Jump to content

12-Apr-2010 - Dungeoneering Skill!


12pure34

Recommended Posts

Even with the reward changes, it's still an awful skill. It's a failure, and not a fail, but a true failure, in concept, desgin, execution, and basically in every manner I can think of outside of graphics. It's an embarrassment.

 

I do like how in the Q&A the people asking about it being a minigame, they say to see the FAQ. The FAQ says they don't think it's a problem so oh well.

 

Proves my point, at least to me, that they really are screwing things up and the redefining of their game is going to continue.

 

Oh, and I'm actually in favor of keeping Dungeoneering strictly in Daemonheim. I like to think of it as a quarantine. Keep it out of the quests and regular play so I can completely ignore it.

 

This response is remarkably similar to those who don't care for summoning. Hmmmm...

 

Your loss, not mine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 2.9k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Why does the shield for rangers soak up ranged damage? And the shield for mages soak up magic? And melee for melee?

 

Shouldnt the melee shield soak up ranged damage, the ranged shield soak up magic, and the magic shield soak up melee?

 

It does.

 

Mele sheild soaks 10% of melee damage and 20% of mage damage.

Range soaks up 10% of range damage and 20% of melee damage.

Mage soaks up 10% of mage damage and 20% of range damage.

 

BUT the damage is only soaked if the hit is higher than 200, so I personally see no practical use for these shields except for boss hunting and possibly hardcore PVPers.

 

Also, don't know if this has been mentioned but here are the speeds of the chaotic weapons.

-Rapier = Scimitar

-Longsword is the same as other longswords

-The maul was not mentioned.

2czeqeh.jpg
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems like the Bonecrusher would be great when going after Jogres or other Champion Scroll droppers. This way, you can just look out for the scroll on the ground, and not worry about anything else.

sigbad0xt.jpg

 

Jack of all trades, master of thieving. 259th to 99 thieving. All stats 75+

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Even with the reward changes, it's still an awful skill. It's a failure, and not a fail, but a true failure, in concept, desgin, execution, and basically in every manner I can think of outside of graphics. It's an embarrassment.

 

I do like how in the Q&A the people asking about it being a minigame, they say to see the FAQ. The FAQ says they don't think it's a problem so oh well.

 

Proves my point, at least to me, that they really are screwing things up and the redefining of their game is going to continue.

 

Oh, and I'm actually in favor of keeping Dungeoneering strictly in Daemonheim. I like to think of it as a quarantine. Keep it out of the quests and regular play so I can completely ignore it.

 

 

Why can success of something not be based totally on whether or not people are enjoying it?

 

Basically, #1 priority to Jagex and me as a customer is enjoyment. I couldn't give two [cabbage]s if it fits in with your skill stereotype or your mini-game stereotype, I enjoy the bloody thing, so do probably millions of others, so it is an outright success is it not?

 

Well, while I do have my beliefs over what is a skill, that isn't totally my argument. I, among many others, also don't enjoy it. Because it is a minigame, because it cannot be reasonably soloed, and then because it's called a skill.

 

Look, I know that RS is a MMO, but for years their niche has been as the MMO that can for casual, solo players. If you read the Q&A, they're moving towards more of a group dynamic, where upon this skill is only the first shot fired. I think that when they push this game into the group play arena it will be completely lost in the shuffle. I wish they'd do they're new MMO they're developing.

 

A big problem is that a few players want this, but those few are very vocal. It's very much an issue where the squeaky wheel gets the oil, but most people don't want this, at least I don't think they do.

 

On another note, I think the popularity of it and it's success that it will have, but I believe only moderate, is because it's f2p. If this skill was for only members most people wouldn't do it and I think it would be an abject failure. The f2pers who are tired of the rest of the game will latch onto it like a leech. As a members skill no one would play it.

 

And for it to achieve true success, they'll have to find a way to integrate the mini-game/skill into the game as a whole and make it relevant to the outside game, besides a few rewards that have been thrown out there.

This website and its contents are copyright © 1999 - 2010 Jagex Ltd.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

Look, I know that RS is a MMO, but for years their niche has been as the MMO that can for casual, solo players. If you read the Q&A, they're moving towards more of a group dynamic, where upon this skill is only the first shot fired. I think that when they push this game into the group play arena it will be completely lost in the shuffle. I wish they'd do they're new MMO they're developing.

