In my experience it just gets you walked over.

 

I think I might have just gotten friend zoned by waiting too long, should be able to fix it though.

 

Might try cavemanning, and I have a couple other thoughts too.

Might try cavemanning, and I have a couple other thoughts too.

And that is? :mellow:

Might try cavemanning, and I have a couple other thoughts too.

And that is? :mellow:

Quick Definition

 

Aggressively escalating physical contact with a consenting female, much like it is believed the cavemen did before language developed.

Full Definition

 

Going “caveman” usually involves minimal verbal escalation and more kino and direct physical escalation. It is a great way to get rid of AA, and can also assist some shy rAFCs in re-calibrating and understanding where the limits are in physical escalation. Essentially, the PUA will aggressively escalate until he gets a concrete “stop” or “no” from the target.

 

Some examples of cavemanning include grabbing a girl by the waist and pulling her towards you, or in the bedroom, picking up a girl and throwing her onto the bed. Done properly, cavemanning is very dominant and attractive. Calibration is important with cavemanning, and it is important to properly gauge a woman’s buying temperature and respect her physical limits.

 

I was kinda iffy about trying it out, but I've never gotten a bad response because nobody has an default reply to it. Only been stopped once, and normal conversation resumed straight away.

In my experience cave manning is either epic win or epic fail. There's not much middle ground. I enjoy doing it though, it's funny when you fail at it, because of how awkward some people make it. So it's a win-win for me, I either fail and laugh about it, or succeed and continue.

In my experience cave manning is either epic win or epic fail. There's not much middle ground. I enjoy doing it though, it's funny when you fail at it, because of how awkward some people make it. So it's a win-win for me, I either fail and laugh about it, or succeed and continue.

 

Your frame and the situation is important too, I guess you just gotta know when to do it.

Could you please explain what cavemanning is?

Digging a hole and hiding in it?

He already did. See the page before.

IMO people here seem to be way too scientific about all this. Oenitus, cavemanning, friend zoned, 3 second rule, who is inventing these terms? Where is the spontanuous side of flirting etc. with girl? From what I read here, you guys seem to be strategists, thinking about everything they are gonna say beforehand and following strict tactics. That seems just ... weird. If I were a girl, I would never want to go with a guy who is looking at their relationship as a strategy game, planning his moves according to the guidebook.

 

what is the 3 second rule by the way, and where are you people getting all these weird terms?

IMO people here seem to be way too scientific about all this. Oenitus, cavemanning, friend zoned, 3 second rule, who is inventing these terms? Where is the spontanuous side of flirting etc. with girl? From what I read here, you guys seem to be strategists, thinking about everything they are gonna say beforehand and following strict tactics. That seems just ... weird. If I were a girl, I would never want to go with a guy who is looking at their relationship as a strategy game, planning his moves according to the guidebook.

 

what is the 3 second rule by the way, and where are you people getting all these weird terms?

3 second rule is just saying if you see an attractive girl or whatever you count to 3, and then go up and talk to her or whatever, that way you don't really have time to think of the what-ifs. I think.

^Yup. And these terms are coming from pickup artists. What you're going to do isn't actually planned, no more than saying "I might take her ice skating" is planning.

I just dislike the whole concept of gaming because it focuses more on the physical rather than emotional, and basically gets you one night stands and hook-ups rather than a real relationship. And yes, I mean a relationship where you're looking for more than just sex from the other person, and are invested in their emotions and well-being. I've decided after this summer that I would much prefer a long-term relationship to casual hook-ups and one night stands. I just enjoy it way more. Plus the party/club scene is filled with way too many douchebags and guidos (Which are often the same thing).

 

So yeah, reading about girls being referred to as an object that actually pisses me off. You just "do this" and get a relationship. You might get the girl, but you won't keep her. The only way to get a real relationship is to put yourself out there, meet new people, and let them see who you are. Hell, I met my last girlfriend through a ski trip, and my current "girlfriend" through a leadership camp. Quotes are there because it's in that transition phase between friends and girlfriend.

 

Basically, relationships are about feelings, not gaming girls. If you don't want a relationship, game away. But if you are looking for one, just put yourself out in the world. If you don't get a relationship, you're going to enjoy yourself anyways.

