Dev Blog - Prestige

[Jeffery]

Kinda glad for the poll coming to be honest. Having looking at what people answered to my question, lifetime xp should be default (especially for those who have worked so hard for 200m) Prestige seems to promote nolifing skills to be ranked now (which jagex also stated they don't encourage people to get 200m in any way) but this update very much does do this, this seems to be their lazy way of getting out of making skills past the 13m cap without having to add content.

[helring]

Kinda glad for the poll coming to be honest. Having looking at what people answered to my question, lifetime xp should be default (especially for those who have worked so hard for 200m) Prestige seems to promote nolifing skills to be ranked now (which jagex also stated they don't encourage people to get 200m in any way) but this update very much does do this, this seems to be their lazy way of getting out of making skills past the 13m cap without having to add content.

 

I don't agree with that summation. I think it had a different goal than making skills go past the 13m cap. The only advantage of going past the 13m cap is to give upper level players more goals to do. Which theoretically they already have in the form of going for 200m. 

 

This system seemed to have the goals of an eternal high scores board where no one is ever guaranteed locked in at first place. More content past 13m exp wouldn't solve the 200m limit issue. It also seems to be trying to stimulate the lower levels of the game. At the moment any new player that does join sees mostly empty training areas and a pretty stagnant lower economy. I think the prestige system is trying to fix that some by giving higher level players a reason to go back there. With the current system once you finish an area there's no reason to return. 

 

Whether these goals are warranted or not is ultimately a matter of opinion but I think revitalizing the lower level areas and giving a better high scores table instead of just a table of what order people reached 200m are some worthy goals. How they went about it however may not have been the best way. Personally, I don't think Jagex should decide on either the prestige or lifetime high scores being the main one. When you click high scores it should bring to a page and ask which one you want to view.

[NukeMarine]

About spins: Treat mediums lamps as if they're two lamps and large lamps like they're four. Likewise for cashbags mediums are like 10 small cashbags and large are like 100 small cash bags. With that, for every 100 spins you can expect the equivalent of 66 small cash bags, 18.6 prismatic lamps and 25.5 skill specific lamps. On top of that will be the prismatic and skill pendants which I don't have enough data to determine chances. You're definitely not buying your way to success easily with that method.

 

About prestige: I don't know why Jagex is putting this to a vote. Like everything else, they should just do it and get it over with. I'm in the positive column as I never liked total XP being used to ranked maxed out players. This idea is even better because people that want to be in the top 1,000 will need to start leveling all their skills after each prestige block. People will love the race like they did with Divination's impact on player ranking which was part of the fun in seeing that new skill (and seeing Zezima in the top 3 spots).

 

As helring mentions, this will keep a steady flow of skillers in all the areas even though the top areas will still be concentrated as that's where most of the XP is located. If nothing else, this can force Jagex's hand to make skills have a smoother leveling curve throughout the path to 99. After dungeoneering, divination is the best example of this smooth progress. If players make it a habit of prestiging, they'll make a fit if the path to 99 is not smooth. 

[Yoko Kurama]

 

 

It's much more expensive to buy XP with SoF then people seem to think. According to the RS Wikia, the chances of getting a lamp in a spin are about 17%. 200 spins is $50, and even if all of the lamps were mediums, non skill specific, and used on level 98+ skills, that would only get you about 580k XP. So at 1 prestige, getting from 98-99 alone would cost $250. And how many people do you think will spend a week's salary on a days worth of XP?

 

The same sort of people who can afford to play Runescape all day without having to go to school or have a job, or doing anything else in life. It seems some of the top players are financially secure enough that they can just afford to do that all day. In the 200M thread, I did the math for the first 39 days of Divination, and using extremely conservative estimates, it turned out that Drumgum was able to get 60M Divination experience by playing something like 16-17 hours a day. Allegedly, Suomi, similarly, didn't need a job, and nor did Jake, to support himself.

 

So there's quite a few people that can afford it.

 

Woah now, not having to work to support yourself and having cash to spend on spins are two completely different things.

 

Being financially or otherwise secure to be able to play 16+ hours a day is reasonable for some people (basically all of the 200m all thread mancrushes).

 

Having the financial resources to do that AND generate $200/day to spend on spins is another matter entirely.