 

 

 

I actually agree with this. Runescape just doesn't have the support features to make it any less than clumsy when playing with groups of people, especially groups of strangers. I mean, I guess if the only game you have ever played is Runescape, then the group play would seem alright. But comparing RS to other games, the most user friendly parts of the game are just when you sit back, skill, and have a chat with friends.

 

If the only way to play Dung was in groups, then I would have a much different attitude toward the skill.

Myweponsgood.gif

Need assistance in any of these skills? PM me in game, my private chat is always ON

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

Look, I know that RS is a MMO, but for years their niche has been as the MMO that can for casual, solo players. If you read the Q&A, they're moving towards more of a group dynamic, where upon this skill is only the first shot fired. I think that when they push this game into the group play arena it will be completely lost in the shuffle. I wish they'd do they're new MMO they're developing.

 

 

 

I actually agree with this. Runescape just doesn't have the support features to make it any less than clumsy when playing with groups of people, especially groups of strangers. I mean, I guess if the only game you have ever played is Runescape, then the group play would seem alright. But comparing RS to other games, the most user friendly parts of the game are just when you sit back, skill, and have a chat with friends.

 

If the only way to play Dung was in groups, then I would have a much different attitude toward the skill.

Honestly I wish jagex would have made solo play the most efficient way to train this skill, RS fails at teamwork.

oh well, survival of the fittest.

Naaxi.png
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

Look, I know that RS is a MMO, but for years their niche has been as the MMO that can for casual, solo players. If you read the Q&A, they're moving towards more of a group dynamic, where upon this skill is only the first shot fired. I think that when they push this game into the group play arena it will be completely lost in the shuffle. I wish they'd do they're new MMO they're developing.

 

 

 

I actually agree with this. Runescape just doesn't have the support features to make it any less than clumsy when playing with groups of people, especially groups of strangers. I mean, I guess if the only game you have ever played is Runescape, then the group play would seem alright. But comparing RS to other games, the most user friendly parts of the game are just when you sit back, skill, and have a chat with friends.

 

If the only way to play Dung was in groups, then I would have a much different attitude toward the skill.

 

I personally think you do have to do it in groups to make it worth it, and find the skill slow, mind numbling tedious, and so on and so on.

 

Wep, that's my biggest issue with Jagex right now. Any chance you're a wrestling fan? If you are, there was this one fed called ECW. Very popular, very good niche that they thrived in for years. Once they got too big for their britches and started to try and go mainstream, they got slaughtered. This is how I feel about Runescape.

 

I like that you can no play for a month and come back and the whole game hasn't changed and you are somehow three months behind even though you only didn't play for a month. I like that I can sit in front of a computer and not have to work out with friends what times to be on and where to meet, etc. I like that I can do individual strategy and not have to worry that if my friend messes up, I'm screwed to.

 

I hate being reliant on other people, I have being forced to interact with them through content, I like amiable, congenial, voluntary interaction with people, like while fishing, questing, whatever.

 

I'm gonna miss that once it's gone.

This website and its contents are copyright © 1999 - 2010 Jagex Ltd.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You can solo it perfectly well. You get rewarded for going with a team and having an extra challenge. Where is the harm in that?

Want to be my friend? Look under my name to the left<<< and click the 'Add as friend' button!

zqXeV.jpg

Big thanks to Stevepole for the signature!^

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think you can solo it perfectly well, not in any of the higher level rooms, but that's just my opinion. I wish RS would go in the other direction and be all about solo play. I honestly think that's the way for them to go forward.

 

They would have almost no competition in that area. There is a good market there.

 

But I'm not getting dragged into a big debate about this.

This website and its contents are copyright © 1999 - 2010 Jagex Ltd.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

Look, I know that RS is a MMO, but for years their niche has been as the MMO that can for casual, solo players. If you read the Q&A, they're moving towards more of a group dynamic, where upon this skill is only the first shot fired. I think that when they push this game into the group play arena it will be completely lost in the shuffle. I wish they'd do they're new MMO they're developing.

 

 

 

I actually agree with this. Runescape just doesn't have the support features to make it any less than clumsy when playing with groups of people, especially groups of strangers. I mean, I guess if the only game you have ever played is Runescape, then the group play would seem alright. But comparing RS to other games, the most user friendly parts of the game are just when you sit back, skill, and have a chat with friends.

 

If the only way to play Dung was in groups, then I would have a much different attitude toward the skill.

 

I personally think you do have to do it in groups to make it worth it, and find the skill slow, mind numbling tedious, and so on and so on.

