25-Mar-2013 - Wilderness Warbands

[V O R K]

What we really need are instanced warbands. /inside joke.

 

Seriously though, isn't all this backstabbing and pking kind of the point?

 

High risk, high reward gameplay. Although you don't lose anything you currently have if you die with resources, you are losing out on potential xp. More stuff like this in the wilderness please.

 

Welcome to the wilderness.

 

Whiners get punished \:D/

[Platinum_Myr]

Those type of players exist, and it is better to give them real content instead of having them lure people etc.

[Fallstar]

What we really need are instanced warbands. /inside joke.

 

Seriously though, isn't all this backstabbing and pking kind of the point?

 

High risk, high reward gameplay. Although you don't lose anything you currently have if you die with resources, you are losing out on potential xp. More stuff like this in the wilderness please.

 

Welcome to the wilderness.

 

Whiners get punished \:D/

 

I wasn't whining at the time of that post, I was saying I like the idea.

 

Although it's now pissing me off.

[xpx]

''It's great xp'' ''It's annoying''

 

Sounds like balanced content, for once.

[Alg]

I don't think balance works that way.

[aspeeder]

I don't think balance works that way.

As Juna says, it lies in the juxtaposition of opposites. Sounds like its annoying in a similar way to tears so tht seems right.

[xpx]

I don't think balance works that way.

So what you'd like it to be instanced and be 1/6th of the xp? Right now it's a very nice high-risk-high-reward daily xp for skillers. Just stop it with all this newschool nannyscape.

[Hedgehog]

You're only risking opportunity cost, though. That's like calling Millionaire a risky game. If you want a high-risk/high-reward game, players should have to actually risk something in order to play.

[Alg]

You're only risking opportunity cost, though. That's like calling Millionaire a risky game. If you want a high-risk/high-reward game, players should have to actually risk something in order to play.

And to further this point, it's very easy to play the system to minimize whatever risk there may be, as we've seen with 76k and with the fact that Warband clans exist for that purpose.

 

I'd go as far as to say that, in practice, very little of the content they've stuck in the wilderness actually balances risk and reward; you didn't need more than a pickaxe to get rune ore, and you never needed to risk much to kill a skiller with an inventory full of it.

[Platinum_Myr]

Players always play to game the risks, and when that isn't possible they stop going to wildy content.

[Hedgehog]

MHing when it was dangerous was a good example of risk vs reward. If a truly risky and rewarding activity is desired, players will have to risk good armor and weapons to get good rewards. Skilling in the wilderness isn't the answer.

[Urza285]

MHing when it was dangerous was a good example of risk vs reward. If a truly risky and rewarding activity is desired, players will have to risk good armor and weapons to get good rewards. Skilling in the wilderness isn't the answer.

I disagree with you. I feel the large majority of the players are skillers. A lot of them might enjoy the benefit of rushing out there to get xp. But the issue is there aren't clear factions. So if you get piled the person next to you only feels thankful it wasn't him and proceeds to run away with his own loot. One thing I felt about factions was clearly highlighted in the wildernesses history whe clans were prevalent and now with these two FC's. Visitation and productivity in the wilderness is something that comes from the brave and clans as long as its productive and interesting. People get strongly tied to factions and that is something jagex needs to embrace to keep the wilderness alive.

 

 

[Hedgehog]

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that people won't risk anything other than the potential to gain xp unless it's in a MHing-like environment, where they have to bring good gear in order to receive rewards.

[Urza285]

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that people won't risk anything other than the potential to gain xp unless it's in a MHing-like environment, where they have to bring good gear in order to receive rewards.

Yeah I think they need to make all gear suffer degrade costs everywhere. Alongside that no gear loss too. That would keep the wilderness on par with the more civilized areas.

[Bxpprod]

Apprently King Warband has shut down recently, meaning less pointless clashing though word is 'Warband Pk' is gaining some popularity (though not often to ruin too many camps)

 

Annnnnd it's back

[xpx]

I really don't understand how this is not balanced:

 

If you use better gear and risk more gp, you will more likely not die and get more xp.

If you don't risk anything you will more likely die and risk more xp.

 

=balance

[Urza285]

Because a player who has those better items I the wilderness might as well be glowing just as bright as the person with the wand.

[Sy_Accursed]

That isn't balance.

Mostly because it is just false.

The odds of dying are not that greatly affected by your armor, it's random chance of if a pker attacks you and quite frankly the pkers are more likely to go for people with gear they might drop - it causes more grief and earns them more.

The xp is also not greatly affected by your armor, it's again random chance of if you get away or not.

 

The part people are referring to is as high risk vs high reward content it is meant to appeal to pkers and non-pkers.

In this setup it should therefore have a balance between rewards for pking and for non-pking.

As it stands pking doesn't really get a reward at all - you might down a few people people before they die and grab a couple hundred k gp but you do so at the expense of ignoring gathering the 25 loot that nets like 2m gp worth of xp.

Therefore there isn't a balance between the 2 factions and the only reason to pk is to purposefully grief others.