 

I'm not saying that gaming won't get you someone to have a relationship with, but that's not the main point of gaming, and gaming doesn't exactly support monogamy. You're still meeting new people. I just think that it's on much less of a personal level.

 

But something I've always wondered, what exactly does oneitis pertain to? It seems as if it's just calling a relationship with someone a bad thing.

But something I've always wondered, what exactly does oneitis pertain to? It seems as if it's just calling a relationship with someone a bad thing.

 

I agree perfectly with everything in your post. And oneitis for the most part pertains to someone who is so focused on a single girl/boy that he/she is too paralyzed by that person's apparent perfection to actually do anything about it. Normally it refers to a sort of obsession, and that goes beyond healthy relationship. At least that's how I view it.

I just dislike the whole concept of gaming because it focuses more on the physical rather than emotional, and basically gets you one night stands and hook-ups rather than a real relationship. And yes, I mean a relationship where you're looking for more than just sex from the other person, and are invested in their emotions and well-being. I've decided after this summer that I would much prefer a long-term relationship to casual hook-ups and one night stands. I just enjoy it way more. Plus the party/club scene is filled with way too many douchebags and guidos (Which are often the same thing).

 

So yeah, reading about girls being referred to as an object that actually pisses me off. You just "do this" and get a relationship. You might get the girl, but you won't keep her. The only way to get a real relationship is to put yourself out there, meet new people, and let them see who you are. Hell, I met my last girlfriend through a ski trip, and my current "girlfriend" through a leadership camp. Quotes are there because it's in that transition phase between friends and girlfriend.

 

Basically, relationships are about feelings, not gaming girls. If you don't want a relationship, game away. But if you are looking for one, just put yourself out in the world. If you don't get a relationship, you're going to enjoy yourself anyways.

 

I'm not saying that gaming won't get you someone to have a relationship with, but that's not the main point of gaming, and gaming doesn't exactly support monogamy. You're still meeting new people. I just think that it's on much less of a personal level.

 

But something I've always wondered, what exactly does oneitis pertain to? It seems as if it's just calling a relationship with someone a bad thing.

 

So many things wrong here. First of all, whenever you're keen on a girl and trying to attract her, you're gaming her whether you're a socially inept nice guy or a pua. We're all 'gaming,' the only difference between me and the next guy is that I have a clue, and I have a wider choice.

 

The goal of gaming isn't to get laid, it's whatever you want it to be. Gaming also isn't restricted to clubs and pubs only.

 

Girls use 'methods' to attract guys, do you think they wear high heals and miniskirts because they are comfortable? Our 'methods' are different because guys and girls are attracted to different things.

 

Girls aren't objectified, it just sounds like that in pick up material because it's an efficient way to get a point across. It's a HB8, rather than a-really-attractive-female-who-is-equal-to-men-and-has-feelings-too-and-isn't-a-sex-object.

 

Oneitis is basically when a guy is obsessed with a girl he has next to no chance with, no other girl will do, and he can't see that his efforts are futile. The more he likes her and the longer he is around her the more he screws it up for himself. It's not an actual relationship.

I'm really starting to like this girl in my grade. I've known her for a couple years but never really talked too much besides a "hey" and maybe some small chit-chat once in a while in the halls. After hanging out with her and some other friends we have in common a couple weekends ago we had a really nice convo on msn when we both got back to our homes and it seems we have a lot in common. Up until a few days ago, we didnt talk much on msn or see eachother in person. Now, it seems like we talk to eachother every time we are both online (sometimes lasting from 1am until 5am in the morning). Today, we talked about some meaningful stuff that has been happening in our lives (things I would usually only talk to about with my closest friends, such as my fears and nerves for the future). I'll probably see her new years eve at a party and talk to her a lot in person there. Sad thing is, she has a boyfriend.

Having meaningful conversations about things that you only tell close friends with a girl you aren't physical with generally means friend zone.

 

If said girl has a boyfriend, It's almost definite unless you're like 14.

