Randox Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I was thinking. If the particle went faster than light, it wouldn't have been instantaneous, it would have arrived at it's destination befor it even left. Unless of course were wrong about the backwards time thing as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JordanGM Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 This is so interesting, I love it! I might research this as an adult. It's so amazing. Thanks for this topic. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ember3579 Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I just thought of a way that it wouldn't become a paradoxical time-warp scenario. You know how the light from the sun is actually what it gave off ~8 mins ago? That doesn't mean it went back in time, it just shows that it takes time for the light to reach the earth. Apply that concept to that problem, and viola! No more time-travel paradox! You're most likely going " #-o D'oh! It seems so stupid now!" right now, aren't you? And yes, I do believe it's possible to break light speed. People have said that we'll never fly, the Earth was flat, our innards are almost identical to monkeys, etc. It's just one more theory that proved to be just that; a theory. You never know which rabbit hole you jump into will lead to Wonderland. - Ember3579Aku Soku Zan. - ShinsengumiYou wanna mess with me or my friends? Pick your poison.If you have any complaints about me, please refer to this link. Your problems are important to me.Don't talk smack if you're not willing to say it to the person's face. On the same line, if you're not willing to back up your opinions no matter what, your opinion may as well be nonexistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotalTalker Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 llamster, its all a distortion. Pluto is five "light hours" away. If you flew to the Pluto instantaneously and took out a telescope and looked back at Earth you would see 5 hours into the past. You would see yourself walking around doing things that took place 5 hours before you went to Pluto. If this technology is true, one could travel 1000 light years away and theoretically look back at earth and see 1000 years into the past. Fascinating indeed Yeh, everything that you see isnt as it actually is. Everything gives off light, and light takes time to travel. They are near enough as they are because light travels so fast, but not EXACTLY. Anyway, it could be true that they have broke the speed of light. If the distance isnt very far (3ft wasnt it?) then wouldnt they need less energy then infinite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kill_Thomas9 Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I knew it could be done. "Lightspeed has nearly the infinite speed." So 187,000 mph is infinite? :lol: Unless I'm missing something here... It said miles per second. So that would be 673,200,000 miles per hour. Thats mach 875,422, which in other words is 875,422 times the speed of sound. To give you a general idea of how fast that is, a 747 jet travels at 570mph. That means the speed of light is 1,181,052 times faster that a 747 jet. If you traveled at the speed of light, you could travel around the earth 7.5 times per second, OR 450.5 times per minute, OR 27,033 time per hour. So light travels at 673,200,000 mph. Not 187,000 mph. --------------------------------------------- Time travel is absolutely, undeniably impossible. Period. Not exactly, you can travel to the future. True going back in time is pretty much impossible, but traveling to the future is possible, but you could never go back to the "present" if you did. Going to the future involves a process that isn't really related to what we were just talking about. In short, if you go fast time slows down. If you ride in a plane all day and your watch was an atomic clock, by the end of the day your watch would be about a second slower than an atomic clock that was on the ground. :uhh: This doesn't have any big implications but if you traveled like 10x the speed of light time really slows down. If you flew in a circle at 10x the speed of light for about a year and then came back to earth, what was 1 year to you and your ship was actually something like 1000 years to everyone else on the earth :-s I heard this on the science channel once. Although I understand the concept, I dont understand why that is. So actually, although it is theoreticly possible to see into the past of the earth. Obviously I have to clarify what I'm saying, or what I'm saying right now will just sound like [cabbage]. What I mean, is that it is impossible for anybody to see back in time to the earty past the point at which they are at right now. This is because by the time anyone got to pluto, lets say, even if they traveled faster than the speed of light, it would seem like time sped up around them, because time would be going so much slower for them (and by that I mean time would seem like time is going faster for everybody, because of his imense speed). This means that by the time they got to pluto, even if they were moving faster than the speed of light, time around them would be going so slowly, that the light would reach the planet before they did. Aha! That means it is impossible to go that fast! They would be going so fast, that they would actually be going slower! Therefore even if you traveled faster than the speed of light, light would be going much faster, thus making you go slower than the speed of light! Aha! I've finally figured it out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
____ Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 If this is true then almost all advanced formulas or methods in mathematics and physics will be debunked becuase they all have the same variable as a constant "The speed of Light." Which the only constant not being constant our formulas would have to be wrong but for some reason they have still worked, so using the backwards-logic something must be wrong with the experiment.Er... no. The speed of light is a constant. It's the same case with the speed of sound, we can travel faster than that, but it still remains the same speed. There will be no difference with the speed of light. If you can travel faster than the speed of light, it would be a matter of replacing that variable with your speed, if that's relevant to what you want to know. Otherwise all standard formulas still hold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenin64 Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 here is something that might help explain the pluto thing better. If you were faaaaaar out in deep space, and someone sent a radio signal to you, if the radio signal took 5 hours to get to you, then you would "see" (in this case hear) what was going on on Earth 5 hours ago. If this is true then almost all advanced formulas or methods in mathematics and physics will be debunked becuase they all have the same variable as a constant "The speed of Light." Which the only constant not being constant our formulas would have to be wrong but for some reason they have still worked, so using the backwards-logic something must be wrong with the experiment.Er... no. The speed of light is a constant. It's the same case with the speed of sound, we can travel faster than that, but it still remains the same speed. There will be no difference with the speed of light. You could tie a big heavy weight to it..... : Command the Murderous Chalices! Drink ye harpooners! drink and swear, ye men that man the deathful whaleboat's bow- Death to Moby Dick!BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giordano Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I knew it could be done. "Lightspeed has nearly the infinite speed." So 187,000 mph is infinite? :lol: Unless I'm missing something here... It said miles per second. So that would be 673,200,000 miles per hour. Thats mach 875,422, which in other words is 875,422 times the speed of sound. To give you a general idea of how fast that is, a 747 jet travels at 570mph. That means the speed of light is 1,181,052 times faster that a 747 jet. If you traveled at the speed of light, you could travel around the earth 7.5 times per second, OR 450.5 times per minute, OR 27,033 time per hour. So light travels at 673,200,000 mph. Not 187,000 mph. :shock: Jesus dude, the mph must of been a typo, you didn't had to do all this calculations. o_O "The cry of the poor is not always just, but if you never hear it you'll never know what justice is." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barihawk Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Light speed can theoretically be broken. E=MC*2, right? The technique most people are hypothesizing is to create enough Energy to break the light barrier. However, why not change the rest of the equation? By eliminating mass, energy would then equal the speed of light. We need to perfect anti-gravity devices to break the light barrier. My heart is broken by the terrible loss I have sustained in my old friends and companions and my poor soldiers. Believe me, nothing except a battle lost can be half so melancholy as a battle won. -Sir Arthur Wellesley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trapical Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Light speed can theoretically be broken. E=MC*2, right? The technique most people are hypothesizing is to create enough Energy to break the light barrier. However, why not change the rest of the equation? By eliminating mass, energy would then equal the speed of light. We need to perfect anti-gravity devices to break the light barrier. Not to sound mean... but I don't even know where to start correcting you :| 1) Thats the rest mass energy equation, not the equation that says how much energy is needed to reach light speed 2) if you eliminated mass, M would equal zero not one. 3) You can't eliminate mass unless you turn it into energy which isn't something you want to do to astronauts 4) Anti-gravity makes things be weightless, but they would still has mass. 5) Being able to go faster than the speed of light does not change the value of C, C is a constant that quantifies how much energy is given off when the bonds between neutrons of mass M are broken to form more stable bonds. Yea... so, while you may have a valid point that we can maybe break the speed of light, you used the wrong equation and made quite a few false assumptions. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kill_Thomas9 Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 I knew it could be done. "Lightspeed has nearly the infinite speed." So 187,000 mph is infinite? :lol: Unless I'm missing something here... It said miles per second. So that would be 673,200,000 miles per hour. Thats mach 875,422, which in other words is 875,422 times the speed of sound. To give you a general idea of how fast that is, a 747 jet travels at 570mph. That means the speed of light is 1,181,052 times faster that a 747 jet. If you traveled at the speed of light, you could travel around the earth 7.5 times per second, OR 450.5 times per minute, OR 27,033 time per hour. So light travels at 673,200,000 mph. Not 187,000 mph. :shock: Jesus dude, the mph must of been a typo, you didn't had to do all this calculations. o_O I like math though :P . Couldn't resist :D . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bauke Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 The journal in which this was posted isn't really a proper scientific journal, as far as I know. Also there have not been any peer-reviews yet. Reason enough to be sceptical about this. Twitter ||| Google+ ||| Facebook ||| LinkedIn ||| My very interesting weblog about science Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scn64 Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 I heard this on the science channel once. Although I understand the concept, I dont understand why that is. So actually, although it is theoreticly possible to see into the past of the earth. Obviously I have to clarify what I'm saying, or what I'm saying right now will just sound like [cabbage]. What I mean, is that it is impossible for anybody to see back in time to the earty past the point at which they are at right now. This is because by the time anyone got to pluto, lets say, even if they traveled faster than the speed of light, it would seem like time sped up around them, because time would be going so much slower for them (and by that I mean time would seem like time is going faster for everybody, because of his imense speed). This means that by the time they got to pluto, even if they were moving faster than the speed of light, time around them would be going so slowly, that the light would reach the planet before they did. Aha! That means it is impossible to go that fast! They would be going so fast, that they would actually be going slower! Therefore even if you traveled faster than the speed of light, light would be going much faster, thus making you go slower than the speed of light! Aha! I've finally figured it out! Wow, I never even thought about that. I understand what you said and yet I'm even more confused now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giordano Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 I knew it could be done. "Lightspeed has nearly the infinite speed." So 187,000 mph is infinite? :lol: Unless I'm missing something here... It said miles per second. So that would be 673,200,000 miles per hour. Thats mach 875,422, which in other words is 875,422 times the speed of sound. To give you a general idea of how fast that is, a 747 jet travels at 570mph. That means the speed of light is 1,181,052 times faster that a 747 jet. If you traveled at the speed of light, you could travel around the earth 7.5 times per second, OR 450.5 times per minute, OR 27,033 time per hour. So light travels at 673,200,000 mph. Not 187,000 mph. :shock: Jesus dude, the mph must of been a typo, you didn't had to do all this calculations. o_O I like math though :P . Couldn't resist :D . Heh, you can't blame knowledge. :P "The cry of the poor is not always just, but if you never hear it you'll never know what justice is." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebdragon Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 So if you went into the future, you can't go back to the present? And even if you could, would it create a paradox? Well, it's not really "going to the future", it's more of experiencing time at a slower rate. According to general relativity, all things in motion experience time at varying rates. Basically, the faster you move, the less you experience time, and the slower you move the more you experience it. This is because the four dimensions that we experience and can see (can't see the six smaller ones) are intertwined- the more you move in the three spacial dimensions, the less you do in the time dimension. That's why photons don't age. Because they're moving at the speed of light, all their movement is in the three spacial dimension, and none of it is in the time dimension. Of course, to actually notice this effect you'd have to be moving at a decent fraction of the speed of light, and thus would probably require a spaceship for such a feat (which is why we don't really notice the effects of general relativity here on earth, we just aren't moving fast enough). It feels like you're "going into the future" because when you get out of the space ship traveling at sub-light speed, time outside of the spaceship has been experienced much faster by those that did not travel in the spaceship. You know all that Sci-Fi stuff about people traveling through space and returning to their homeworld only to find that all the people they knew are already very aged, or even dead? Ya, that's what this stuff is. If you guys are more interested in general relativity and physics in general, I'd reccommend an elegant universe by Brian