The Evolution of Combat: BETA discussion

[NukeMarine]

Since they're saying that the update will allow combat to grow, there's nothing stopping them from later having skills unlock specific abilities. For example, fishing, firemaking, woodcutting and agility can unlock abilities useful against water, fire, earth and air based creatures. Smith and Crafting can grant abilities to exploit weaknesses in the various armors. Depending on balance, this can be limited to PvM. Even better, these abilities could be used while skilling which could add some more fun. After all, what is a mining rock (tree, fishing spot, etc) but an slayer like NPC that you can only attack with a specific weapon and usually with 1 hitpoint and a guarenteed drop.

 

From the sounds of it, you'll have limited amount of abilities active on the main screen so I doubt it'll be unbalanced. Plus, it'll be similar to letting high level quests unlock abilities.

I don't think there's any way that they're suddenly going to do what is the literal equivalent of turning non combat skills into combat skills.

Remember the uproar over herblore when extremes/overloads were released?

 

It wouldn't be as bad if it was limited to pvm, but I still think it would end up creating situations where you'd end up needing to train non combat skills to remain competitive at bosses, or get the best slayer exp rates or whatever.

First, I'm in the camp that says a fully developed character both in skills, equipment and quests should have a better advantage over those that just leveled combat skills. I loved when they first introduced extreme potions then got mad when they nerfed the use. I love that high level quests gets a person access to high level combat items and abilities.

 

Second, if they're reworking the combat level to be based upon what you're capable of at the moment (items in inventory, selected combat abilities, actual skill level) then there's no problem there either. If you select an ability unlocked from woodcutting, then your combat level will be higher anyway. Big assumption on my part, but time will tell.

 

Third, as I said, gathering skills were already combat in nature. It's just that the NPC didn't move, had 1 hitpoint, and one guaranteed drop. Thinking about it more, I'd like to see them rework the gathering skills like they're reworking combat. What's wrong with some varied gathering animation in addition to some gathering specific abilities you can activate just like combat. Going a little further and having some abilities unlocked with non-combat skills have a benefit in combat would be a natural progression.

 

My main point is that Jagex has a good window of opportunity here to make this expansive update to be more than just about combat. Incorporating abilities into all the other skills just makes more mundane aspects of the game more fun. It'd be kind of cool if an area of effect ability allowed you to gather logs from surrounding trees. Hell, it may even encourage Jagex to release skill based slayer monsters (golems, ents, sharks, tangleberries, etc) finally which would be like the monsters on Runespan but actually attack back.

[SwreeTak]

I signed up and since I have been a member since 2007, without breaks, I will be free to use the BETA as soon as it launches. I can't wait. It really seems like this will be an awesome update :). No more click and wait! At least for combat... :P

[@Dan3HitU]

Boom!

 

[Platinum_Myr]

Since they're saying that the update will allow combat to grow, there's nothing stopping them from later having skills unlock specific abilities. For example, fishing, firemaking, woodcutting and agility can unlock abilities useful against water, fire, earth and air based creatures. Smith and Crafting can grant abilities to exploit weaknesses in the various armors. Depending on balance, this can be limited to PvM. Even better, these abilities could be used while skilling which could add some more fun. After all, what is a mining rock (tree, fishing spot, etc) but an slayer like NPC that you can only attack with a specific weapon and usually with 1 hitpoint and a guarenteed drop.

 

From the sounds of it, you'll have limited amount of abilities active on the main screen so I doubt it'll be unbalanced. Plus, it'll be similar to letting high level quests unlock abilities.

I don't think there's any way that they're suddenly going to do what is the literal equivalent of turning non combat skills into combat skills.

Remember the uproar over herblore when extremes/overloads were released?

 

It wouldn't be as bad if it was limited to pvm, but I still think it would end up creating situations where you'd end up needing to train non combat skills to remain competitive at bosses, or get the best slayer exp rates or whatever.

First, I'm in the camp that says a fully developed character both in skills, equipment and quests should have a better advantage over those that just leveled combat skills. I loved when they first introduced extreme potions then got mad when they nerfed the use. I love that high level quests gets a person access to high level combat items and abilities.

 

Second, if they're reworking the combat level to be based upon what you're capable of at the moment (items in inventory, selected combat abilities, actual skill level) then there's no problem there either. If you select an ability unlocked from woodcutting, then your combat level will be higher anyway. Big assumption on my part, but time will tell.

 

Third, as I said, gathering skills were already combat in nature. It's just that the NPC didn't move, had 1 hitpoint, and one guaranteed drop. Thinking about it more, I'd like to see them rework the gathering skills like they're reworking combat. What's wrong with some varied gathering animation in addition to some gathering specific abilities you can activate just like combat. Going a little further and having some abilities unlocked with non-combat skills have a benefit in combat would be a natural progression.

