Barrows - Rise of the Six

[Saradomin_Mage]

Oh yeah:

 

Q: Will the "degrade to 0" mechanic be used with other Tier 90 items like boots and gloves or is it for helm, plate and leg slots only?

 

Mod Timbo: Boots and gloves from tier 90 onwards will also degrade to dust just like Tectonic, Sirenic and the new Malevolent.

From the FAQ, not sure if you've seen it. Dunno how to feel about this.

[Golvellius]

The game has been broke since God Wars and coinshare inflation followed up by waves of bots. (You just have to ignore the glaring problems if you want to keep playing.)

The official plan to complete runescape in as little time as possible and with as little fun as possible is to camp the lastest bosses 24-7 and then buy skills.

That's been going on for 5 years now and spawning armies of elitist who preach efficiency crap until they get banned for cashing out or demonstrating that cheating is the highest form of efficiency.

[Alg]

?

 

Who said it couldn't be fun to do whatever you have to do for t99 gear.

The trouble is the part that comes before, though. Boss hunting is fun, but getting to the point where you can isn't, and it has more to do with the way the game is designed than anything else. We're still playing with a lot of content built around Classic-to-early-RS2's balance and endgame, rather than today's boss-heavy one. You spend hundreds of hours getting skills (As it was when getting a skill to 99 was the end goal) to spend hundreds of hours getting gear (which is the end goal today), and the first half of that may as well be a different game entirely. You can argue that there's a lot of content throughout most of the game, but pretty much everything that isn't from 90-99 is filler.

 

...Maybe part of it is the level progression? You just don't spend enough time at low levels for there to be any meaningful content there, and high-level content takes long enough to get that they aren't balancing the game with it in mind. Perhaps if training skills took the same amount of time but was more evenly distributed? Then throw in the same kinds of content at every level, so there isn't such a massive jump from skilling to bossing?

 

I'm sure that this explanation isn't doing the idea justice: generally, you'll spend more time as a low-level, but there will be more to do at low levels, and it gives them a chance to balance the game so that upgrading from one tier to the next doesn't multiply the required time by a factor of 40 for a minimal reward. Maybe it will still take 400 hours to get T99 gear, but that time could be spread out throughout the rest of the game: say, the jump from T95 to T99 would be 100 hours, because you did the other 300 at earlier levels. It'll still be grindy, but players will feel like their grinding is going somewhere.

 

Maybe it's just me, but I've found 'smaller' goals less daunting for this reason. The end goal is the same, it's just broken into manageable chunks. As it is, you're pushed to spend a fairly heavy amount of time on the game all at once, without much chance to break it up as you grow.

[Thus]

 

 

?

 

Who said it couldn't be fun to do whatever you have to do for t99 gear.

Don't even bother reasoning with them.  This is just another argument about time/effort.  Funny how its the same people in every topic now still complaining about the same things.

 

Face it, Jagex has a business model, one that is shared with nearly every other MMO. Giving people max equipment quickly has been shown to hurt more than help people to keep playing the game over an extended period, as if you have max equipment what do you have to strive for?  An example of a game I played that is like this is Terraria.  Although it is not an MMO, you could play online with people and host servers.  And although the creators of the game didn't exactly GIVE people the items (they were items you had to make or find and it took a while), it was easy to hack into the game and spawn the best stuff for yourself. But people said "Half the game is about creating cool stuff so no big deal right? They can now use those items to have more fun right?" They were so wrong.  So what happened? People got all the best stuff, got bored, and stopped playing even though there was the creation aspect of the game. No one explored generated worlds anymore because there was no point to doing it. For over a year, playership dropped dramatically.  Recently, an update spiked playership because it added about 100 new items, but then it dropped again for the same reason.

 

Jagex can make things less rare, sure, but then you will be statistically less likely to play their game.  And because you are still playing their game right now even though you are complaining, they don't see a reason to change it.  People haven't quit because seismics are too expensive, they quit for other reasons.

 

Also funny it's always the same conceited wagons who argue "U just 2 lazy L, grind frost dragons 4 400 hrs or gtfo plocks"

 

What you fail to grasp is that "we" are not advocating an easy button. Grind is necessary for the survival of an MMO, indeed. But there needs to be BALANCE. If items are too easy to get, people don't have any goals and quickly become bored. However, if items are too far out of reach, the same result occurs. Goals have to be realistic or else people simply become discouraged and give up.

 

How do you try to make a mockery of your opponent when you have no convincing argument? Make them look stupid, put words in their mouth, misspell them purposefully.  Not going to go to that level of immaturity, thanks.

 

Anyway, on to the second point.  The fact that you and people like you are still playing and trying to achieve something even though they are out of reach means that Jagex hit the sweet spot and isn't going to change it.  If everyone who complained about things being too expensive actually stopped playing instead of complaining while playing, then they would change it.  But there is no need to change it in Jagex's eyes, which is the point I was making.