[hide]

I just dislike the whole concept of gaming because it focuses more on the physical rather than emotional, and basically gets you one night stands and hook-ups rather than a real relationship. And yes, I mean a relationship where you're looking for more than just sex from the other person, and are invested in their emotions and well-being. I've decided after this summer that I would much prefer a long-term relationship to casual hook-ups and one night stands. I just enjoy it way more. Plus the party/club scene is filled with way too many douchebags and guidos (Which are often the same thing).

 

So yeah, reading about girls being referred to as an object that actually pisses me off. You just "do this" and get a relationship. You might get the girl, but you won't keep her. The only way to get a real relationship is to put yourself out there, meet new people, and let them see who you are. Hell, I met my last girlfriend through a ski trip, and my current "girlfriend" through a leadership camp. Quotes are there because it's in that transition phase between friends and girlfriend.

 

Basically, relationships are about feelings, not gaming girls. If you don't want a relationship, game away. But if you are looking for one, just put yourself out in the world. If you don't get a relationship, you're going to enjoy yourself anyways.

 

I'm not saying that gaming won't get you someone to have a relationship with, but that's not the main point of gaming, and gaming doesn't exactly support monogamy. You're still meeting new people. I just think that it's on much less of a personal level.

 

But something I've always wondered, what exactly does oneitis pertain to? It seems as if it's just calling a relationship with someone a bad thing.

 

So many things wrong here. First of all, whenever you're keen on a girl and trying to attract her, you're gaming her whether you're a socially inept nice guy or a pua. We're all 'gaming,' the only difference between me and the next guy is that I have a clue, and I have a wider choice.

 

The goal of gaming isn't to get laid, it's whatever you want it to be. Gaming also isn't restricted to clubs and pubs only.

 

Girls use 'methods' to attract guys, do you think they wear high heals and miniskirts because they are comfortable? Our 'methods' are different because guys and girls are attracted to different things.

 

Girls aren't objectified, it just sounds like that in pick up material because it's an efficient way to get a point across. It's a HB8, rather than a-really-attractive-female-who-is-equal-to-men-and-has-feelings-too-and-isn't-a-sex-object.

 

Oneitis is basically when a guy is obsessed with a girl he has next to no chance with, no other girl will do, and he can't see that his efforts are futile. The more he likes her and the longer he is around her the more he screws it up for himself. It's not an actual relationship.

[/hide]

Even if the point isn't just getting laid, it definitely still gives the impression that this is the point. And I really did think oneitis just meant you were focusing on one girl, and just ignoring the rest (Ignoring in terms fo attraction, not socially). Now I definitely have to agree that oneitis is a bad thing.

 

So pretty much I gotta admit that you've cleared it up, I definitely don't see gaming as something so shallow any more.

[hide]

I just dislike the whole concept of gaming because it focuses more on the physical rather than emotional, and basically gets you one night stands and hook-ups rather than a real relationship. And yes, I mean a relationship where you're looking for more than just sex from the other person, and are invested in their emotions and well-being. I've decided after this summer that I would much prefer a long-term relationship to casual hook-ups and one night stands. I just enjoy it way more. Plus the party/club scene is filled with way too many douchebags and guidos (Which are often the same thing).

 

So yeah, reading about girls being referred to as an object that actually pisses me off. You just "do this" and get a relationship. You might get the girl, but you won't keep her. The only way to get a real relationship is to put yourself out there, meet new people, and let them see who you are. Hell, I met my last girlfriend through a ski trip, and my current "girlfriend" through a leadership camp. Quotes are there because it's in that transition phase between friends and girlfriend.

 

Basically, relationships are about feelings, not gaming girls. If you don't want a relationship, game away. But if you are looking for one, just put yourself out in the world. If you don't get a relationship, you're going to enjoy yourself anyways.

 

I'm not saying that gaming won't get you someone to have a relationship with, but that's not the main point of gaming, and gaming doesn't exactly support monogamy. You're still meeting new people. I just think that it's on much less of a personal level.

 

But something I've always wondered, what exactly does oneitis pertain to? It seems as if it's just calling a relationship with someone a bad thing.