 

My main point is that Jagex has a good window of opportunity here to make this expansive update to be more than just about combat. Incorporating abilities into all the other skills just makes more mundane aspects of the game more fun. It'd be kind of cool if an area of effect ability allowed you to gather logs from surrounding trees. Hell, it may even encourage Jagex to release skill based slayer monsters (golems, ents, sharks, tangleberries, etc) finally which would be like the monsters on Runespan but actually attack back.

 

I'm hoping that they do some combat abilities based on the various skills, but most of all I want them to fix various issues that can now be handled better by an action bar and abilities. Prayer should be more ability based, along with magic, but have magic's abilities require runes to use. Dungeoneering rings should be moved to abilities and unlocked the same way. (But remove the ridiculous item/stance reqiurements, OR let us have all rings unlocked at once)

 

There is so much room to make this affect the entire game but I feel like they won't quite have this much impact..

[Nash]

Make it easier to access - Several combat options (special attacks, combat styles, spellbooks) are tucked away, hard to access, or on various different interfaces, so were planning to bring all those options together.

 

Did somebody already point this out? Will we be able to combine ankient with regular and lunar spellbooks?

[Saradomin_Mage]

Make it easier to access - Several combat options (special attacks, combat styles, spellbooks) are tucked away, hard to access, or on various different interfaces, so were planning to bring all those options together.

 

Did somebody already point this out? Will we be able to combine ankient with regular and lunar spellbooks?

I think they just mean that they want to streamline combat so players don't have to keep flipping through interfaces.

[Nash]

yeah your right i reread it. I wish though XD

[Jonanananas]

I'm disappointed that they specifically mentioned not having the healer role, yet there's no word about upping the effects of lunar spells...I like lunar :(

[Sy_Accursed]

Make it easier to access - Several combat options (special attacks, combat styles, spellbooks) are tucked away, hard to access, or on various different interfaces, so were planning to bring all those options together.

 

Did somebody already point this out? Will we be able to combine ankient with regular and lunar spellbooks?

I think they just mean that they want to streamline combat so players don't have to keep flipping through interfaces.

 

Yeah just because they want us to have spells on an action bar to get at the ones we want quick does not mean they are gonna suddenly drop the division of mage book activations. Something they have previously mentioned not doing as the 3 combined would be overpowered.

 

It'll be kind like the Runic Staffs, you could have left a lunar spell (for example) on there when you swapped to ancients, but it won't let you cast it.

[SKKOL]

Since they're saying that the update will allow combat to grow, there's nothing stopping them from later having skills unlock specific abilities. For example, fishing, firemaking, woodcutting and agility can unlock abilities useful against water, fire, earth and air based creatures. Smith and Crafting can grant abilities to exploit weaknesses in the various armors. Depending on balance, this can be limited to PvM. Even better, these abilities could be used while skilling which could add some more fun. After all, what is a mining rock (tree, fishing spot, etc) but an slayer like NPC that you can only attack with a specific weapon and usually with 1 hitpoint and a guarenteed drop.

 

From the sounds of it, you'll have limited amount of abilities active on the main screen so I doubt it'll be unbalanced. Plus, it'll be similar to letting high level quests unlock abilities.

I don't think there's any way that they're suddenly going to do what is the literal equivalent of turning non combat skills into combat skills.

Remember the uproar over herblore when extremes/overloads were released?

 

It wouldn't be as bad if it was limited to pvm, but I still think it would end up creating situations where you'd end up needing to train non combat skills to remain competitive at bosses, or get the best slayer exp rates or whatever.

First, I'm in the camp that says a fully developed character both in skills, equipment and quests should have a better advantage over those that just leveled combat skills. I loved when they first introduced extreme potions then got mad when they nerfed the use. I love that high level quests gets a person access to high level combat items and abilities.

 

Second, if they're reworking the combat level to be based upon what you're capable of at the moment (items in inventory, selected combat abilities, actual skill level) then there's no problem there either. If you select an ability unlocked from woodcutting, then your combat level will be higher anyway. Big assumption on my part, but time will tell.

 

Third, as I said, gathering skills were already combat in nature. It's just that the NPC didn't move, had 1 hitpoint, and one guaranteed drop. Thinking about it more, I'd like to see them rework the gathering skills like they're reworking combat. What's wrong with some varied gathering animation in addition to some gathering specific abilities you can activate just like combat. Going a little further and having some abilities unlocked with non-combat skills have a benefit in combat would be a natural progression.

 

My main point is that Jagex has a good window of opportunity here to make this expansive update to be more than just about combat. Incorporating abilities into all the other skills just makes more mundane aspects of the game more fun. It'd be kind of cool if an area of effect ability allowed you to gather logs from surrounding trees. Hell, it may even encourage Jagex to release skill based slayer monsters (golems, ents, sharks, tangleberries, etc) finally which would be like the monsters on Runespan but actually attack back.