[Blutters]

I tried to make this point before but I think perhaps it was overlooked.

 

Don't you think that it's just a tad asinine for this particular case - Seismics - to be so much further "out of reach" than the other T90 weapons, when part of the point of EOC was to reach relative balance between the combat styles?

If Seismics were level 95 or 99 it might be understandable, but they're level 90 and therefore on par in strength with Drygores and Ascensions, but not of a similar difficulty to obtain.

Essentially, the KK doesn't take that long to score a kill but is quite dangerous and requires a team, while the Ascension dungeon could be considered considerably easier as you can solo the bosses with relatively consistent danger but the drops take much longer to accumulate.

The effort of those two endeavors "averages out" to be quite a bit more similar to each other than to Vorago, which practically requires already having very high level gear, a good team, and takes a long time to kill.

All I'm saying is that the drop rate at Vorago for Seismics should be such that the relative amount of effort it takes to attain level 90 Magic weapons is similar to that of the other two styles.

 

The prices are irrelevant when considering fairness between styles because prices change but difficulty doesn't balance itself. It would be pretty damn neat if it did, though... Can you imagine Vorago's strength scaling down because his drops are worth the most, thereby incentivizing more people to fight him, relative to the other bosses? Eventually his drops would likely reach a point that they were similar in price with the other T90 weapons, so people would quit fighting him in favor of the alternatives, which could also scale in power. It may sound counter-intuitive to reward someone more for an easier boss, but it would be a far more dynamic system than we have now. It would also discourage farming just one boss and might actually keep prices more stable.

[strilmus]

once again, if gear is the end instead of the means, then we're losing the entire point of having gear

 

if you're going to keep defending that belief, we don't really have to discuss anything else

[Aiel]

I think we need to alternate gear from skilling and ports-like-things and from bosses (so T90 is from bosses, T93 would be from skilling, T95 from bosses, T97 from skilling, and T99 from bosses). This allows people to have both ultra-rare status items that are the BIS, as well as allowing your average high level to have high level gear without grinding for 100s of hours, but leaves room for improvement/more grinding. The problem with seismics right now is that there is no reasonable alternative to seismics. You have to drop down ten tiers for another weapon, and it's still expensive. 

[Quyneax]

I think we need to alternate gear from skilling and ports-like-things and from bosses (so T90 is from bosses, T93 would be from skilling, T95 from bosses, T97 from skilling, and T99 from bosses). This allows people to have both ultra-rare status items that are the BIS, as well as allowing your average high level to have high level gear without grinding for 100s of hours, but leaves room for improvement/more grinding. The problem with seismics right now is that there is no reasonable alternative to seismics. You have to drop down ten tiers for another weapon, and it's still expensive.

No, status items can be completely cosmetics, as their purpose is only the fact that you own them. Giving them another purpose is like giving a cosmetic override a purpose.

 

There should be many more pets like the bobbleheads and there should be multi-billion-gp overrides, there should be player-owned castles with a hundred guards and there should be tradable rares, and finally there should be cheap, best-in-slot equipment with high stat requirements in crafting skills.

[Wkw]

The amount of time that it takes to get ports is the ideal amount of time it takes to earn something high end... It takes 3-4 months to get a full set of ports if you have ALL the required stats, if you play efficiently and don't just check once a day.

[strilmus]

yep, and it has a bunch of other things you can also get, which happen as you progress into the activity, with varying uses, and in the middle of it, all of these silly things to play with that don't necessarily impact progress besides your chance of success, but they're all in of themselves engrossing

 

gee, it's almost like they designed it like something i'd rather be doing instead of a skill or a thousand fruitless fights with the same opponent, which is probably why jagex had to act like they hated it irrationally in order to appease their invisible boss, like flash powder factory and bandos throne room

[Yoko Kurama]

Your reasoning at the end there about old bosses and "wellfare" gear is a little off. All of that gear was close to best in game when those bosses came out, not "wellfare" gear. 

 

Not in all the cases. But even in the cases where your point is true -- it only reinforces what I am saying because in those cases the best gear was so cheap that it was essentially welfare gear cheap.

[Yoko Kurama]

4 back-to-back shields today. 2 on trip, and another 2 on the one after... And 2 of them were merciless.

[Alg]

 

Your reasoning at the end there about old bosses and "wellfare" gear is a little off. All of that gear was close to best in game when those bosses came out, not "wellfare" gear. 

Not in all the cases. But even in the cases where your point is true -- it only reinforces what I am saying because in those cases the best gear was so cheap that it was essentially welfare gear cheap.

But you still needed to be in the 1% to get any kills. It was so accessible that anyone could do it, but if you couldn't out-muscle whoever else was in the world you weren't getting any kills. That really didn't start to loosen up until part of the way through the Nex era, if not until they released instanced worlds.