 

Wep, that's my biggest issue with Jagex right now. Any chance you're a wrestling fan? If you are, there was this one fed called ECW. Very popular, very good niche that they thrived in for years. Once they got too big for their britches and started to try and go mainstream, they got slaughtered. This is how I feel about Runescape.

 

 

Its funny that you mention that, because I was a wrestling fan, or maybe more of an ECW fan, until what you are talking about actually happened. Once ECW became WCW (or whatever the hell happened...and then became WWF? Which became WWE?) it just was a bore.

 

One part of Jagex's failure in my opinion is the "official" forums. After years of being out they are still difficult to use, and they are still overwhelmed with garbage. So much effort is being wasted in moderating and "improving" those forums. I was pretty bummed when they came out with their most recent "improvement" to the forums. Which means they still have people working on those things and they still are not good. The only thing they were good for is selling items (which is now obsolete due to the GE) and I suppose they are nice for finding teams/groups.

Myweponsgood.gif

Need assistance in any of these skills? PM me in game, my private chat is always ON

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Its funny that you mention that, because I was a wrestling fan, or maybe more of an ECW fan, until what you are talking about actually happened. Once ECW became WCW (or whatever the hell happened...and then became WWF? Which became WWE?) it just was a bore.

 

One part of Jagex's failure in my opinion is the "official" forums. After years of being out they are still difficult to use, and they are still overwhelmed with garbage. So much effort is being wasted in moderating and "improving" those forums. I was pretty bummed when they came out with their most recent "improvement" to the forums. Which means they still have people working on those things and they still are not good. The only thing they were good for is selling items (which is now obsolete due to the GE) and I suppose they are nice for finding teams/groups.

 

ECW, when it was headed by Paul Heyman, was great. It had it's niche. When it got on TNN and went National, it tried to compete with WCW and WWF and got crushed. In the same way, if Jagex pushed Runescape into that group play market, it'll get creamed by games like WoW.

 

The Official forums, yeah, they suck. Most of that is because they let F2pers post, but it's not all the problem. One issue is that the fan base is too big to have it all centralized. It needs to be decentralized and broken down into smaller ones, like Tip. Of course seeing as how Tip bases their forums around Jagex's desires and commands and are now verging on an official forum extension... oy vey.

This website and its contents are copyright © 1999 - 2010 Jagex Ltd.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think you can solo it perfectly well, not in any of the higher level rooms, but that's just my opinion. I wish RS would go in the other direction and be all about solo play. I honestly think that's the way for them to go forward.

 

They would have almost no competition in that area. There is a good market there.

 

But I'm not getting dragged into a big debate about this.

 

I still like the skill but I do agree it is clumsy. The puzzles and bosses are definitely intended to be played by teams. I'm not saying you CANT solo...just that in the course of a dungeon so much stuff drops, and things of that nature, that it is hard to get a really rewarding experience playing solo.

 

But at the same time, the game is not really designed well enough to play with a team unless you are speaking on ventrillo. It is really complicated and hard to keep track of doors and keys without spending half your time typing. I mean, I duoed some with a friend while we were on ventrillo voice chat, and the experience was pretty good. Its just that if I only played the skill whenever my good friends were a.) online and b.) had time for vent+ dung, I would level the skill pretty slow.

 

There are definitely some clumsy features in this skill that I first attributed to a steep learning curve. But after spending some time with it, some things just arent feeling any better. There needs to come a time when Jagex realizes that this is still a point-and-click game. And some really complicated features are just gonna be too big of an idea for this game.

 

I'm not saying Dung is definitely too big an idea for RS. Its just that it definitely posed a challenge to them, and I dont think that it is completely smoothed out quite yet. I have been feeling some frustration with this skill, but really at this time I cant go into any more details because I need to go to sleep.

Myweponsgood.gif

Need assistance in any of these skills? PM me in game, my private chat is always ON

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think you can solo it perfectly well, not in any of the higher level rooms, but that's just my opinion.

Well, you can. I've gotten down to floor 28 and have no problems soloing any of them.

 

I am fine with there being more rewards for group play -- it is more difficult to get a team together and get in sync to do a dungeon than it is to do solo. I tried a team today and while it was fun to have people to interact with, it was also a nuisance in a number of ways. But I like doing things my own way. :P

 

I'd really like to be able to do larger maps, though. We are supposed to be able to solo medium-sized maps but we can't. I don't see any reason to restrict the dungeon size based on the number of players.