 

So many things wrong here. First of all, whenever you're keen on a girl and trying to attract her, you're gaming her whether you're a socially inept nice guy or a pua. We're all 'gaming,' the only difference between me and the next guy is that I have a clue, and I have a wider choice.

 

The goal of gaming isn't to get laid, it's whatever you want it to be. Gaming also isn't restricted to clubs and pubs only.

 

Girls use 'methods' to attract guys, do you think they wear high heals and miniskirts because they are comfortable? Our 'methods' are different because guys and girls are attracted to different things.

 

Girls aren't objectified, it just sounds like that in pick up material because it's an efficient way to get a point across. It's a HB8, rather than a-really-attractive-female-who-is-equal-to-men-and-has-feelings-too-and-isn't-a-sex-object.

 

Oneitis is basically when a guy is obsessed with a girl he has next to no chance with, no other girl will do, and he can't see that his efforts are futile. The more he likes her and the longer he is around her the more he screws it up for himself. It's not an actual relationship.

[/hide]

Even if the point isn't just getting laid, it definitely still gives the impression that this is the point. And I really did think oneitis just meant you were focusing on one girl, and just ignoring the rest (Ignoring in terms fo attraction, not socially). Now I definitely have to agree that oneitis is a bad thing.

 

So pretty much I gotta admit that you've cleared it up, but I still don't think that doing anything with the sole intention of getting a girl is a good thing, it should always be about enjoying yourself. Again, the concept of gaming gives that impression.

 

I don't know about you, but successfully getting together with a girl I'm really attracted to would be very enjoyable.

[hide]

I just dislike the whole concept of gaming because it focuses more on the physical rather than emotional, and basically gets you one night stands and hook-ups rather than a real relationship. And yes, I mean a relationship where you're looking for more than just sex from the other person, and are invested in their emotions and well-being. I've decided after this summer that I would much prefer a long-term relationship to casual hook-ups and one night stands. I just enjoy it way more. Plus the party/club scene is filled with way too many douchebags and guidos (Which are often the same thing).

 

So yeah, reading about girls being referred to as an object that actually pisses me off. You just "do this" and get a relationship. You might get the girl, but you won't keep her. The only way to get a real relationship is to put yourself out there, meet new people, and let them see who you are. Hell, I met my last girlfriend through a ski trip, and my current "girlfriend" through a leadership camp. Quotes are there because it's in that transition phase between friends and girlfriend.

 

Basically, relationships are about feelings, not gaming girls. If you don't want a relationship, game away. But if you are looking for one, just put yourself out in the world. If you don't get a relationship, you're going to enjoy yourself anyways.

 

I'm not saying that gaming won't get you someone to have a relationship with, but that's not the main point of gaming, and gaming doesn't exactly support monogamy. You're still meeting new people. I just think that it's on much less of a personal level.

 

But something I've always wondered, what exactly does oneitis pertain to? It seems as if it's just calling a relationship with someone a bad thing.

 

So many things wrong here. First of all, whenever you're keen on a girl and trying to attract her, you're gaming her whether you're a socially inept nice guy or a pua. We're all 'gaming,' the only difference between me and the next guy is that I have a clue, and I have a wider choice.

 

The goal of gaming isn't to get laid, it's whatever you want it to be. Gaming also isn't restricted to clubs and pubs only.

 

Girls use 'methods' to attract guys, do you think they wear high heals and miniskirts because they are comfortable? Our 'methods' are different because guys and girls are attracted to different things.

 

Girls aren't objectified, it just sounds like that in pick up material because it's an efficient way to get a point across. It's a HB8, rather than a-really-attractive-female-who-is-equal-to-men-and-has-feelings-too-and-isn't-a-sex-object.

 

Oneitis is basically when a guy is obsessed with a girl he has next to no chance with, no other girl will do, and he can't see that his efforts are futile. The more he likes her and the longer he is around her the more he screws it up for himself. It's not an actual relationship.

[/hide]

Even if the point isn't just getting laid, it definitely still gives the impression that this is the point. And I really did think oneitis just meant you were focusing on one girl, and just ignoring the rest (Ignoring in terms fo attraction, not socially). Now I definitely have to agree that oneitis is a bad thing.