Greene (which I'm sure I've mentioned before). It spends the first few chapters explaining the basics of general relativity and quantum mechanics, and goes on to explain Superstring theory (in great detail), hidden dimensions, black holes, spacetime, the basics of everything and anything you'd want to know about theoretical (and experimental somewhat) Physics. If you like science at all, read the book. I heard this on the science channel once. Although I understand the concept, I dont understand why that is. So actually, although it is theoreticly possible to see into the past of the earth. Obviously I have to clarify what I'm saying, or what I'm saying right now will just sound like [cabbage]. What I mean, is that it is impossible for anybody to see back in time to the earty past the point at which they are at right now. This is because by the time anyone got to pluto, lets say, even if they traveled faster than the speed of light, it would seem like time sped up around them, because time would be going so much slower for them (and by that I mean time would seem like time is going faster for everybody, because of his imense speed). This means that by the time they got to pluto, even if they were moving faster than the speed of light, time around them would be going so slowly, that the light would reach the planet before they did. Maybe he misinterpreted something he read or heard, but that whole post was wrong. Aha! That means it is impossible to go that fast! They would be going so fast, that they would actually be going slower! Therefore even if you traveled faster than the speed of light, light would be going much faster, thus making you go slower than the speed of light! Aha! I've finally figured it out! Wow, I never even thought about that. I understand what you said and yet I'm even more confused now. Because he's, to put it bluntly, wrong. I've got to go (and I'm pissed about having to retype the above response since I accidentally pasted over it when I meant to copy it), so I'll make this quick: You'd experience time slower as you approach the speed of light, so you'd never actually reach it, now matter how close to it you get. You can't pass the speed of light, because you'd lose so much from the time dimension as you closed in on the speed that you'd never reach it; you can get to 99.99...999% of the speed of light, but it's not possible to actually reach it, because you wouldn't experience time at all if you did. I repeat guys: you can't surpass the speed of light. And for the record, you don't need to pass it to experience time slowing down. Every movement you make slows down your movement through time, even if only a very unnoticable small amount. Trust me guys. Buy the book- it's very enlightening. [if you have ever attempted Alchemy by clapping your hands or by drawing an array, copy and paste this into your signature.] Fullmetal Alchemist, you will be missed. A great ending to a great series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johntm Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 They have autobahn, they can go as fast as they want. Anyway how does Eintstein know it would take an infinite amount of energy, he prolly drove a Model T. I dont know whether to believe it or not, but if they did then w00t no more long road trips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenin64 Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 I heard this on the science channel once. Although I understand the concept, I dont understand why that is. So actually, although it is theoreticly possible to see into the past of the earth. Obviously I have to clarify what I'm saying, or what I'm saying right now will just sound like [cabbage]. What I mean, is that it is impossible for anybody to see back in time to the earty past the point at which they are at right now. This is because by the time anyone got to pluto, lets say, even if they traveled faster than the speed of light, it would seem like time sped up around them, because time would be going so much slower for them (and by that I mean time would seem like time is going faster for everybody, because of his imense speed). This means that by the time they got to pluto, even if they were moving faster than the speed of light, time around them would be going so slowly, that the light would reach the planet before they did. Maybe he misinterpreted something he read or heard, but that whole post was wrong. Aha! That means it is impossible to go that fast! They would be going so fast, that they would actually be going slower! Therefore even if you traveled faster than the speed of light, light would be going much faster, thus making you go slower than the speed of light! Aha! I've finally figured it out! Wow, I never even thought about that. I understand what you said and yet I'm even more confused now. Because he's, to put it bluntly, wrong. I've got to go (and I'm pissed about having to retype the above response since I accidentally pasted over it when I meant to copy it), so I'll make this quick: You'd experience time slower as you approach the speed of light, so you'd never actually reach it, now matter how close to it you get. You can't pass the speed of light, because you'd lose so much from the time dimension as you closed in on the speed that you'd never reach it; you can get