 

 

I never suggested that they would be able to buy all the experience in the world with spins. They could however spend a decent amount of money on it. And that's all that's needed for generating profits for Jagex; it's about squeezing every aspect they can. Which makes a great deal of sense; this is how all companies try to generate profit and grow, they squeeze every avenue they possibly can.

 

So no, I don't expect anyone to shell out thousands and thousands of dollars for getting 200M, but they might have drop 20,30,40,50 dollars at a time here and there.

[NukeMarine]

I just thought about something: going from 92-99 will account for 50% of all xp gained and that normally is what you have for high level content. Why doesn't Jagex just compromise with those that want a roll-over and for the first three months let excess xp count for only 50% each prestige reset.

 

Example (I rounded up, so the numbers will be slightly off):

 

Player's Agility is Prestige 0, Level 99 (required 13M xp) with 200M XP. Player prestiges it so his excess 187M xp becomes 94M xp for Prestige 1.

 

Player now has Agility of Prestige 1, Level 99 (required 26M xp) with 94M xp. Player prestiges again so the excess 68M becomes 34M xp.  

 

Player now has Agility of Prestige 2, Level 98 (required 33M xp) and just 5M xp shy of 99 for his next Prestige.

 

It gives an easy grace period of gaming the system (still leveling at high levels). Rewards those that leveled a skill prior to a change. The high score boards aren't shifted as drastically at first. Yet, due to the stricter xp penalties (128 million xp), nobody has an enormous lead.

[Maximusa]

Got goosebumps just over the fact that they seemed to apologize for something, asin that they acknowledged the fact that they sometimes may get things wrong from time to time. Its refreshing to hear that they arnt perfect for once, kudos for that.
 

Poll needs to be reasonable though.

 

As it stands we honestly do kinda need something to help with the hs. Its going to be very overloaded at the top end with ever increasing staleness over the next few years. Its just their current idea that fails atm.

 

If its a split down the line option of their current solution or no update then obviously I vote for the only fair option, no update. Im not going to be a taffer to all those people who have already put their time into the game after 13m xp. Its upside down backwards to suggest that anyone with 13m xp in a skill is higher than someone with 13m+

 

If they have some option that allows some fairness for those who have already played for their xp, asin not completely ignoring it.. Then I would possibly vote yes to that. Just depends if its a good option or not.

 

However I think I will have to personally vote no unless its a /very/ good idea, not just because its unfair, but I also dont particularly like the idea of resetting 99. (Probably vote no - But not necessarily - A solution IS needed and I see that its necessary. I rather vote yes on a semi-good idea than ignore it and later end up with a bad idea.) If I were going to reset anything it would be 200m for me. However there are many other solutions I could think of that would be preferable than those. I enjoy training skills but training skills between 1-80 is mostly just fluff until it gets more interesting 'for me' personally. Resetting would just be a huge fluff ball of tedious stuff until I got to the good bit that I enjoy more. I dont want to keep resetting and doing that lvl 1 to lvl 80 bit repeatedly if I had the choice - That being a very personal preference.

[NukeMarine]

 

If its a split down the line option of their current solution or no update then obviously I vote for the only fair option, no update. Im not going to be a taffer to all those people who have already put their time into the game after 13m xp. Its upside down backwards to suggest that anyone with 13m xp in a skill is higher than someone with 13m+

 

If they have some option that allows some fairness for those who have already played for their xp, asin not completely ignoring it.. Then I would possibly vote yes to that. Just depends if its a good option or not.

 

Cooking has 630 accounts maxed at 200M and that's growing. Now, I don't know who Matt258 happens to be, but I get the feeling he's not leveling cooking anymore than the other 630 but he gets to be at the top because he happened to get there first a few years ago. At the time it was cool and I even remember the conversation with Jmods about the ranking since at the time every new 200M replaced the old one so Jagex altered the high score tables to compensate (first place was always first place). However it's been 7 years and there may be people that would have been willing to cook more that should rank higher. I'm for a change to this status quo because hyper skilling to is a part of the RS culture.

 

Right now the only two options being offered up in regards to Prestige is either every xp above 13M is lost (Jagex's current plan) or every xp above 13M is counted (most the players giving feedback). One ignores all the time and effort put into each skill above 99. The other rewards players that got a majority of their xp from high level content while those that follow will have to level using low level content for half of their xp in some cases.