 

So pretty much I gotta admit that you've cleared it up, but I still don't think that doing anything with the sole intention of getting a girl is a good thing, it should always be about enjoying yourself. Again, the concept of gaming gives that impression.

 

Pretty much, gaming is enjoying yourself...that's the point...think of it like (referenceomglol) to Runescape. You could be a noob, getting killed all the time, losing drops to other, more leveled players...or you could be a 138, having the skills to get pretty much whatever you want...either way, you enjoy yourself, but the main difference is obvious.

Whatever works for someone else, but I'm not really going to do something just for the sole purpose of getting a girl.

Alright Guys, I've been a long time reader of the tip.it forums, and I've been reading the advice you've all been giving people on here and I've tried some of it but now I've met this girl and she's different from the girls I've read about on here... Some brief info, I'm 16 and a Junior. The girl (ER) is 17 and a Senior, we live 30 minutes apart... but let me rewind a bit.

 

Around mid August I broke up with my girlfriend at the time, and went into a really depressed phase where I was just out of it. I don't think it was as much her being my girlfriend as just being my friend that really hit me hard, but we haven't spoken since August. Literally the week after we broke up she ended up with another guy, she knew it'd hurt me terribly, yet did it anyway making me even more depressed/upset.

 

The weekend after that I was hanging out with a group of friends when I got a text from a really close friend, the girl I'm closest to as a friend who talks with me about everything (Lets call her CJ), that said something like "HEY! How would you like to have a hot date from (City) for homecoming?" So of course I was like "umm... What are you getting at?" So after a few more texts of me saying stuff like "Idk... is she cute? blah blah" The girl's called me (CJ and the other girl who will be ER) and after chatting for a bit I agreed to take this girl to my schools homecoming as a blind date basically. CJ gave this girl my number and that pretty much ended the night asides a few brief, slightly awkward texts.

 

There were a few weeks between the dance and when I agreed to the blind date and I texted with ER ever other day or so, going from a couple of texts to a lot of texts depending on the subject. Brief chatting and all, nothing major. I was thinking around this point that it was basically going to be a one night fling and nothing more so sometimes I kind of vented on her about the ex (Which I heavily regret right now, veeeeery much so)

 

Then came the night of the dance. That was the greatest dance I've ever been too, and the easiest it's ever been for me to talk with a girl. We met in person for the first time around 6 or so and kind of did brief hello/hi/how are you. Did an awkward corsage/boutonniere exchange, took some pictures, then went to a large party. We kind of avoided each other here because we thought it'd be awkward. Anyway, after the before dance party, we went to get into my cousins car (CJ's boyfriend) but he said he was full so I drove. That's when we hit it off, we sang Michael Buble songs the entire way there and just chatted. It all flowed. The dance was the same, we sang to each other, danced, had a great time. Then after the dance we had dinner with a few friends. After dinner we went back to CJ's house, but CJ and my cousin had to drop someone off first so myself and ER were in the car together just waiting. Somehow we ended up making out.

 

So there I was, on a blind date with an incredibly beautiful girl, and we had a blast that night. And we kind of ended the excitement of the night by making out. After that it became kind of awkward between us. The end to this night.

 

After that we didn't text for a while, until about a week or so after I sent her a message and we gradually ended up texting each other again making plans to hang out that seemed to always fall through one way or another... slowly we stopped texting each other again, until one night when CJ was in a school play. I got a text from ER the day before the play asking if I'd go with her and of course I went. Not quite as much fun as the dance had been but it was alright. Anywho, after this texting/talking between me and her died off.

 

Then, I wanna say early December, I had started work towards a music video for Michael Buble's Everything (the song both of us were singing together the night of the dance) and I asked ER if she'd want to do a dance bit for the video (She's been in dance since she was really little) and she got really excited about it. After that, we actually talked on the phone for a bit, it'd start out about the music video and slowly go into other stuff. Once we spoke on the phone for 2 hrs from 12-2 or so am.