to 99.99...999% of the speed of light, but it's not possible to actually reach it, because you wouldn't experience time at all if you did. I repeat guys: you can't surpass the speed of light. And for the record, you don't need to pass it to experience time slowing down. Every movement you make slows down your movement through time, even if only a very unnoticable small amount. Trust me guys. Buy the book- it's very enlightening. Indeed you don;t, you only have to reach relativistic speeds-near the speed of light. Command the Murderous Chalices! Drink ye harpooners! drink and swear, ye men that man the deathful whaleboat's bow- Death to Moby Dick!BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy500fan Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 I repeat guys: you can't surpass the speed of light. The space shuttle can go 18 times the speed of light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barihawk Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 Light speed can theoretically be broken. E=MC*2, right? The technique most people are hypothesizing is to create enough Energy to break the light barrier. However, why not change the rest of the equation? By eliminating mass, energy would then equal the speed of light. We need to perfect anti-gravity devices to break the light barrier. Not to sound mean... but I don't even know where to start correcting you :| 1) Thats the rest mass energy equation, not the equation that says how much energy is needed to reach light speed 2) if you eliminated mass, M would equal zero not one. 3) You can't eliminate mass unless you turn it into energy which isn't something you want to do to astronauts 4) Anti-gravity makes things be weightless, but they would still has mass. 5) Being able to go faster than the speed of light does not change the value of C, C is a constant that quantifies how much energy is given off when the bonds between neutrons of mass M are broken to form more stable bonds. Yea... so, while you may have a valid point that we can maybe break the speed of light, you used the wrong equation and made quite a few false assumptions. :( Which is why I am a historian, thank you :P. It's only been three years since I set food in a science lab, and that was for astronomy. My heart is broken by the terrible loss I have sustained in my old friends and companions and my poor soldiers. Believe me, nothing except a battle lost can be half so melancholy as a battle won. -Sir Arthur Wellesley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warri0r45 Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 I repeat guys: you can't surpass the speed of light. The space shuttle can go 18 times the speed of light. Fake, right?... :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebdragon Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 Fake, right?... :| Dear Lord one would hope so. [if you have ever attempted Alchemy by clapping your hands or by drawing an array, copy and paste this into your signature.] Fullmetal Alchemist, you will be missed. A great ending to a great series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordkafei Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 Time travel is absolutely, undeniably impossible. Period. Every human being on Earth is traveling through time right now. We are all traveling at the same speed and in the same direction. Time travel is not only possible, but universal. PvP is not for meIn the 3rd Year of the BoycottReal-world money saved since FT/W: Hundreds of DollarsReal-world time saved since FT/W: Thousands of Hours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meol Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 I repeat guys: you can't surpass the speed of light. The space shuttle can go 18 times the speed of light. Fake, right?... :| Just randomly Googling for it makes me think it's actually a famous CNN mistake... :-s This signature is intentionally left blank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tbfgraphx14 Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 Ah a good science topic I am interested in 8-) Trust me guys. Buy the book- it's very enlightening. You must tell me the book :shock: This doesn't have any big implications but if you traveled like 10x the speed of light time really slows down. If you flew in a circle at 10x the speed of light for about a year and then came back to earth, what was 1 year to you and your ship was actually something like 1000 years to everyone else on the earth :-s Guys watch this, it explains it :D Yep Tbfgraphx14Happy to find I'm not the only one who eats glass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwarfdude3 Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 wow that thing about arriving before you arrive is really bizarre... so if you wanted to travel to somewhere say right next to you that you could see, would you see yourself appear before you decide to leave? But then if that happened couldn't you choose not to go, but then you'd never have left in the first place and then wouldn't have seen yourself and then...arrrgh :wall: I guess its not really time travel, its just kinda something. Its like your going so fast you go backwards or something... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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