 

It would also be nice to be able to increase the difficulty setting.

Qeltar, aka Charles Kozierok

Webmaster, RuneScoop - Premium RuneScape Information for Expert Players -- Now Free!

Featuring the Ultimate Guide to Dungeoneering -- everything you need to know to get the most of the new skill!

signew2.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd really like to be able to do larger maps, though. We are supposed to be able to solo medium-sized maps but we can't. I don't see any reason to restrict the dungeon size based on the number of players.

 

It would also be nice to be able to increase the difficulty setting.

 

The difficulty setting has absolutely no meaning on solo dungeons. In multiple-player dungeons, the difficulty is the amount of players the game expects that are necessary to solve a single room. With a difficulty of 3, for example, 3 players are needed to solve the emote room, or the switches will trigger way faster than a single player can push them. Setting the difficulty to 2 when playing as a single player would result in completely broken dungeons quite often.

 

And you should definitely see a reason to restrict dungeon size based on the number of players. The servers have a limited amount of space and processing power. Every single dungeon must be kept in memory while it is being played. Let's say the size of a regular dungeon is x, and the size of a medium dungeon is 2x (which it is - medium dungeons are exactly twice the size of small). For 2 players to play a medium dungeon, 2x units of memory are taken up, so each player is only taking up x. If a solo player was allowed to play medium dungeons, he would be taking up at least twice as much memory as any other player.

sigbad0xt.jpg

 

Jack of all trades, master of thieving. 259th to 99 thieving. All stats 75+

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Even with the reward changes, it's still an awful skill. It's a failure, and not a fail, but a true failure, in concept, desgin, execution, and basically in every manner I can think of outside of graphics. It's an embarrassment.

 

Just wondering, are you saying that this concept of dungeon exploration should be not be implemented, or could have been implemented in a better way?

Zepheras.png

 

"Do you really want to go back to the time when Falador was grey, lesser demon look like goats, dragons look like cows, hellhound look like cats and your character stands as stiff as a statue?"

 

-F1775

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For anyone who has read the "Live New Skill Q&A" thread on the RSOF, you will know what I mean when I say the following is Jagex's new tagline:

 

Jagex ltd: We have no official plans to do anything, and unfortunately we are currently discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer.

archsupportei2.png

outsanitysig1jc0.png

|2,300+ Total|138 Combat|12 Lvl 99 Skills|99 Slayer|blogbutton.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For anyone who has read the "Live New Skill Q&A" thread on the RSOF, you will know what I mean when I say the following is Jagex's new tagline:

 

Jagex ltd: We have no official plans to do anything, and unfortunately we are currently discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer.

 

Oh for real? I thought it was: This is our game [bleep]s, and we have no plans to let your input influence our decisions. Now go [bleep] yourselves you [bleep]s.

 

Just saying...

Stellactic.gif
Link to comment
Share on other sites

For anyone who has read the "Live New Skill Q&A" thread on the RSOF, you will know what I mean when I say the following is Jagex's new tagline:

 

Jagex ltd: We have no official plans to do anything, and unfortunately we are currently discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer.

 

Oh for real? I thought it was: This is our game [bleep]s, and we have no plans to let your input influence our decisions. Now go [bleep] yourselves you [bleep]s.

 

Just saying...

 

That is their unofficial tagline they use around the office, silly.

 

Oh and if anyone is doubting me on why I feel this way, here are just a few of the quotes from the mods themselves:

 

"We have no official plans for adding content unlocked via Dungeoneering outside of Daemonheim, but it is a possibility. "

"Unfortunately we can't give you any ETAs on the second batch of rewards. "

"Whether or not you will meet Bilrach would unfortunately be too big of a spoiler for me to answer. "

"At the moment, it doesn't look like it. "

"We don't have any official plans at the moment, so only time can tell what will be included in the future. "

"No plans for this yet, sorry. "

"Unfortunately I can't answer most of this question as it would be discussing future updates.. but I guess that is an answer in itself?"

"We'll see."

"A good question... and one I shall be asking my superiors very shortly."

"Probably not straight away, but who knows what the future holds?"

"We have no official plans for this at the moment, but there are lots of possibilities."

 

Notice anything? Yeah, occasionally you get an answer out of them, but a lot of this supposed Q&A session is a bunch of wishy-washy, evasive tactical wording. They appear to answer your question but really all they've done is talked for a few sentences and looped you back to the start, making you feel like you got something out of them but really did not. If you cannot answer a question, just simply don't answer it! Don't waste your time and ours by spending your precious (what was it, two hours?) time beating around the bush?

