( check through the tip it forums poeple). They have tried to ban then ( 10,000 ban if some of you remember) but obviously that didnt work in a grand scale. so this is another solution.

 

 

 

perhaps 10% of the people DO pk, but remeber the fact that this game is supposed to be fun, and the company put their best effort into making it FUN for each and every player. BUT they do not like the bots, why, because( points at underlined part).

 

 

 

i dont completely disagree with the " i wont play runescape because i cannot give gifts to my mate/wife/husband/other ;-)", but there are always alternatives which they WILL introduce.

 

 

 

so next time people rant on the tip it forums saying " oh, the update is bad im going to quit, who's with me" just think for a second....they heard you, you dont need to go on and on and on about it. has anyone even noticed or talked about bounty hunter or perhaps the other updates that has occured? no, because they want to focus on one thing only, which is kind of thinking INSIDE the box. dont do that..please

 

 

 

anish00b

[Ravenkana]

I just cut my membership today.

 

 

 

Anyhoo. The price controls go WAY to far. I could make suggestions to change it, but this has already happened. What JaGex needs is a good beta test system to try out major updates before their release. And almost all of this months updates in one fell swoop? Thats just a WEE bit much to adjust to. I mean, they ARE being honest, but still...

 

 

 

And those of you who don't like PK'ers, think:

 

With them AND stakers gone, who's going to buy your sharks, lobsters, potions, combat runes, and ammunition?