[Hedgehog]

The chaos elemental is a good concept for risk vs reward. You have to risk death from a boss and pkers and you have to use good gear to get a good kph. Of course, it's not relevant these days because of shitty drops and how easy it is to kill.

[Yoko Kurama]

The chaos elemental is a good concept for risk vs reward. You have to risk death from a boss and pkers and you have to use good gear to get a good kph. Of course, it's not relevant these days because of shitty drops and how easy it is to kill.

 

Even if they were to fix it and give it nice rewards, all that'd do is entice a bunch of PK'ers to camp there forever and monopolize said rare drops. Hardly a fun thing.

 

That, or because of the sheer number of worlds, people would just sneak in at low population worlds at non-peak hours, thus defeating the element of PK'er risk. So then the way to rectify that would be to restrict it to a few worlds, but then you'd end back up at square one.

[Thus]

I really don't understand how this is not balanced:

 

If you use better gear and risk more gp, you will more likely not die and get more xp.

If you don't risk anything you will more likely die and risk more xp.

 

=balance

That would be correct if the xp earned as equal to or greater than the cost of the armor being risked, which it isn't.

[aerendil]

Atm it HAS amazing xp rewards, but they can be taken away so easily, because there is little or no way to prevent death via pkers unless you get to the warcamp while the beam is still up.

 

AS most of the people in the fc don't bring t60+ weapons, there is no anti in the fc, meaning pkers can waltz in, and kill whoever they want; and as looting the warcamp toggles multi mode wildy on, there is no way to be safe if you are geared or ungeared; if geared, you get jumped as soon as you are seen, because very few others are, if you are ungeared, you can't stop pkers...

 

TLDR:WHy introduce an aspect of the game which actually encourages greifing... That isn't something we need to encourage, it really should be stopped, and the old old old old old old ancient non-existent ideas of Honour and Respect in wilderness should be encouraged.. (but who am I kidding, forward the yoloswagitards)

[Ts_Stormrage]

Ok, time for a proper reply...

You all know me, this is going to be a long one, so I hope it's of my usual quality and worth your time to read it...

 

 

So... The Wilderness...

 

I think it's safe to say that this is the first PROPER update to it since ... well... ever, really...

The removal of it cannot hardly be called an update, and the odd Bloodwood tree isn't exactly a great lure to get people in the Wilderness either... This however, can be the one thing that revives the entire area...

 

Why? Well, let's find out

 

Is it in The Wilderness? check!

Does it attract people to it? check!

Do they have to go in with more than the bare minimum? check!

Will people get something out of it by participating? check!

 

So it has all the elements of reviving what is known in the clanworld as the "Food chain of The Wilderness"...

A concept that explains why Clans were in The Wilderness in the first place. The lonely skiller is attacked for his loot by a lonely PK-er. The lonely PK-er might get jumped by a small team for his equipment. The small team will be chased by a large team, who then gets eaten by a clan, who in turn get cleared by a large clan. The small clan calls in its allies who soon face the allies of the other clan, and before you know it, a giant cluster-fight is underway, trying to break one anothers bank...

 

Prices go up, supplies are needed, the economy thrives, and skillers might actually make some money once again...

 

Unfortunately, Jagex released 07-servers, and almost any clan that was still left alive moved over to those servers because of their general disgust for the complexities of EoC combat... But the crowds at the Warbands suggest that not everyone has moved backwards in time...

 

 

The crowd these Camps attract makes them dangerous to be at, especially on your own with noone to cover your back, and with very little training and experience in dealing with PvP situations, you're quickly left clueless and, due to the new realities of EoC, itemless... Even the Clanwars portals cannot prepare you for this... The instant teleblock and switch to Multiway combat compounds this (and might be why Jagex tossed in that Toggle in the first place)...

 

 

So what do you do? Join one of these FC's filled with opportunists who do nothing but look out for their own interest, and people that hope that they can hide in the crowd of large numbers? This isn't a Penguin Hunting FC, where reporting where you last saw a pengy is all the effort required, if that... These people will kill you and take that Wand of Treachery off of you given the slightest opportunity (the name is a dead give-away)...

 

So this IS the real deal... If you get killed, you lose what you got save one item, if you're lucky...

 

 

What you need is a community of capable friends and allies. People that know how to work in an organised fashion, and are willing to stop with their own looting and Barrage whoever is trying to kill you when you're escaping with that Wand or some of those XP-heavy Supplies... And who can depend on you to do the same for them...

 

 

As said, there is very little Honor left in the Wilderness...

But unless you find yourself a group that is willing to fight along side of you for JUST THAT, all you are going to be is a single person complaining, which can easily be ignored...

[V O R K]

All I hear is butthurt...

 

Great post Stormrage.

[Urza285]

I hate the phrase "butthurt"...

 

On the replace my topic it seems nothing is wrong with the wilderness other than gear loss. The concept of losing everything on death is an old remnant of the old wilderness and needs to go. PVP has evolved to such an extend that there is too much diversity in gear, and specifically tactics, to risk what you have. Runescape needs to put durability on all its gear. The difference could be we a player takes a durability hit from dying to a pker the pker gets a cut. That cut could be based on the worth of the armour.