 

I think its reasonable if they use prestige system to allow 50% of excess xp to be used in the new format. It assumes that most of that xp is coming from high level content that the player would have used anyway. It also accounts for the half of the xp that you'd have to earn at lower levels. This is not perfect since not all skills are created equal but it seems like a reasonable compromise.

 

Part of me thinks that Jagex wouldn't want to do this since it puts S U O M I in first place who'll stay there for a long time and there seems to be a falling out between them. However, it really shakes up all of the high score boards including the overall board. Those 630 names with 200M in cooking now become tied at Prestige 3, Level 93. Odds are those guys sitting at #600 might be thinking about cooking a rocktail or two to bump up to the number one slot. Same will go with all the other skills where guys were not on the 1st page of high scores. Also, in the total high scores, those players that have skills that aren't Prestige 3 will find themselves dropped below those that have less total xp but more even skill xp. They'll feel the desire to level their lower skills now instead of pushing for 200M on a skill that's not getting them ranked.  All of this is much better than the uproar of having 187M xp essentially wiped from your character. So yeah, I hope it comes about but as a compromise and not an either/or.

[S11m]

I quite liked the rebirth system that Conquer Online had/Has?: 

What is Rebirth? Rebirth is like reincarnation. Your character is born again as whatever class you like. 

However, memories of previous life linger, granting you additional powers, skills and abilities from your old class. 
Reborn characters are much more powerful than newborns, with more Battle Power, higher abilities, better skills and visual glam.

 

Prestige could work like a total reset (with the on/off) switch, but making the exp gaps between level higher. Alas, making something (gear, consumables etc) dependant on Prestige will sure as hell make the rants forum crash. Would be fun tho. 

[brunokiller]

If they want highscores to be competitive then they should stop making silly seasonal highscores.

[Nobody]

If they want highscores to be competitive then they should stop making silly seasonal highscores.

Jagex doesn't want it to be a no lifing competition hence the design of the Jagex Cup.

[liljjp]

 

lol what a joke.

jagex is really starting to fizz out on updates.

grindscape is cool and all but jesus. these people's poor wrists.

i got mems till like march but i probably won't even bother anymore.

the updates now are terrible.

I'm sad to see you go... When is your last login? We'll throw you a party.

 

lol no reason to get butthurt over what i said.

have fun with carpel tunnel ;)

[Yoko Kurama]

If they want highscores to be competitive then they should stop making silly seasonal highscores.

 

Or, they could have just not given everyone millions of free bonus experience for everything so that everyone could get 99s in 5 mins, and then we wouldn't have thousands upon thousands of maxed players, and a high scores that is completely meaningless. 

[Kimberly]

I quite liked the rebirth system that Conquer Online had/Has?: 

 

What is Rebirth? Rebirth is like reincarnation. Your character is born again as whatever class you like. 

However, memories of previous life linger, granting you additional powers, skills and abilities from your old class. 

Reborn characters are much more powerful than newborns, with more Battle Power, higher abilities, better skills and visual glam.

 

Prestige could work like a total reset (with the on/off) switch, but making the exp gaps between level higher. Alas, making something (gear, consumables etc) dependant on Prestige will sure as hell make the rants forum crash. Would be fun tho. 

 

Except almost all rb's didn't do it on their own, they bought dragon balls (20$ usd/per last time I checked) to reach those levels. 

 

That's not the sort of thing I want to see in Runescape.

[Alg]

Or, they could have just not given everyone millions of free bonus experience for everything so that everyone could get 99s in 5 mins, and then we wouldn't have thousands upon thousands of maxed players, and a high scores that is completely meaningless. 

A lot of them have also had 12 years worth of unhealthy play to do it. I mean, that has *something* to do with it, right?

 

...Right?

[highlanders]

Wow. RS is one of those games where getting the max lvl in some of the skills is really long. Mmos are notorious to hog your time, but RS is a bit extreme even for an mmo. I haven't been playing for the past year, or it is 2 years? I don't even know. Are there really people who are just sitting around thinking "Gee I wish I had more stuff to grind?" LOL Or maybe it's jag that's thinking they need to capitalize on their crazed costumers customers. If getting cooking prestige meant getting some epic giant chef's hat, I would do it considering how easy cooking is, that is if I still played. In any case I shall check on the highscores sometimes, I'm sure it'll be funny slash sad to see the extents at which some people waste their life on this game. On some other mmos people are really open about how bad nolifing is, and it's discouraged between peers. But on this game, boy you better not try to suggest that getting 200M exp is insane or you're getting burned at the stake.