 

Sure, gear wasn't an issue, but I'd think that this is a better mechanic than one that fostered a lot of the social problems that you (and other Truthscape transplants, self included) tend to endlessly rant about. :-P

[Yoko Kurama]

 

 

Your reasoning at the end there about old bosses and "wellfare" gear is a little off. All of that gear was close to best in game when those bosses came out, not "wellfare" gear. 

Not in all the cases. But even in the cases where your point is true -- it only reinforces what I am saying because in those cases the best gear was so cheap that it was essentially welfare gear cheap.

But you still needed to be in the 1% to get any kills. It was so accessible that anyone could do it, but if you couldn't out-muscle whoever else was in the world you weren't getting any kills. That really didn't start to loosen up until part of the way through the Nex era, if not until they released instanced worlds.

 

Sure, gear wasn't an issue, but I'd think that this is a better mechanic than one that fostered a lot of the social problems that you (and other Truthscape transplants, self included) tend to endlessly rant about. :-P

 

 

World crashing didn't become a problem until about 2009 after the bonus weekends proliferated 96 Herblore/Summoning -- thousands of people got it for 50% price over the course of days. After that, crashing worlds became the norm.

 

Edit: also with the (much welcomed) move towards instances, crashing seems more and more to be a problem of the past.

[helring]

 

 

 

Your reasoning at the end there about old bosses and "wellfare" gear is a little off. All of that gear was close to best in game when those bosses came out, not "wellfare" gear. 

Not in all the cases. But even in the cases where your point is true -- it only reinforces what I am saying because in those cases the best gear was so cheap that it was essentially welfare gear cheap.

But you still needed to be in the 1% to get any kills. It was so accessible that anyone could do it, but if you couldn't out-muscle whoever else was in the world you weren't getting any kills. That really didn't start to loosen up until part of the way through the Nex era, if not until they released instanced worlds.

 

Sure, gear wasn't an issue, but I'd think that this is a better mechanic than one that fostered a lot of the social problems that you (and other Truthscape transplants, self included) tend to endlessly rant about. :-P

 

 

World crashing didn't become a problem until about 2009 after the bonus weekends proliferated 96 Herblore/Summoning -- thousands of people got it for 50% price over the course of days. After that, crashing worlds became the norm.

 

 

Yea, I remember going pretty early into release and world crashing happened but not too often.

[Urza285]

Yoko I'm not going to lie - you and your team are badasses. I just wish I could get te money up to buy virtus wand and ascension crossbow. Then I could wellfair the OH. I have all the nex armours and ports gear as well as BIS items for everything else. Sooo frustrating seeing both those items go up 20-40m each since ROTS release.

[Yoko Kurama]

Yoko I'm not going to lie - you and your team are badasses. I just wish I could get te money up to buy virtus wand and ascension crossbow. Then I could wellfair the OH. I have all the nex armours and ports gear as well as BIS items for everything else. Sooo frustrating seeing both those items go up 20-40m each since ROTS release.

 

A chaotic staff will work just as well. Heck, once (and only then) someone on my team had dual Ahrim's and he made it work...

[Yoko Kurama]

Just got 5th shield of the day (3 merciless, 1 malevolent, 1 melee). A fun day.

[Urza285]

Do you really need dw magic? I mean will it make it insanely easier?

 

Ever since vw was classed as t80 I've been asking myself why I would go to such extreme costs for a t80 mh/dw weapon. And to make it worse is the release of other tier t90 items with pricing considerably close pricing when comparing vw/b to mh asc xbow. I would feel more justified buying a mh asc xbow or hunting my own from bought keys.

[Yoko Kurama]

Do you really need dw magic? I mean will it make it insanely easier?

 

Ever since vw was classed as t80 I've been asking myself why I would go to such extreme costs for a t80 mh/dw weapon. And to make it worse is the release of other tier t90 items with pricing considerably close pricing when comparing vw/b to mh asc xbow. I would feel more justified buying a mh asc xbow or hunting my own from bought keys.

 

Ascension would be definitely preferably but they are at 530-540M. I am using Ascensions lately, but for the first few days I did Dual Virtus. I have seen people do it with Chaotic Staff, but you will need to find a team that will be okay with that. 

[Urza285]

Even with cs, full virtus, asn, seers I? I've really been irritated because I know I need to farm for so much cash just to get mh asc xbow.

 

I wouldn't mind going on some learner runs too.

[Yoko Kurama]

And here comes 6th shield (another Merciless). The day that just keeps on giving.

[Urza285]

And here comes 6th shield (another Merciless). The day that just keeps on giving.

Dang teach me lol.

 

Mind adding me?

[V O R K]

Son I am jelly

[Ambler]

And here comes 6th shield (another Merciless). The day that just keeps on giving.

Why am I not in your teams. Add me. :lol: