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Holiday Musings and a permanent solution to rares


Jard_Y_Dooku

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nachalo

 

 

 

The items are meant for fun, yes, but they also show how long you've been playing in comparison to other players. Untradeable scythes and bunny ears are a good thing imo, if you happened to miss the event that is too bad. Party hats are status symbols, such a radical change would be silly.

 

Untrue. Party hats don't symbolize how long you've played - I could buy one right now for a few hundred mill, and I wasn't around when they were dropped. What they DO do is give whoever was around then a HUGE advantage over someone who just joined today - a newb could have picked a few off the ground (I've seen a screenshot of 51 blues when they were dropped) and be set for life because of it.

 

 

 

 

 

nachalo

 

you fail for not using the magic word

 

and you fail cos hartlar is never wrong :shame:

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nachalo.

 

 

 

Ok #1 money asside these items indicate how long you have been playing. I am sorry for that 13 year old who couldn't join a couple years ago to get a scyth, but the fact remains he wasn't playing, and that item shows that i was playing. I have been in this game since late febuary of 2001, and up untill the point that these items became untradable i had no way of prooving that i have played that long with out hunting down some one who i played with back then to back up my claim. The untradable holiday items are an achievment to show hey i was playing way back in october of XX year. Each year that becomes more of an achievment so the idea that if you play for 5 years you can get an item messes things up because in 5 years i will have been playing for 13 years, and suddenly every one is asking hey did you just get that scyth? or did you get it back in oct XX? Sudenly i am back to squar one trying to convince people that i come from a time period in this game where things like "members worlds" didnt exsist.

 

 

 

#2 These items help the economy of RS a great deal. There are simply not enough items that you have to spend money on over and over again to balance out the amount of money coming into the game. Flooding the market with billions of GP in exchange for these items would raise the price of other items in the game greatly causing people to whine even more about how they cant afford that super cool new bow/sword/plate/helm with the optional can opener utility because Joe blow who used to have a full set of all the party hats and other holdiay items now no longer has his money tied up in those items and can outbid every one. Later on after Joe blow has spent his money it will continue to move through the game exchanging hands over and over causing even every day items to increase in price.

 

 

 

Lastly why do these items need to be changed? The fact is the items you can buy are available to every one, and the items you can not buy are proof that you have played since a certain time. Asside from the rare person who invents time travel so they can go back to 200X to create their account at the proper time i see no reason to dimish the commitment that us long term players have shown to Jagex. Honestly in my opinion if Jagex were to take this suggestion they might as well stop doing holiday events all together because they will have 0 meaning.

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I agree with Troacc, many points are being brought up again that have died 10 pages ago.

 

 

 

In reading this thread, the one argument I liked the most was this one. It should certainly be copied to the first post.

 

 

The problem is, rare supplies are limited. If EVERYONE in RuneScape wants a party hat, not everyone can get it, no matter how hard they work (same for the untradeables). THAT... is the problem.

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Nachalo

 

I very strongly agree with this topic. I like party items but only als novelty items, they shouldn't have any financial value. Also I'd like to be able to get the holiday items that I don't have.

 

Maybe they should reintroduce the old holiday events as quests that you have to pay 1 million for and a have high level in a certain skill in order to do them. That way all the noobs won't be able to get the items.

 

Konets.

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I hope they never do this phats need to stay the way they are theyve probly been the only reason I play rs because items that cant be brought into the game anymore is such a cool idea especially because they on the rise and worth loads you gotta show you're good to wear one :ugeek:

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I hope they never do this phats need to stay the way they are theyve probly been the only reason I play rs because items that cant be brought into the game anymore is such a cool idea especially because they on the rise and worth loads you gotta show you're good to wear one :ugeek:

 

 

 

Partyhats have been falling, and you most certainly do NOT have to be good to wear one or own one.

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I hope they never do this phats need to stay the way they are theyve probly been the only reason I play rs because items that cant be brought into the game anymore is such a cool idea especially because they on the rise and worth loads you gotta show you're good to wear one :ugeek:

 

 

 

Partyhats have been falling, and you most certainly do NOT have to be good to wear one or own one.

 

 

 

It certainly doesn't hurt. :thumbsup:

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Nachalo

 

 

 

It's a good idea. It would solve the rare problem IMO but again with inflation, I don't know if jagex would make a risk with the economy and the shape its in as it is. I think if they thought about it and tweaked it a little it could turn into a good update.

 

 

 

 

 

Konets

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  • 2 weeks later...

 

I've already explained why it's a problem: it was never intended to be this way.

 

 

Most complex systems have emergent portions that end up quite different than planned. That it was never intended to be the way it is doesn't mean it's a problem.

 

 

 

Fail. Party hats were never complex to begin with.

 

 

Secondly I feel that discontinuing items but allowing some players to keep them - for any reason - shows a broken system. Either make the items constantly available, or delete them entirely.