[Urza285]

Honestly prestige isn't bad. But I think making a high scores with it implemented as a feature is what makes it bad. I think prestige should come, but yearly high scores, similarly to seasonal high scores should be brought in.

[Sy_Accursed]

I really don't see why we need a poll for this at all.

 

It's simple:

People who want to use it can, people who don't can ignore it.

"Oh but I don't wanna lose rank blah blah" they already said they'll keep the current style of hiscore as a separate category so your precious rank will be ever preserved there.

 

About the only issue to debate is whether the existing or the prestige scores should be used as the main hiscores, with the other being a 2ndary alternate to view.

I mean it literally does absolutely nothing to you or your gameplay if you opt to ignore it, but for maxed people who want it it'll make a world of difference.

 

Besides with how Jagex polls go it'll pass even if they have to pull PR stunts, alter options/levels and then outright ignore the results anyway (Remember how OSRS only reached existence with an additional membership fee, but they kindly let us have 6 months free to celebrate...like 8 months ago)

[Yoko Kurama]

I really don't see why we need a poll for this at all.

 

It's simple:

People who want to use it can, people who don't can ignore it.

"Oh but I don't wanna lose rank blah blah" they already said they'll keep the current style of hiscore as a separate category so your precious rank will be ever preserved there.

 

About the only issue to debate is whether the existing or the prestige scores should be used as the main hiscores, with the other being a 2ndary alternate to view.

I mean it literally does absolutely nothing to you or your gameplay if you opt to ignore it, but for maxed people who want it it'll make a world of difference.

 

Besides with how Jagex polls go it'll pass even if they have to pull PR stunts, alter options/levels and then outright ignore the results anyway (Remember how OSRS only reached existence with an additional membership fee, but they kindly let us have 6 months free to celebrate...like 8 months ago)

 

I agree that it will pass if Jagex wants it to pass; their polling methods are anything but fair and honest.

 

As to whether there needs to be a poll, I find your position to be extremely baffling. This is an update which completely breaks years of Runescape precedent, and is groundbreaking; the customer base has made it clear that they perceive it this way, and they have voiced their discontent with it. Even Jagex has acknowledged that the response to it as pretty bad -- the customer base making their voice clear on an update they feel to adversely affect them, and forcing Jagex, the business, to acknowledge their demands and accommodate them -- this seems to be the most benign thing ever. Isn't that what's supposed to happen? 

[Sy_Accursed]

My stance has nothing to do with Jagex responding to public reaction.

It is purely to do with the mechanics of the change and the fact that if you do not care about it, it has literally zero impact upon you negative or positive. So I fail to see any reason to be soooooo anti it that you want to stop it happening.

 

It'd be like trying to stop a parent at a kid's party going down the road to buy ice-creams for those who want them because you don't want one. Whether or not the ice-creams are bought has no impact on you, either way you go without, but it deprives others of something they desire.

[ilovecuttingyews]

Even if say 5000 people want to take part in this competitively, that's still only 1% of the population. There's no way that 1% yes, 99% no would pass no matter how much Jagex wants it (see: changing votes required for OSRS tiers). Yes, some people will want to do a stat or two and vote yes, or vote yes simply because they think it's a neat idea without actually planning to use it, but I don't see this getting more than 10% support simply because of people thinking "I don't want to use this so I will vote no".

[helring]

 

I really don't see why we need a poll for this at all.

 

It's simple:

People who want to use it can, people who don't can ignore it.

"Oh but I don't wanna lose rank blah blah" they already said they'll keep the current style of hiscore as a separate category so your precious rank will be ever preserved there.

 

About the only issue to debate is whether the existing or the prestige scores should be used as the main hiscores, with the other being a 2ndary alternate to view.

I mean it literally does absolutely nothing to you or your gameplay if you opt to ignore it, but for maxed people who want it it'll make a world of difference.