 

Since then she's come over to my place three times, twice we hung out a bit then worked on the video. The third time we hung out together watching How I Met Your Mother on a laptop. Now I'm terrible at reading signs from women of interest, god awful in fact. But we were sitting on a couch watching it on my laptop and there was a little bit of space between us and she did this awkward laying her head on her shoulder thing. I couldn't tell if she wanted me to put my arm around her or what (I was so tempted too) but I didn't because I thought it'd be weird if that wasn't her intention. After the HIMYM we we're sitting around bored and got the idea to make a random BS video of us being stupid. After that I took her home.

 

That last hanging out was Tuesday, the 29th. Haven't really text her since then. Shes kind of weird about some stuff too, some days she'll barely text/talk. Other day's she does that all the time. Idk... Damn women are confusing...

 

Basically I'm confused to where I'm at with her. Does she seem to like me as more than a friend or are we just friends? I'm fine either way but I don't know she's different. I mean if she wanted to go out then I'd be all for it but at the same time I don't want to ask her out and make it awkward... If any of you can make any sense of this then hooray! This was more me getting it out there...

 

Edited in after original:

Some stuff that seems to make her a bit different(kind of a basic points thing if you didn't want to read my little story):

- She's not super texty/cally/clingy to anyone. She's really laid back about a lot of stuff

- She seems to be really old fashioned about relationshipesque stuff

- I just can't seem to tell in what way she's interested, the ex was a lot more open about stuff, texting/super flirty/etc (although she's become a bit of a [bleep] :s...)

- She's really really smart, like geniusy (35 on act to sum it up) and its like she really thinks stuff out

 

I don't know guys I'm just lost >.<

[hide]Alright Guys, I've been a long time reader of the tip.it forums, and I've been reading the advice you've all been giving people on here and I've tried some of it but now I've met this girl and she's different from the girls I've read about on here... Some brief info, I'm 16 and a Junior. The girl (ER) is 17 and a Senior, we live 30 minutes apart... but let me rewind a bit.

 

Around mid August I broke up with my girlfriend at the time, and went into a really depressed phase where I was just out of it. I don't think it was as much her being my girlfriend as just being my friend that really hit me hard, but we haven't spoken since August. Literally the week after we broke up she ended up with another guy, she knew it'd hurt me terribly, yet did it anyway making me even more depressed/upset.

 

The weekend after that I was hanging out with a group of friends when I got a text from a really close friend, the girl I'm closest to as a friend who talks with me about everything (Lets call her CJ), that said something like "HEY! How would you like to have a hot date from (City) for homecoming?" So of course I was like "umm... What are you getting at?" So after a few more texts of me saying stuff like "Idk... is she cute? blah blah" The girl's called me (CJ and the other girl who will be ER) and after chatting for a bit I agreed to take this girl to my schools homecoming as a blind date basically. CJ gave this girl my number and that pretty much ended the night asides a few brief, slightly awkward texts.

 

There were a few weeks between the dance and when I agreed to the blind date and I texted with ER ever other day or so, going from a couple of texts to a lot of texts depending on the subject. Brief chatting and all, nothing major. I was thinking around this point that it was basically going to be a one night fling and nothing more so sometimes I kind of vented on her about the ex (Which I heavily regret right now, veeeeery much so)

 

Then came the night of the dance. That was the greatest dance I've ever been too, and the easiest it's ever been for me to talk with a girl. We met in person for the first time around 6 or so and kind of did brief hello/hi/how are you. Did an awkward corsage/boutonniere exchange, took some pictures, then went to a large party. We kind of avoided each other here because we thought it'd be awkward. Anyway, after the before dance party, we went to get into my cousins car (CJ's boyfriend) but he said he was full so I drove. That's when we hit it off, we sang Michael Buble songs the entire way there and just chatted. It all flowed. The dance was the same, we sang to each other, danced, had a great time. Then after the dance we had dinner with a few friends. After dinner we went back to CJ's house, but CJ and my cousin had to drop someone off first so myself and ER were in the car together just waiting. Somehow we ended up making out.

 

So there I was, on a blind date with an incredibly beautiful girl, and we had a blast that night. And we kind of ended the excitement of the night by making out. After that it became kind of awkward between us. The end to this night.