 

 

 

 

That actually makes a lot of sense, I would love to see it affecting skilling, realistically speaking, WCing (for example) in real life would make you stronger and more accurate if you think about it, as long as the kept it so you could choose to use the special combat related stuff or not,

'cause I'm sure a lot of people would hate it, I think it sounds awesome though.

 

Even if it was totally separate from combat skill levels, it'd still be cool to be using the action bar to do special cuts, (WCing again) Like at 76 WC you'd get a skill called "Triple Chop" or something, that would give you 3 swings instead of one and has like a 2 minute cooldown, or AoE chops at various levels, they could even implement buffs at certain levels, just to make it more interactive.

It would affect prices but most people don't make there money from WC, or any skill anymore for that matter.

[Platinum_Myr]

That would be fun :) I like the idea of more special effects for skilling.

[Saradomin_Mage]

 

Oh gawd.

So happy.

So frickin' happy.

[Thus]

The combat team is the last hope for jagex

[HunterDexter]

Hmm, the not mentioned mod, wouldn't that be Mod Mark?

[Piu]

Oh, it's just like Activision and Infinity Ward to me.

 

Good to know that people at Jagex are actually against decisions made by their investors. :)

 

Hmm, the not mentioned mod, wouldn't that be Mod Mark?

 

Just because he's head content developer doesn't necessarily mean he's in the combat team. :)

[Jonanananas]

I wonder if they're even supposed/allowed to post stuff like that considering it suggests a rift within Jagex...it wouldn't be too farfetched to assume Mod rathe has stepped the boundaries here, given that he's not CM and might not just be as aware of the guidelines as CM mods....

[Locke_Superbus]

I hope its true, but being the eternal cynic I'll wait to be shown rather than be told. or it could just be bluster to try and get cred. /cynicism......for now.

[muggiwhplar]

 

Oh gawd.

So happy.

So frickin' happy.

 

In other words, they're going to get fired soon or get fed up and quit lol

[HunterDexter]

Oh, it's just like Activision and Infinity Ward to me.

 

Good to know that people at Jagex are actually against decisions made by their investors. :)

 

Hmm, the not mentioned mod, wouldn't that be Mod Mark?

 

Just because he's head content developer doesn't necessarily mean he's in the combat team. :)

 

We know he's in the combat team, several videos from MCM and his blog indicate he has a large role in the combat rework.

[Blutters]

Make it easier to access - Several combat options (special attacks, combat styles, spellbooks) are tucked away, hard to access, or on various different interfaces, so were planning to bring all those options together.

 

Did somebody already point this out? Will we be able to combine ankient with regular and lunar spellbooks?

I think they just mean that they want to streamline combat so players don't have to keep flipping through interfaces.

 

Yeah just because they want us to have spells on an action bar to get at the ones we want quick does not mean they are gonna suddenly drop the division of mage book activations. Something they have previously mentioned not doing as the 3 combined would be overpowered.

 

It'll be kind like the Runic Staffs, you could have left a lunar spell (for example) on there when you swapped to ancients, but it won't let you cast it.

And exactly WHY would that be overpowered? Allowing a mage to use lunar combat spells with actual attack spells (besides polypore :rolleyes: ) would only be fair. I've always found it one of the biggest ironies ever that a ranger and warrior can venge (or shield, or what have you) themselves but a mage who actually wants to be effective in combat can't.

It's time to stop dicking around with crap like Spellbook Swap and Borrowed Power (worst farce of a use for a max level skill EVER) and make things right, and I hope they do with the combat upgrade.

[Coconut Bodywash]

As long as Rathe\Pi\Chris L are around, I have some hope for this game.

[Crossed_Body]

And exactly WHY would that be overpowered? Allowing a mage to use lunar combat spells with actual attack spells (besides polypore :rolleyes: ) would only be fair. I've always found it one of the biggest ironies ever that a ranger and warrior can venge (or shield, or what have you) themselves but a mage who actually wants to be effective in combat can't.

It's time to stop dicking around with crap like Spellbook Swap and Borrowed Power (worst farce of a use for a max level skill EVER) and make things right, and I hope they do with the combat upgrade.

 

It wouldn't be overpowered, but it would strip parts of the lore from their individuality.

[Den]

 

Oh gawd.

So happy.

So frickin' happy.

 

So happy to see that. Those people are my hope for the future of this game.

[Aiel]

 

Oh gawd.

So happy.

So frickin' happy.

 

So happy to see that. Those people are my hope for the future of this game.

This x1000

[Platinum_Myr]

The sad part is that he has to shoot down the proposals :( They shouldn't even be happening in the first place!