 

I'm also not happy with the fact they don't have official plans to release any dungeoneering content outside of Daemonheim. What the hell is the POINT of this "skill," if I can never use it outside of this dungeon where I don't even get to keep what I loot?

 

Poor designing. I can make better skills than Jagex can.

archsupportei2.png

outsanitysig1jc0.png

|2,300+ Total|138 Combat|12 Lvl 99 Skills|99 Slayer|blogbutton.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For anyone who has read the "Live New Skill Q&A" thread on the RSOF, you will know what I mean when I say the following is Jagex's new tagline:

 

Jagex ltd: We have no official plans to do anything, and unfortunately we are currently discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer.

 

Isn't it more like:

We don't have any thing more planned but the things we already have planned, which we may or may not actually have planned. After what we may or may not have planned, we may or may not have more things planned, but post any ideas here, and we may or may not think about the things you think we should have had plans about (like, you know, other dungeons!!). Also, we may or may not be discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer in an undisclosed location. Also, we have our heads so far up our new skill that even we are suprised that we can still use a computer.

 

(even I had to read it twice to keep why I said straight)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For anyone who has read the "Live New Skill Q&A" thread on the RSOF, you will know what I mean when I say the following is Jagex's new tagline:

 

Jagex ltd: We have no official plans to do anything, and unfortunately we are currently discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer.

 

Isn't it more like:

We don't have any thing more planned but the things we already have planned, which we may or may not actually have planned. After what we may or may not have planned, we may or may not have more things planned, but post any ideas here, and we may or may not think about the things you think we should have had plans about (like, you know, other dungeons!!). Also, we may or may not be discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer in an undisclosed location. Also, we have our heads so far up our new skill that even we are suprised that we can still use a computer.

 

(even I had to read it twice to keep why I said straight)

 

Totally agree with that one! Read my edit on my above post too. Pretty much sums up everything I took away from this Q&A in a few simple quotes. Ridiculous!

archsupportei2.png

outsanitysig1jc0.png

|2,300+ Total|138 Combat|12 Lvl 99 Skills|99 Slayer|blogbutton.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The difficulty setting has absolutely no meaning on solo dungeons. In multiple-player dungeons, the difficulty is the amount of players the game expects that are necessary to solve a single room. With a difficulty of 3, for example, 3 players are needed to solve the emote room, or the switches will trigger way faster than a single player can push them. Setting the difficulty to 2 when playing as a single player would result in completely broken dungeons quite often.

Well, it could be made to affect other aspects of gameplay, such as boss difficulty. As a solo player I don't find any of the levels really all that challenging, just time consuming. It would be nice to face a higher combat level boss and get more XP as a result -- less grinding.

 

And you should definitely see a reason to restrict dungeon size based on the number of players. The servers have a limited amount of space and processing power.

That's true, I hadn't thought about that angle. Though it would be at least partially offset by having to generate fewer dungeons and so forth.

 

They did say we should be able to solo medium maps, though, did they not? But you can't.

 

Isn't it more like:

We don't have any thing more planned but the things we already have planned, which we may or may not actually have planned. After what we may or may not have planned, we may or may not have more things planned, but post any ideas here, and we may or may not think about the things you think we should have had plans about (like, you know, other dungeons!!). Also, we may or may not be discussing the possibility of giving you a straight answer in an undisclosed location. Also, we have our heads so far up our new skill that even we are suprised that we can still use a computer.

LOL.

 

It's like when you watch those law shows and some executive is being depositioned with his lawyer sitting next to him. Any time the other side asks a question where the answer would actually be meaningful, the lawyer either tells the guy not to reply, or responds with something like "we can neither confirm nor deny that". :mrgreen:

 

It's a pathetic but predictable consequence of a company growing into a large corporation.

Qeltar, aka Charles Kozierok

Webmaster, RuneScoop - Premium RuneScape Information for Expert Players -- Now Free!

Featuring the Ultimate Guide to Dungeoneering -- everything you need to know to get the most of the new skill!

signew2.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It has been their attitude for a long time not to tell us about future updates? Sorry but it is nothing new.

Want to be my friend? Look under my name to the left<<< and click the 'Add as friend' button!

zqXeV.jpg

Big thanks to Stevepole for the signature!^

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.