 

 

That's pure circular reasoning: "rare discontinued items are a problem because it's a problem having rare discontinued items".

 

 

 

No, Fail.

 

 

 

Personally, I think rares are silly, and the people who waste months fawning over and grinding to get them are foolish. But it's certainly not hurting anyone if that's how they want to spend their time.

 

 

 

Fail.

 

 

 

Face it: you have NO valid justification for wanting to get rid of tradeable rare discontinued items other than that you don't like them by definition. I don't like them either, but any claim that they represent a significant problem in the game is completely without merit. And it's easily arguable that your "solutions" would be far worse than the status quo.

 

 

 

Also fail.

 

 

 

Take your failw it you somnewhere else.

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olahcan (it looks better backwards)

 

 

 

I guess all rares could be made untradable, although I don't see the problem with the way things are currently. Wild & free market were removed by Jagex over RWT, which was causing credit-card chargebacks & penalties to Jagex (from paid accounts made with fraudulant cards) that was threatening to ruin the entire business model for Jagex. So it was kill RWT at any cost or risk closing down Runescape entirely. You certainly cannot make the same argument for rares in this current GE controlled market.

 

 

 

As for deleting rares and replacing them with market value gold, that only benefits the merchants. Those players who bought or earned a rare to hold it for sentimental reasons as part of their collections will be hurt, and for little real gain by the community. A gold influx would affect prices of other items, too (as already mentioned). Also mentioned before (and I agree), not all players mind seeing rares on players other than their own. Some recognize that it is a method to acknowledge time spent in the game, actually being present for the past events (for the untradables, anyways).

 

 

 

I particularly disliked your pumpkin idea: that they would be deleted and could be repicked by players with a certain level in farming skill. I've been a f2p for life, even before the paid service was introduced. Why should players such as I lose our pumpkins with no way to regain them ourselves? Seems like replacing one form of scarcity with another. Me personally, I would rather things stay as they are now regarding rares. It's one of the only things left of real value in the game, that a free player can have, if he was there back far enough. Even the shiniest new member who wasn't there when bunny ears were given out, can't get one now. It's the very last aspect of the game where: TIME >> $$. Please don't suggest to take that away.

 

 

 

The only change I would support is a move to make the current tradables into untradables, with a proper warning period that would allow them to move out of the hands of merchants, and into the hands of true collectors and party-goers. At least no new gold would be created, and well, merchanting has its risks, right? That's my two cents.

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Deleting rares and replacing them with money? No.

 

 

 

I think partyhats are more of a status symbol than Godswords, because phats are just there for looks, whilst Godswords are there for looks and for purpose...

 

 

 

...I like rares :cry:

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  • 1 year later...

Nachalo

 

Exchanging them for money would obviously have detrimental effects on the economy, as other people have mentioned.

 

It wouldn't be fair to the people who paid hundreds of millions to get rares if now everybody could get them for free.

 

That said, if nothing is done about rares the problem will get greater and greater and their prices will go up and up (as we've seen over this past year). One specific problem is that, because rares are worth more than their market price on GE, RWT could occur (and I'm sure already is) - people who have rares could sell them to people through trade at market price and require real money as payment.

 

The only real solution I see (and I wouldn't be surprised if Jagex did it soon, seeing how out of hand rares are getting and the RWT problem) is to make all the rares untradeable and make it so no more can be obtaned. The people who bought them at high prices would be content because they would get what they paid for and their rares would still keep their sentimental value.

 

Konets

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Contrary to popular belief, people don't buy rares for their looks. They buy them because they have a continuous upward trend. They will only EVER go up long-term. How would removing billions of GP from the economy (which are currently wrapped up in rares) help? If they made rares untradeable, many people would lose the shirts off their backs and there would be mass rioting like nothing we've ever seen except the 12/10 updates.

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Mmmm, year old necromancy. Love it!

 

nachalo

 

Well, since the topic is up here, I'll throw my idea into the mix.

 

The point was brought up that much of the value in the current rare market is hoarding wealth. Since there is a GP limit, players often store further value in the form of items. So, why not turn all current tradeable rares into stackable "Trading Cards", which act just like any other item, with a fluctuating market value, only they have no aesthetic value. You can't show them off (beyond, of course, opening a trade window with people and throwing up hundreds of Blue P'hat Cards just to show off), but they retain their value as extra wealth. They could have very low shop values, so that you can't just take them and sell them for instant GP (to prevent flooding the market with currency).

 

With that said, it would be a great opportunity for Jagex to introduce additional currency in the form of stackable notes, each with a set value (say, 50k, 100k, 250k, 500k, 1m) which have a set market and shop value, and can be "sold" to/"bought" from a bank for the equivalent value in GP, so that you can take your wealth above the 1.2B limit that way as well.

 

I'd bet my bottom dollar that I've been playing RS for a lot longer than a lot of the TIF community. I was around for ALL the holiday drops (though I foolishly gave all but a single Santa away when I left the game), I was there when the Disc of Returning had a purpose, blahblahnostalgiablahblah. I took an extended break up until last year, and so missed out on most of the untradeable holiday items. And honestly? I don't care. Now that we have Diango, I don't think I have any of my untradeable holiday items physically on my account right now. I just don't wear them, nor have any desire to unless I have some explicit reason to. But I recognize that some people do want them to wear around, as they enjoy wearing them. I don't think they should exist as symbols of how long you've been playing (personally, this is another thing I could care less about. If Jagex added a feature to perhaps the adventurer's log that displayed when your account was created, I wouldn't object).

 

TL;DR version:

-Take all current tradeable rares and turn them into stackable "trading cards" with a dynamic market price, but very low shop value. Monetarily, they would serve the same purpose as rares do now, without causing an instant flooding of the market with GP. Essentially, what was once wearable, no longer is, but it retains all other value.

-Optionally, create a new series of stackable items that are tradeable, and have a static market and shop value, to act as a way to store excess wealth

-Create duplicates of all current tradeable rares, as untradeable items that can be retrieved from Diango or other methods as mentioned in the OP

 

konets

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nachalo

 

nah. I like it how there are rares like scythes, bunny ears and christmas crackers. If you have any of these items, it shows you've been playing for a while. A 'reward' if you like. People will get over it, but I know I would be very unhappy about it.

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nachalo

 

Jagex already has alternatives...

 

-Pumpkin/Egg: Any Piece of food

-Party Hat: Royal Crown

-Halloween Mask: Animal masks

-Santa Hat: Fez

-Bunny Ears: Squirrel Ears

-Scythe: Halberd/Spear/Hasta (close enough)

-Yo-Yo: Eek

 

I have the following rewards...

-Rubber Chicken: Easter Carrot

-Zombie Head: Eek again

-Bobble Hats: Any generic RS hat

-Marionettes: Toy Kite (close enough)

-Easter Ring: Ring of Stone

-Skeletal Clothing/Pumpkin/Reindeer hat: I don't remember the last time I saw anyone wear these anyway so don't ask for them

-Wintumber Tree: Other trees in your house

-Chicken Costume: Again, no one wears this anyway

-Grim Reaper's Hood: Arhim's Hood, Slayer Hood, Void Mage

-Snow Globe: Snowballs are available for every future Christmas event

-Any Reward from 2008: Garbage rewards. You can still obtain the useless Cornucopia btw.

-Easter Carrot: Your second shot at Rubber Chicken!

-Web Cloak: Your obsidian cape should suffice just fine...

-Eek: Your second chance at Yo-Yo AND Zombie Head!

-Christmas Robes: Desert robes + Quest Cape Hood

-Candy Cane: Black/Addy/Rune Cane

-Squirrel Ears: Your second shot at Bunny Ears

 

konets

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Type "nachalo" at the top of your post to assure me you've actually read it. And please don't reply unless you have a GOOD argument against my idea. Now, here it is.

 

 

 

 

If I had my way, players wouldn't even get ANYTHING for their rares. I'd delete them and not give them any coins, because they shouldn't have had that value in the first place. But it would probably cause a lot of economic damage due to their high value and demand, so giving players coins back is unfortunately looking like the best possible solution.

 

 

 

And again, if you actually read my post, add "konets" to the end of your reply. Thanks.

 

Why would that be a good idea? Wouldn't a player who had worked years to save up for a blue partyhat, and sold all of his items to be able to afford one, become enraged when his entire bank was wiped? That would be like wiping the bottom 50,000 people with 99 cooking's stats to make the cooking cape what it once used to be, a signal of 'skill.'

 

Perhaps to counter the inflation that would occur from the addition of billions of gp into the game, Jagex could also plop a few whips, coal, bandos, herbs, furies, or whatever people with rares would buy onto the g.e. (not a perfect idea, but it's better than wiping someone's bank)

 

Maybe it's a good thing you didn't get your way?

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TL;DR version:

-Take all current tradeable rares and turn them into stackable "trading cards" with a dynamic market price, but very low shop value. Monetarily, they would serve the same purpose as rares do now, without causing an instant flooding of the market with GP. Essentially, what was once wearable, no longer is, but it retains all other value.

-Optionally, create a new series of stackable items that are tradeable, and have a static market and shop value, to act as a way to store excess wealth

-Create duplicates of all current tradeable rares, as untradeable items that can be retrieved from Diango or other methods as mentioned in the OP

 

konets

 

1. You can't take items out of an economy and expect people to use your presented alternative. That approach never works.

2. That isn't a bad idea.

3. No.

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