 

After that we didn't text for a while, until about a week or so after I sent her a message and we gradually ended up texting each other again making plans to hang out that seemed to always fall through one way or another... slowly we stopped texting each other again, until one night when CJ was in a school play. I got a text from ER the day before the play asking if I'd go with her and of course I went. Not quite as much fun as the dance had been but it was alright. Anywho, after this texting/talking between me and her died off.

 

Then, I wanna say early December, I had started work towards a music video for Michael Buble's Everything (the song both of us were singing together the night of the dance) and I asked ER if she'd want to do a dance bit for the video (She's been in dance since she was really little) and she got really excited about it. After that, we actually talked on the phone for a bit, it'd start out about the music video and slowly go into other stuff. Once we spoke on the phone for 2 hrs from 12-2 or so am.

 

Since then she's come over to my place three times, twice we hung out a bit then worked on the video. The third time we hung out together watching How I Met Your Mother on a laptop. Now I'm terrible at reading signs from women of interest, god awful in fact. But we were sitting on a couch watching it on my laptop and there was a little bit of space between us and she did this awkward laying her head on her shoulder thing. I couldn't tell if she wanted me to put my arm around her or what (I was so tempted too) but I didn't because I thought it'd be weird if that wasn't her intention. After the HIMYM we we're sitting around bored and got the idea to make a random BS video of us being stupid. After that I took her home.

 

That last hanging out was Tuesday, the 29th. Haven't really text her since then. Shes kind of weird about some stuff too, some days she'll barely text/talk. Other day's she does that all the time. Idk... Damn women are confusing...

 

Basically I'm confused to where I'm at with her. Does she seem to like me as more than a friend or are we just friends? I'm fine either way but I don't know she's different. I mean if she wanted to go out then I'd be all for it but at the same time I don't want to ask her out and make it awkward... If any of you can make any sense of this then hooray! This was more me getting it out there...

[/hide]

 

that was quite a read, and welcome to the forums.

 

One easy (well sounds alot easier when typing it on the internet) thing to do would to be to just simply ask her

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I just dislike the whole concept of gaming because it focuses more on the physical rather than emotional, and basically gets you one night stands and hook-ups rather than a real relationship. And yes, I mean a relationship where you're looking for more than just sex from the other person, and are invested in their emotions and well-being. I've decided after this summer that I would much prefer a long-term relationship to casual hook-ups and one night stands. I just enjoy it way more. Plus the party/club scene is filled with way too many douchebags and guidos (Which are often the same thing).

 

So yeah, reading about girls being referred to as an object that actually pisses me off. You just "do this" and get a relationship. You might get the girl, but you won't keep her. The only way to get a real relationship is to put yourself out there, meet new people, and let them see who you are. Hell, I met my last girlfriend through a ski trip, and my current "girlfriend" through a leadership camp. Quotes are there because it's in that transition phase between friends and girlfriend.

 

Basically, relationships are about feelings, not gaming girls. If you don't want a relationship, game away. But if you are looking for one, just put yourself out in the world. If you don't get a relationship, you're going to enjoy yourself anyways.

 

I'm not saying that gaming won't get you someone to have a relationship with, but that's not the main point of gaming, and gaming doesn't exactly support monogamy. You're still meeting new people. I just think that it's on much less of a personal level.

 

But something I've always wondered, what exactly does oneitis pertain to? It seems as if it's just calling a relationship with someone a bad thing.

 

So many things wrong here. First of all, whenever you're keen on a girl and trying to attract her, you're gaming her whether you're a socially inept nice guy or a pua. We're all 'gaming,' the only difference between me and the next guy is that I have a clue, and I have a wider choice.

 

The goal of gaming isn't to get laid, it's whatever you want it to be. Gaming also isn't restricted to clubs and pubs only.

 

Girls use 'methods' to attract guys, do you think they wear high heals and miniskirts because they are comfortable? Our 'methods' are different because guys and girls are attracted to different things.

 

Girls aren't objectified, it just sounds like that in pick up material because it's an efficient way to get a point across. It's a HB8, rather than a-really-attractive-female-who-is-equal-to-men-and-has-feelings-too-and-isn't-a-sex-object.