 

Besides with how Jagex polls go it'll pass even if they have to pull PR stunts, alter options/levels and then outright ignore the results anyway (Remember how OSRS only reached existence with an additional membership fee, but they kindly let us have 6 months free to celebrate...like 8 months ago)

 

I agree that it will pass if Jagex wants it to pass; their polling methods are anything but fair and honest.

 

As to whether there needs to be a poll, I find your position to be extremely baffling. This is an update which completely breaks years of Runescape precedent, and is groundbreaking; the customer base has made it clear that they perceive it this way, and they have voiced their discontent with it. Even Jagex has acknowledged that the response to it as pretty bad -- the customer base making their voice clear on an update they feel to adversely affect them, and forcing Jagex, the business, to acknowledge their demands and accommodate them -- this seems to be the most benign thing ever. Isn't that what's supposed to happen? 

 

 

The runescape fanbase (myself included at times) is one of the most reactionary fan bases I have ever seen. Any change is perceived as a change that completely breaks years of precedence. This update is completely optional, and if that many people hated it then it doesn't matter which high scores Jagex says is the main one anyway, player could still just use the old one. What demands are they forcing Jagex to take into account...the "I don't like this optional update so no one should get to enjoy it" attitude is just awful. 

[Hedgehog]

 

 

I really don't see why we need a poll for this at all.

 

It's simple:

People who want to use it can, people who don't can ignore it.

"Oh but I don't wanna lose rank blah blah" they already said they'll keep the current style of hiscore as a separate category so your precious rank will be ever preserved there.

 

About the only issue to debate is whether the existing or the prestige scores should be used as the main hiscores, with the other being a 2ndary alternate to view.

I mean it literally does absolutely nothing to you or your gameplay if you opt to ignore it, but for maxed people who want it it'll make a world of difference.

 

Besides with how Jagex polls go it'll pass even if they have to pull PR stunts, alter options/levels and then outright ignore the results anyway (Remember how OSRS only reached existence with an additional membership fee, but they kindly let us have 6 months free to celebrate...like 8 months ago)

 

I agree that it will pass if Jagex wants it to pass; their polling methods are anything but fair and honest.

 

As to whether there needs to be a poll, I find your position to be extremely baffling. This is an update which completely breaks years of Runescape precedent, and is groundbreaking; the customer base has made it clear that they perceive it this way, and they have voiced their discontent with it. Even Jagex has acknowledged that the response to it as pretty bad -- the customer base making their voice clear on an update they feel to adversely affect them, and forcing Jagex, the business, to acknowledge their demands and accommodate them -- this seems to be the most benign thing ever. Isn't that what's supposed to happen? 

 

 

The runescape fanbase (myself included at times) is one of the most reactionary fan bases I have ever seen. Any change is perceived as a change that completely breaks years of precedence. This update is completely optional, and if that many people hated it then it doesn't matter which high scores Jagex says is the main one anyway, player could still just use the old one. 

 

Well I mean, it isn't really that optional

 

It's only optional if all of the following are true:

 

• You don't care about ranks
• You don't associate with anyone who participates in the update (if I still have to hear about people getting levels, I'm still experiencing the update)
• You never look at the hiscores
• You don't plan to play the game in 2 years

Just because I don't have to reset my stats doesn't mean the update won't negatively affect me.

[helring]

Ranks on the old high scores will still be there, just use that one. If as many people hate it then there will be plenty still using it.

 

Oh no, you need to hear about someone else enjoying an update, how awful for you.

 

Just use the other high scores. It will still be there. That extra click or two to get to them won't hurt you.

 

Why does playing the game in 2 years matter at all? Are they going to get rid of the old high scores in 2 years?

 

 

The effect on you is minimal at best. You can ignore the update. Someone else enjoying the update does not effect you in the slightest unless its just spite that you don't want them to do so. Holding back an update because you personally wouldn't enjoy it while your method of playing can be completely unaffected is just selfish.

[Alg]

Am I the only one who's being reminded of all of the arguments about wilderness clue scrolls? Because the "If you don't like it you don't have to do it" thing sounds very familiar.

 

I can barely afford training items as it is, but it's so nice to hear that having to compete with a horde of high-level billionaires for resources they wouldn't have bothered with otherwise won't affect me in any way~!

[Urza285]

I think barring everything but basics in PVP sounds interesting.