 

Oneitis is basically when a guy is obsessed with a girl he has next to no chance with, no other girl will do, and he can't see that his efforts are futile. The more he likes her and the longer he is around her the more he screws it up for himself. It's not an actual relationship.

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Even if the point isn't just getting laid, it definitely still gives the impression that this is the point. And I really did think oneitis just meant you were focusing on one girl, and just ignoring the rest (Ignoring in terms fo attraction, not socially). Now I definitely have to agree that oneitis is a bad thing.

 

So pretty much I gotta admit that you've cleared it up, I definitely don't see gaming as something so shallow any more.

It seemed like Dan was describing general flirting (?) within one word... Trying to get a girl isn't gaming, its 'attracting/flirting' (for a lack of a better word). Gaming is like the "[garden tool]-ish" way of doing it, it seems.

Dan, I've disagreed with you on this point before.

We aren't all "gaming." Trust me. Gaming is a term that's used by you and others to describe your active pursuits of women. When I interact with women, I'm not doing it consciously, you, it seems like, for the most part are.

 

Girls wear high heels and miniskirts because our society places the emphasis on beauty, with beauty being defined as wearing high heels and miniskirts. Sure women make a conscious effort to wear these items, but only because our society convinces them that they need to.

 

And whether it does or not (and my personal opinion is that it is), "gaming" comes across as very objectifying of women. Take the very name for it: "gaming." Something done purely for pleasure, often not taken seriously or with any stake at all. You may say the name is meaningless, but no word or term is ever meaningless. The game basically takes all women and clumps them together in one inescapable category to which they all belong and most definitely have all of these attributes, so this is how you should treat them to get them to cooperate with whatever you want them to do. Sounds a bit like manipulation to me, and personally I'm not okay with that. Yes, we do it subconsciously all the time, but there is a big difference between subconsciously manipulating someone and consciously doing so. Intent and morality exist and interact in both situations.

 

I realize you disagree with everything I just said, and it's quite fruitless to argue with someone over the internet, but I have to make my side known whenever the question comes up.

Aqua, Flyingjj, bedman I was once just like you. We believe in fairy tales, and the wellbeing of human relationships, and we believe that these "PUA" types are whats wrong with the world. Unfortuantly, you will one day face the realization that not everything they teach is full of crap. This is the real world after all. Yes there's the whole true love will find its own way method...but what if you meet your "one" before you are ready? How will you prepare yourself? How do you intend on getting her attracted to you? What makes you think that just because you love her, she feels the same way?

 

What the "PUA" types teach is how to ensure these things. Yes being a direct word for word pick up artist is rather douchey in my opinion, but think of it as practice for the real thing. After all, practice makes perfect ;)

 

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JeremyM

You may have a chance with this girl yet. But please for the love of morailty, don't muck up her relationship with her boyfrend. Let nature take its course. In the mean time, be wary of the ever present "friend zone"

 

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Scorched

I admit, those are some mighty mixed signals you got going there. I enjoyed reading that story, very thorough, very detailed and down right enjoyable. It seems like you're at a cross raods. I think you could actually choose to go either way with her (friend or girlfriend).

 

Supporting the just friends:

1) Awkward after make out

2) lack of contact

3) no physical contact while hanging out (You even admitted regretting not trying anything, but lord almighty if you get the opurtunity to do something DO IT)

Suppporting Girlfriend:

1) Get along well

2) late night phone calls

3) make out

4) "old fashion" could explain odd behavior

5) understanding of eachother

Rpg, I can see what you're talking about, but to be honest, I quite simply am not going to actively pursue a girl I do not already have interest in. And by interest, I mean more than just "Oh hey, she's kinda cute". I mean that I've met the girl, talked to her, and pretty much would consider her my friend. To me, the relationship just feels right. Nothing needs to be forced, I don't make any sacrifices because it will get me towards a goal, I'll make sacrifices because I want to do this for this person.

 

Gaming might be right for some people, but I'm not going to take part in it, or at least for now.

 

And since it's recently come up with me and my friends, what age difference would you say is acceptable? For instance, an 18 year old going out with a 16 year old? Would you say that how the people act and present themselves makes a difference?